Queen :: Charts & Sales History

[MJDangerous]

Come on HUR, CD sales were nothing until late 80's. Look at the share of the album market in UK :

Year CD%
1984 0,9% of the album market
1985 2,78%
1986 6,45%
1987 12,55%
1988 18,22%

In Spain, the % was for sure lower. Even in UK, the CD hasn't reached 50% of the market before 1992.

Knowing that, do you still believe those Spanish figures are CD only sales ?

We haven't the exact date of the 2xP cert for PC, but we know that it was the last 2xP award of the year.

[HUR]

Look, how can AKOM be at 200k+ on CD alone, while it was certified Platinum at the end of its run on an era when CD sales were close to 0 in Spain. How can that be possible seriously?

But nobody said they sold over 200k on first year alone. The problem is that I havenīt seen any evidence about CDs being nothing back in the second half of the 80īs. Based on your annual figures, which indicate what share of the market each format represented during years like 1995 or 1996, it would look like cassettes and vinyls (adding them together) were as much as a 30% of the market or so.

Maybe, back in the 80īs, it was a bit like 50% and 50% for each formats, with cassettes having a slight dominance over the CD.

"A kind of magic" reached #2 with 37 weeks inside the top 30 between 1986 and 1987, thatīs the typical running of an album that sells like 150-175k upon release. Asumming the album sold like that on first year, CDs were probably just 70-80k or so. And maybe the album continued to sell on catalog (mainly on CD format exclusively) until it reached 207,000 copies on that format alone, which would be roughly 300,000 overall (including a good share of sales achieved on cassettes and vinyls on its initial chart performance).

Do you know the accurate date of certification for the album "Platinum collection" in Spain?. It went double platinum in 2004, but I donīt know the accurate date, do you?.

[MJDangerous]

About Led Zeppelin, check again you didnīt count several compilation and box set. Iīm not kojing, really.

Those few compilations are irrevelant, they haven't even charted and sold for sur less than 100k all together in Spain.

And no, I'm not more generous for others than for Queen.

Look, how can AKOM be at 200k+ on CD alone, while it was certified Platinum at the end of its run on an era when CD sales were close to 0 in Spain. How can that be possible seriously?

[HUR]

About Led Zeppelin, check again you didnīt count several compilations and box set. Iīm not joking, really.

[HUR]

When I say not among the "very top sellers" I mean not among the 2/3 biggest acts ever, the Beatles or Pink Floyd are. Just like in France, they are probably among the second half of the top 10 best selling foreign acts ever (which still huge obviously!).

Yes, but because (for some reason) you do much more "generous" estimates for acts like The Beatles, Pink Floyd, or Michael Jackson, or Madonna, than for acts like Queen. So obviously, according to you, Queen will never be one of the top or very top acts ever in markets like those ones.

Man, you know the respect I have for you and I have said many times, but we are talking about Queen, not about the Parchis or Panic at the disco. Just a joke.

But really, Queen have sold more records than any other band in the world apart from The Beatles and The Rolling stones on a worldwide basis. Outside North America (USA and Canada put together), they sold more albums and records than any band other than Beatles, and virtually as many albums as Madonna or Michael Jackson (!). Actually, what other act apart from The Beatles that you know about has had similar sales Michael in some many markets like Queen did.

[MJDangerous]

But you said the figures reported by EMI were all comprehensive?. And EMI claimed 3,200,000 copies sold for Queen, just for CDs which are, accordin to you, for all formats. So if they didnīt sell 5 million like I estimate, nor 3,2 M (posted by EMI), then how much have they sold according to you?. And now, you say that Queen arenīt one of the top sellers. Well, like it or not, they are. I understand your comment, how can you seriously compare their popularity in USA to Spain?. In Spain, Queen had at least 4 number one albums, spent more weeks in the charts than any other band and rank high in the all-time chart compiled by Davidalic. In USA, they are nowhere near that.

As for Led Zeppelin, they count roughly 2,1 M but without compilations and box sets. With all their catalog properly added, they should be at 2,6 M as I said, which isnīt that far.

But well, again. Do what you want.

