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Taylor Swift :: Charts & Sales History

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  • Seems pretty accurate. This would put Red (2012)'s 2021 units at 328,000 and Fearless (2008)'s 2021 units at 274,000. The latter matches up with MRC data said in its mid-year report. Huge catalogue numbers, even for her debut. Even with the re-recordings cutting their units, I think Taylor might be able to get each of her first 5 albums to diamond status by the end of this decade.
    Leviathan interesting thing you said here - just a curiosity how it will match up as her old masters are now being sold? Do you see a possible reason on why her old label will certify her old catalog sales or more interestingly why they should? Though Taylor being the master songwriter will get profits but how do you explain her old masters sales to her and not to the person/company who has her masters?
    Last edited by britneylinda; Thu January 6, 2022, 18:22.

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    • Originally posted by britneylinda View Post

      Leviathan interesting thing you said here - just a curiosity how it will match up as her old masters are now being sold? Do you see a possible reason on why her old label will certify her old catalog sales or more interestingly why they should? Though Taylor being the master songwriter will get profits but how do you explain her old masters sales to her and not to the person/company who has her masters?
      I'm not sure what exactly are you trying to ask, but if you're asking why Taylor's catalogue will still sell now, a lot of people still use the old versions of her albums. According to Billboard, Fearless (2008) sold over 124,000 units in the US in the first six months after its re-recording was released, and over 14,000 in pure sales. Since it has remained relatively stable in streams since then, I'm assuming it'll continue to sell at this pace for a while. The same logic can be applied to her other albums too.
      As for why her old label will certify her catalog sales, I don't think they will get her albums certified. That's why I said the albums would get to diamond status, instead of saying they would get certified diamond.

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      • Originally posted by Leviathan View Post

        I'm not sure what exactly are you trying to ask, but if you're asking why Taylor's catalogue will still sell now, a lot of people still use the old versions of her albums. According to Billboard, Fearless (2008) sold over 124,000 units in the US in the first six months after its re-recording was released, and over 14,000 in pure sales. Since it has remained relatively stable in streams since then, I'm assuming it'll continue to sell at this pace for a while. The same logic can be applied to her other albums too.
        As for why her old label will certify her catalog sales, I don't think they will get her albums certified. That's why I said the albums would get to diamond status, instead of saying they would get certified diamond.
        Didn't worded it correctly I guess, what I mean her as now her catalog isn't hers as chart analysers how do you comprehend the fact that sales aren't going to her and we still count them? Recently Bruce Springsteen sold his catalog now all sales will be given to the label who bought the masters wouldn't that be the same for Taylor?

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        • Originally posted by britneylinda View Post

          Didn't worded it correctly I guess, what I mean her as now her catalog isn't hers as chart analysers how do you comprehend the fact that sales aren't going to her and we still count them? Recently Bruce Springsteen sold his catalog now all sales will be given to the label who bought the masters wouldn't that be the same for Taylor?
          Rly? Can you post a source where it said "now all sales will be given to the label who bought the masters"?

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          • Originally posted by TheMysteriousMan View Post

            Rly? Can you post a source where it said "now all sales will be given to the label who bought the masters"?
            I mean that would be a logical way though, I quoted Bruce example that's why as in my sense of this side of the business label will make the profits off from her old masters though as Taylor being the masterful writer she will continue getting royalties but I am unable to gather the logic on how sales of her old masters will fully be on her name now and not on her previous label.

            Read post 89 here - Wayne is an expert on this
            https://www.ukmix.org/forum/general-...uge-sums/page4
            Last edited by britneylinda; Fri January 7, 2022, 12:02.

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            • Originally posted by britneylinda View Post

              I mean that would be a logical way though, I quoted Bruce example that's why as in my sense of this side of the business label will make the profits off from her old masters though as Taylor being the masterful writer she will continue getting royalties but I am unable to gather the logic on how sales of her old masters will fully be on her name now and not on her previous label.
              I don't think I understand what you said but I can try my best to explain:

              1. Sales are count to the performers.
              For example, Better Man(og) is not written by Little Big Town, but the performer is LBT, so if someone buy one copy of that song, the song's sales +1, LBT's sales also +1.