When I say not among the "very top sellers" I mean not among the 2/3 biggest acts ever, the Beatles or Pink Floyd are. Just like in France, they are probably among the second half of the top 10 best selling foreign acts ever (which still huge obviously!).

You shouldn't go by point systems, they always give to much points for long runners, rather than big ponctual sellers. Queen albums never sold huge on a single week until late 91. Most of their albums peaked top 5 during low months of sales.

Again, I have Led Zep at 2.1m with ALL their albums.

And I can't give my figure about Queen in Spain, as I said I can't give the result before doing the study

[HUR]

Also you accepted the figures for Madonna, printed on that magazine back in 2005 (without any serious source), and now you dispute what Queenīs record company claimed in Spain. Sorry...

[HUR]

BTW, I do not say that Queen sold 3.2m in Spain. I haven't update their figures and won't comment results not even compiled by now. But to think that Queen are especialy huge in Spain is wrong. Just like in France or in the US, they reached huge sales with their hits packages and very decent sales all over their career to cum a pretty good figure, but they aren't among the very top sellers like they are in Netherlands or in Germany.

But you said the figures reported by EMI were all comprehensive?. And EMI claimed 3,200,000 copies sold for Queen, just for CDs which are, according to you, for all formats. So if they didnīt sell 5 million like I estimate, nor 3,2 M (posted by EMI), then how much have they sold according to you?. And now, you say that Queen arenīt one of the top sellers. Well, like it or not, they are. I understand your comment, how can you seriously compare their popularity in USA to Spain?. In Spain, Queen had at least 4 number one albums, spent more weeks in the charts than any other band and rank high in the all-time chart compiled by Davidalic. In USA, they are nowhere near that.

And you mention that I donīt know how big Floyd are in latin markets of Europe, while I have been the first here in pointing it out their huge dominance. But the fact is that I havenīt seen any evidence about them being bigger than Queen in neither Spain nor Portugal (although in France and Italy, they are).

As for Led Zeppelin, they count roughly 2,1 M but without compilations and box sets. With all their catalog properly added, they should be at 2,6 M as I said, which isnīt that far.

But well, again. Do what you want.

[MJDangerous]

Wish We Were Here 20 weeks at #1
Animals 8 weeks
The Wall 15 weeks

That said it all. Queen GHII was #1 for 8 weeks and sold close to 700k. When it was #1 I do not doubt it was selling more than Queen albums, but still, with such massive runs at 1 and giant catalog sales, that's not a surprise to see them that high. You can't imagine how incredibly big Floyd are in Spain/Portugal, seriously, that's insane.

Queen, despite being of course a big act, were nowhere near Floyd there. None of their studio albums reached #1 until MIH. Except ANATO, their 70's albums performed very poorly.

Queen and Pink Floyd in Spain is almost the same story as both bands in France, you just can't compare them, even if Queen still a big alltime act.

I counted back my Led Zep figures and counted less than 2,1m.

BTW, I do not say that Queen sold 3.2m in Spain. I haven't update their figures and won't comment results not even compiled by now. But to think that Queen are especialy huge in Spain is wrong. Just like in France or in the US, they reached huge sales with their hits packages and very decent sales all over their career to cum a pretty good figure, but they aren't among the very top sellers like they are in Netherlands or in Germany.

[HUR]

But you cited the figure for "Greatest hits 2", thatīs the reason why I talked about it. And why do you call it "unkown"?. It was a massive seller all over Europe. In Spain, it was #1 during 2 weeks and was high on the charts during the Christmas month back in 1995. I have already posted the mails, Nelson, take a look at my previous posts. We are making up these figures.

I talked about email "address" not about the email "message", in order to check the source.

Mate, you are a nightmare, sorry. Do me favour, believe what you want. Why donīt you give a mail address to ask for Queen certifications in Honk Kong?. When you do that I will give you the address...

[HUR]

An album like Delicate Sound Of Thunder may be a very bad catalog seller in comparison to Dark Side, but it sold for sure like 5 times more than an average Queen album in catalog, and as much as an album like ANATO.

But at least, "A night at the opera" re-entered the charts twice, in 2005 and 2007. I think that your comment is a bit over-pretentious.

I have your Led Zeppelin sales estimation, and they all account for as much as 2,600,000 (roughly) in your site. Maybe typo mistakes?. I know they are very successful in Spain, I didnīt dispute that, just in case that you understood that from my comment.

Also, accoprding to you, it looks like Pink Floyd sold like 5 million and Michael roughly 4 million over there. Yet, you say that Queen sold 3,2 (as claimed by EMI) and nothing more. Can that be possible?. With all the respect I have for you, but have Floyd had such a big lead over Queen in Spain?. Look at your figures:

-The dark side of te moon: 600,000
-Wish you were here: 900,000
-Animals: 500,000
-The wall: 1,000,000

I understand they are huge, but with those four albums alone, they sold as much as Queen with their entite catalog according to you. The same for Michael Jackson too.

But well, you have already decided it like you said, so I donīt understany why you post your comment here, if you wonīt change your mind. Of course, it is your work and you have to do whatever you want. In the end, there will be a lot of effor put into it as always, and thatīs what we should care about. Surely, it will be quality work as usual with yours...

Another point I can raise, though, is that the "Platinum collection" was certified twice platinum in 2004 for sales of 200,000 copies. I donīt know the accurate date, but on the figures reported by EMI for it (197,000 copies), assuming they are comprehensive, that isnīt quite enough for that award but just close. Those figures are from 20th december 2004 by the way.

[nelson]

But you cited the figure for "Greatest hits 2", thatīs the reason why I talked about it. And why do you call it "unkown"?. It was a massive seller all over Europe. In Spain, it was #1 during 2 weeks and was high on the charts during the Christmas month back in 1995. I have already posted the mails, Nelson, take a look at my previous posts. We are making up these figures.

I talked about email "address" not about the email "message", in order to check the source.

[MJDangerous]

Hur, I don't know which figures you checked, but obviously not mines. I have Led Zeppelin at just 2m, which is much less than Queen. If you tell about average album sales then well, I do not see the problem of an average Zep album selling as much as an average Queen album.

You should realise that Queen studio albums sold poorly in catalog in comparison to such giants. Even Houses of the holy of Led Zep 3 were certified Gold for sales of the remasters only. In the last 15 years, they both sold 100k+ in Spain. They were huge in Spain, topping charts as early as in 1969.

An album like Delicate Sound Of Thunder may be a very bad catalog seller in comparison to Dark Side, but it sold for sure like 5 times more than an average Queen album in catalog, and as much as an album like ANATO.

[HUR]

'Greatest Hits 1' hasn't sold 182k only, since figures seem to start in 85/86. The re-release of it was certified Gold in 92 and I'm pretty much sure this figure concerns that release. And again, almost 200k on catalog alone in Spain IS huge ! Except a few expections, the top sellers sell like 500k in Spain. To sell 200k in Spain is like 600k or so in France, just to show how big that is.
Yes I think that the ones you quoted (at least Pink Floyd, Jackson, Dire Straits and Madonna) were bigger than Queen album sales-wise. If you look at Dire Straits, they cumulated 34 weeks at #1 in Spain. Pink Floyd 44 weeks.
Still, Madonna or U2 aren't much higher than 3 million. They are at the same level of Queen, which just shows how huge 3.2 million is already.

But you talk about weeks at #1, which is a good idea. But also, why donīt you see the charts compile by Davidalic based on points, where Queen are totally ahead of Madonna, Dire Straits, Pink Floyd, Michael Jackson?. That also may serve as a gauge. Only old acts with loads of albums that started their career back in 60īs are ahead of Queen over there. Also remember that Floyd achieved the bulk of their points between the 70īs and early 80īs where the market wasnīt that huge, whereas Queen achieved theirs mainly during the period between 1984 and 1995 with a much more "health" market.

I donīt know what is so difficult to accept, personally. For example, you list "Of the wall" at 300,000 (!), while it didnīt chart in Spain as far as Iīm concerned, even you have "Delicate sound of thunder", which barely made the top ten, at something like 200,000. Yet your estimation for their "Greatest hits 1" is just 200,000 or so.