              2. According to wiki:
              "According to U.S. copyright law, any music recording is subject to two distinct types of ownership: one that protects the specific sound recording (owning a master, usually owned by record labels), and the other protecting the musical work (publishing rights, usually owned by songwriters)"

              Still using the example above, LBT doesn't own Better Man's master or its publishing rights, but that song's sale is still their sales. The same applies to Taylor. Where her masters belong doesn't rly affect where the sales go: the sales always go to Taylor, aka the performer of her work.

              -------------------

              or if you were asking if Taylor sell one copy of Speak Now for example, whether its sales count as Shamrock's sales or republic's or Big Machine's sales? (You know there's always a report in the year end tells you what company sold how many copies of work in total) In this case I'm not sure, I think it belongs to Shamrock's maybe???

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              • Originally posted by TheMysteriousMan View Post

                I don't think I understand what you said but I can try my best to explain:

                1. Sales are count to the performers.
                For example, Better Man(og) is not written by Little Big Town, but the performer is LBT, so if someone buy one copy of that song, the song's sales +1, LBT's sales also +1.

                2. According to wiki:
                "According to U.S. copyright law, any music recording is subject to two distinct types of ownership: one that protects the specific sound recording (owning a master, usually owned by record labels), and the other protecting the musical work (publishing rights, usually owned by songwriters)"

                Still using the example above, LBT doesn't own Better Man's master or its publishing rights, but that song's sale is still their sales. The same applies to Taylor. Where her masters belong doesn't rly affect where the sales go: the sales always go to Taylor, aka the performer of her work.

                -------------------

                or if you were asking if Taylor sell one copy of Speak Now for example, whether its sales count as Shamrock's sales or republic's or Big Machine's sales? (You know there's always a report in the year end tells you what company sold how many copies of work in total) In this case I'm not sure, I think it belongs to Shamrock's maybe???
                Probably but as Taylor got 300M for her old masters this in my belief means that old masters sales/profits goes to the label who acquired them hence comes the reason of Taylor re-reording as music of such big artists is also a product for consumption and making profits I am still unable to understand on why sales on her old masters would fully go to her as money has been given to her in full length this is what business side of this industry says.

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                • britneylinda Taylor is still profiting off her work. As a performer, songwriter, and producer of her work she'll generate revenue from that as long as her music sells, no matter who owns the masters. The effective ownership of musical bodies comes down to two components: the masters and the publishing rights. Since Taylor was the songwriter of all her songs, she owns the second component, which gives her around 50% ownership of her work. Whenever her work sells, the biggest share of the profit will therefore always goes to her, followed by Shamrock (the new owners of her old masters), followed by people at Big Machine who gain a tiny share due to a term in their contract with Shamrock.

                  As for you talking about sales being attributed to Taylor's masters' new owners instead of her because she doesn't own her work, that's not how it works. Sales are always credited to performers. The vast majority of artists out there don't own their masters, but we don't credit their album sales to their old labels, do we? Let's take Britney Spears as an instance, since I'm assuming you as a fan must be knowing about the greater details of her work and career. Britney's masters were owned by Jive Records (& are now assumed to be held by RCA Records, since they took Jive Records' former artists under their umbrella). By your logic, sales for Britney's older albums would be attributed to Jive Records and not her, since they owned her work. In fact, on her best selling album, ...Baby One More Time, Britney doesn't have even one writing credit, so she doesn't even have the publishing rights to any of its songs. Should we not attribute its 25,000,000 copies to her then?

                  I hope this made things easy to understand. If you have any more questions, let me know via PM
                  Last edited by Leviathan; Sat January 8, 2022, 06:41.

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                  • She's never beating the local allegations, I fear.

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                    • Britney Spears • Janet Jackson • Christina Aguilera • Michael Jackson • Selena Gomez • Hilary Duff • Taylor Swift •

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                      • She Is unnstoppable












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                        • Originally posted by JC96 View Post
                          She Is unnstoppable

                          She's going to be most streamed female artist of all time by the end of the year at this rate.