According to you, Led Zeppelin sold nearly the same as Queen too, I checked your figures.

If Queen are overestimated, then I think that you are overestimating other acts too.

Also, nobody claimed that all their studio albums sold 300k, did I?. I only think that "A night at the opera", "A kind of magic" and "Made in heaven" are at that mark, but no other.

[MJDangerous]

Hur,

I do not dispute figures "for Queen" but figures that look irrealistic, which isn't the same. For example, I dispute the figure of 400k sold by Thriller in Chile, simply because this figure isn't realistic. Trying to answer to all your questions (I do not quote the message to not flood the thread) :

Spain - If you look at figures, they are all ahead of certifications. Many awards were achieved several months after the release but still figures are easily ahead of them, that's why I find it hard to believe that a third or even half of sales still missing.

Queen HAVE sold in huge numbers. For example, those sales in Spain are already massive. They are so many albums that topped charts several weeks and were certified barely Platinum months later, sales in the 300k range for all their studio albums would be insane. If you compare chart performances/certifications of other artists in Spain, those figures of Queen are already pretty high.

'Greatest Hits 1' hasn't sold 182k only, since figures seem to start in 85/86. The re-release of it was certified Gold in 92 and I'm pretty much sure this figure concerns that release. And again, almost 200k on catalog alone in Spain IS huge ! Except a few expections, the top sellers sell like 500k in Spain. To sell 200k in Spain is like 600k or so in France, just to show how big that is.
Yes I think that the ones you quoted (at least Pink Floyd, Jackson, Dire Straits and Madonna) were bigger than Queen album sales-wise. If you look at Dire Straits, they cumulated 34 weeks at #1 in Spain. Pink Floyd 44 weeks.
Still, Madonna or U2 aren't much higher than 3 million. They are at the same level of Queen, which just shows how huge 3.2 million is already.

In Netherland you are probably right, after looking at figures it looks like they are about CDs only.

About Japan, Like A Virgin sold more than 1m actualy. Its Oricon sales alone are up to 900k. Off The Wall was already huge in 79, selling probably over to 300k even before the release of Thriller. Led Zep IV reached the top 100 (local acts included) in 71, 78, 88 and 2003, it is massive there.
Some of my Queen figures are indeed in the low side yet. BTW, there is a typo about ANATO, I have it at 350k (instead of 250k) on my Queen word document.

My estimates about Asia/South America were always very conservative 2 years ago. Since I updated most acts completely but not Queen by now, estimates of some areas are in fact more conservative than others (which is why I'm re-working on them btw!).

[HUR]

But this is a confirmed figure by their record company, and the album was certified 5 times platinum back in 1992 for sales of 500,000. It reached #1 during 8 weeks by the way...

Do you seriously believe that Michael Jackson sold far more than Queen?. It makes no sense. Or Pink Floyd, U2, Madonna, or Dire Straits.

I actually talked about Made in Heaven.
But do you have the email?
I can't imagine they would reply to fans.
I tried zillion emails and no reply.

But you cited the figure for "Greatest hits 2", thatīs the reason why I talked about it. And why do you call it "unkown"?. It was a massive seller all over Europe. In Spain, it was #1 during 2 weeks and was high on the charts during the Christmas month back in 1995. I have already posted the mails, Nelson, take a look at my previous posts. We arenīt making up these figures.

[nelson]

Here is the mail, received by Braca: "Sorry, but there's no reliable data of LP & Cassette Sales in our
Current system.
I can only give you CD & DVD Sales.
Sales of CDs are phenomenal - 3,2 m Cds and counting - That makes that
3 out of 10 spaniards have a Queen CD (not mentioning Lps)."

I don't believe they don't have figures for LP & CS.
SInce they have to pay the taxes to government and the accountants have to audit them.

[nelson]

But this is a confirmed figure by their record company, and the album was certified 5 times platinum back in 1992 for sales of 500,000. It reached #1 during 8 weeks by the way...

Do you seriously believe that Michael Jackson sold far more than Queen?. It makes no sense. Or Pink Floyd, U2, Madonna, or Dire Straits.

I actually talked about Made in Heaven.
But do you have the email?
I can't imagine they would reply to fans.
I tried zillion emails and no reply.

[HUR]

By the way, there is a small typo on "Greatest hits 2" (made by me), but the actual figure is 660,606.

It seems too high.
You have to have a sense.
ANd you have to compare the album with album, like certifications and chart run.
selling 400k for an unknown album is just absurd.
Bad sold 300k-400k, and has a better chart run.

But this is a confirmed figure by their record company, and the album was certified 5 times platinum back in 1992 for sales of 500,000. It reached #1 during 8 weeks by the way...

And I donīt know which "unknown" albums you are talking about.

Do you seriously believe that Michael Jackson sold far more than Queen?. It makes no sense. Or Pink Floyd, U2, Madonna, or Dire Straits.

[nelson]

By the way, there is a small typo on "Greatest hits 2" (made by me), but the actual figure is 660,606.

It seems too high.
You have to have a sense.
ANd you have to compare the album with album, like certifications and chart run.
selling 400k for an unknown album is just absurd.
Bad sold 300k-400k, and has a better chart run.

[HUR]

Here we have a couple of new codes from Brazil:

Queen - Collection (Brazil Exclusive)
AK3500
AO1500
AU1000

Queen - A Kind Of Magic
AG9000

Queen - Made In Heaven
AG7000

Queen - Innuendo
AE8000


Thanks to Lostprophet for finding them. They are all about shipments.

[Lawyeris]

I wonder, where Basil is gone???

[HUR]

Thank you, Jimmy, great numbers.


The Freddie Mercury tribute concert - 45,473
Greatest video hits 1 - 190,413*
Made in heaven - The films - 11,360
Live at wembley ī86 - 322,167*
Greatest video hits 2 - 148,935*
Queen on fire - 160,199*
Return of the champions - 83,597*
A night at the opera - 6,915
Queen rock Montreal - 52,000 (retail sales Musicweek)

Total - 1,021,059


Lover of life, singer of songs: 33,774*

Figures with an "*" are as of november 2007.

---------------------------------------

MJDangerous, are you sure those figure are for all formats?. People at their record company made it very clear (in several mails) that they donīt have access to any cassettes or vinyls sales.

By the way, there is a small typo on "Greatest hits 2" (made by me), but the actual figure is 660,606.

Here is the mail, received by Braca: "Sorry, but there's no reliable data of LP & Cassette Sales in our
Current system.
I can only give you CD & DVD Sales.
Sales of CDs are phenomenal - 3,2 m Cds and counting - That makes that
3 out of 10 spaniards have a Queen CD (not mentioning Lps)."

Maybe "A kind of magic" sold like 75-90k only in 1986, while the rest (on the CD format) was achieved via catalog as the time went by. While "Made in heaven" was mainly sold on the CD format, even with casettes still being a good share of the market back in 1995 or 1996. I estimated it at roughly 350,000 (which makes sense based on its certification that was given to the band in early 1996 when the album was still shiping and selling copies), because the bulk of its sales were probably achived via the CD format while cassettes or vinyls were good but not that strong for that one. "Innuendo", on the other hand, would look a bit on the low side if those figure were comprehensive, as the album made it to #1 in "Superventas" charts and spending 20+ weeks.

Because, how much do you think that they sold then?. Just 3,2 million over there as claimed by EMI?. That would be far less than Madonna, Michael Jackson, Pink Floyd, U2, Dire Starits, do you really think those were far bigger than Queen?. Or look at "Greatest hits 1", which had a strong initial performance at #1 with 25 weeks inside the charts and 25 years of back catalog, yet do you believe it only sold 182,700 copies up to december 2004?. Isnīt that a bit low?. Just with its initial chart, it easily sold 150,000+ over Spain, in my opinion.

As for Netherlands, they are obviously CDs only as "Greatest hits 3" was shown at at 66,791 as of february 2004, while it had already been certfied platinum in 2000 (for sales of 80,000 or 100,000, I donīt know how much out both numbers).