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                          • Originally posted by Leviathan View Post


                            She's never beating the local allegations, I fear.
                            She‘s doing incredible - especially Germany is a big surprise. Is there a reason why especially Reputation is back on the charts? Because I get 1989, but Reputation instead of Folklore / Evermore seems a bit random to me?

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                            • Originally posted by Tansike View Post

                              She‘s doing incredible - especially Germany is a big surprise. Is there a reason why especially Reputation is back on the charts? Because I get 1989, but Reputation instead of Folklore / Evermore seems a bit random to me?
                              Oh yeah, she's doing amazing. I intended for that comment about local allegations to come across sarcastically

                              I myself have no idea why Reputation is back all of a sudden. The only thing giving me some hint is this tweet which implies it was because of a vinyl restock:

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                              • ^ Thanks, vinyl restock makes absolutely sense especially since Germany is still revenue based and vinyl costs more than CDs.

                                Germany is a tough market for international artists so her having three entries at once is truly incredible!

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                                  • A big thank you to oldbloke apparently

                                    I'll post re-recordings' sales in "Taylor's Version" thread.

                                    1989 & reputation sales by year:
                                    Year 1989 album sales 1989 SPS sales rep album sales reputation SPS sales
                                    2017 108,000 1,903,000 2,336,000
                                    2018 59,000 291,000 988,000
                                    2019 55,000 392,000 56,000 457,000
                                    2020 40,000 427,000 294,000
                                    2021 45,000 515,000 371,000
                                    Total 6,295,000 - 6.3M 4,446,000








                                    Lover, folklore & evermore sales by year:
                                    Year Lover Lover folklore folklore evermore evermore
                                    2019 1,085,000 2,191,000
                                    2020 174,000 876,000 1,276,000 2,204,000 283,000 569,000
                                    2021 152,000 662,000 304,000 942,000 529,000 1,215,000
                                    Total 1,411,000 3,729,000 1,580,000 3,146,000 812,000 1,784,000

                                    Also see my post "TS1-TS5 yearly album sales from 2006 - 2019" here

                                    Last edited by TheMysteriousMan; Mon January 10, 2022, 11:19.

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                                    • 09/01/2022 update:

                                      "Speak Now" has surpassed "Pink Friday" and becomes the 7th most streamed album released in 2010 on Spotify. (6th very soon!)
                                      No other Taylor's album has a higher rank in their own releasing years.

                                      p.s. Speak Now also re-enters this week's billboard chart at #155.

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                                      • Billboard 200 15/01/2022 update

                                        Album This Week Change WOC
                                        Red TV 5 -2 8
                                        folklore 32 +17 76
                                        evermore 35 0 56
                                        Lover 56 +27 124
                                        Fearless TV 70 -11 38
                                        1989 71 +52 369
                                        reputation 97 +59 172
                                        Speak Now 155 RE 147


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                                        • Her catalogue smashing

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                                          • oops one minute earlier than you hahaha

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                                            • Originally posted by JC96 View Post
                                              Her catalogue smashing
                                              Poor debut Can’t wait for Taylor's Version to remind ppl of its existence.
                                              Britney Spears • Janet Jackson • Christina Aguilera • Michael Jackson • Selena Gomez • Hilary Duff • Taylor Swift •

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                                              • Taylor now reach 300 weeks charting on UK Albums Chart Top 40.
                                                ​​​
                                                1. 1989: 88 weeks
                                                2. Red: 44 weeks
                                                3. Folklore: 42 weeks*
                                                4. Lover: 41 weeks
                                                5. Reputation: 34 weeks
                                                6. Evermore: 18 weeks
                                                7. Fearless: 17 weeks
                                                8. Red TV: 8 weeks*
                                                9. Fearless TV: 5 weeks
                                                10. Speak Now: 3 weeks
                                                Total: 300 WEEKS
                                                *Still on top 40

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                                                  • She is coming for that streaming crown as well.
                                                    Britney Spears • Janet Jackson • Christina Aguilera • Michael Jackson • Selena Gomez • Hilary Duff • Taylor Swift •

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