----------------------------------------

MJD, just a question (not to start stupid discussions and such, you know the respect I have for you), but why do you always dispute the sales figures (many of which are from their record company, and are as accurate as the ones provided by Jimmypage59) for Queen?. For some reason, it looks like it is impossible to you that Queen sold in huge numbers. I just wonder why. Iīm not only talking about Spain, but in general, you are always very pessimistic with Queen, in some cases.

The same for Japan, I look at your estimations for the band over there and, compared to the ones you came up with for other artists, your Queen estimations look very minimalistic. For example, in Japan, I see albums like "The dark side of the moon" at 800k, "The wall" at 500k (!), "Off the wall" at 700k (!), "Led Zeppelin 4" at 700k, "Like a virgin" at 1,000k (!) and much more...then other classic albums by Queen like "A night at the opera" at merely 250k, "News of the world" at 150k or "A kind of magic" at 50k (!) only, it is a bit like anyone can sell well over Japan and even in huge numbers, except Queen. Probably "Sheer heart attack", "A day at the races" and "Live killers" are underestimated too. It isnīt like Queen sell nothing on catalog, is it?.

I also think that the kind of estimations you assumed or "guessed" for the markets outside the lead ones are also on the "pessimistic" (if you allow me the word) side, specially compared to other acts for which you do some more "generous" estimates. Donīt forget it, I know your work so I have taken a look at a lot of the acts listed on chartsinfrance. Iīm not saying you are wrong, of course, but maybe you think that Queen werenīt big sellers?. It is just a question, I donīt want to convince you of anything, rather just have some conversations with you.

Remember, all of these are "constructive comments", this is said by someone who consideres you the best chart expert of this forum, you know how much I love you.

[MJDangerous]

Thanks a lot jimmypages59 ! So weird to see how low DVD sales are in UK (music DVDs). :-?

BTW, I'm starting to check back my Queen figures. The first point I want to make out is that I'm going to use several figures said to be about CDs only as comprehensive. In Spain for example :

Spain (cdīs only until 2004)

Greatest hits 2: 606.606
Gretaets hits 1: 182.700
"A kind of magic": 207.695
"Live magic": 109.418
"The miracle": 164.969
"Innuendo": 137.861
"Live at wembley": 202.278
"Made in heaven": 281.785
Queen rocks: 74.203
Greatest hits 3: 85.633
Platinium collection: 197.571

Total: 2.250.819

Those figures count definitely all formats, not only CDs. By 1995, Cassette sales were always very high in Spain, over a third of the market (17.9m on a market of 51.8m), Made In Heaven 281k figure is for sure comprehensive, no way it sold 420k or so (adding 1/3), considering it was certified at 200k already in 96.
That's even more obvious for 80's albums like AKOM. When it was released, CD sales were basicaly at 0 in Spain, most album sold were on vinyl/cassette. It just can not be at 207k on CDs alone.

I'm going to check more carefully figures from Netherland to see if they count only CD format or if they are comprehensive.

[jimmypages59]

Freddie Mercury Tribute Concert
2003 --- 30,113
2004 --- 5,592
2005 --- 3,956
2006 --- 2,864
2007 --- 1,989
2008 --- 959
Total --- 45,473



Queen - Made In Heaven (The Films)
2003 --- 8,317
2004 --- 1,967
2005 --- 23
2006 --- 656
2007 --- 822
2008 --- -425
Total --- 11,360



Queen - A Night At The Opera (Classic Albums Series)
2006 --- 7,035
2007 --- -187
2008 --- 67
Total --- 6,915

The Freddie Mercury Concert was released in 2002, I think the 2003 figures represents all copies shipped in 2002 and 2003, but I can't confirm this.

Made in Heaven, seems to have been heavily overshipped in 2003 & 2004 hence the very low figure in 2005, this again seems to be the case in 2007 & 2008, where more have actually been returned than shipped.

A Night at the opera, follows a similar pattern to Made in Heaven, it seems to have been heavily overshipped in 2006 and really not selling looking at the negative figure for 2007 and very low figure for 2008.