The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

[ACA]

The only difference in my notes from this day is that the Turtles were played or mentioned at 15 and Cat Stevens at 14. But still I wasn't aware of the joint positions at that time, so it must have been the presenters choice (Alan Freeman).

Glad to see you proceed with your excellent work! Don't give up, it's worthwhile!

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Another week with the BBC chart riddled with ties and fourteen differences in chart positions between the BBC and Ultimate Charts between positions 11 and 30.

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending May 13th 1967 for your pleasure.

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending May 13th 1967								NME	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	200	250	100	85	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
1	1	Puppet On A String - Sandie Shaw					1	1	1	1	1	19050
2	2	Somethin' Stupid - Frank and Nancy Sinatra					2	3	2	3	2	18115
6	3	Dedicated To The One I Love - The Mamas And Papas					3	2	4	2	3	17830
13	4	Silence Is Golden - The Tremeloes					4	4	3	4	4	17395
10	5	The Boat That I Row - Lulu					5	6	5	5	6	16225
15	6	Pictures Of Lily - The Who					6	7	6	9	5	15460
4	7	Purple Haze - The Jimi Hendrix Experience					7	5	9	8	7	15040
8	8	Funny Familiar Forgotten Feelings - Tom Jones					8	10	7	6	8	14655
9	9	Seven Drunken Nights - The Dubliners					9	11	8	7	11	13850
3	10	A Little Bit Me, A Little Bit You - The Monkees					10=	9	10	10	10	13535
7	11	I Can Hear The Grass Grow - The Move					10=	8	11	11	9	13470
5	12	Ha ! Ha ! Said The Clown - Manfred Mann					12	12	12	12	12	12065
12	13	Release Me - Engelbert Humperdinck					13=	15	14	14	15	10510
14	14	Happy Together - The Turtles					13=	14	15	13	16	10475
11	15	I'm Gonna Get Me A Gun - Cat Stevens					13=	13	16	16	13	10380
17	16	Hi Ho Silver Lining - Jeff Beck					16	18	13	15	14	10145
16	17	Bernadette - The Four Tops					17	16	17	17	18	9005
NEW	18	Then I Kissed Her - The Beach Boys					18	20	18	18	19	7770
NEW	19	Waterloo Sunset - The Kinks					21	17	19	20	29	7070
27	20	New York Mining Disaster 1941 - The Bee Gees					19	21	21	28	17	5990
24	21	Sweet Soul Music - Arthur Conley					20	19	26	22	21	5400
NEW	22	The Wind Cries Mary - The Jimi Hendrix Experience					22	24	25	19	27	4440
23	23	Maroc 7 / Bombay Duck - The Shadows					24	28	20	26	25	4360
19	24	This Is My Song - Harry Secombe					23		22	21	23	3930
NEW	25	Casino Royale - Herb Alpert					26=	27	23	23		3600
18	26	It's All Over - Cliff Richard					25	23	28	27	22	3515
30	27	If I Were A Rich Man - Topol					28=	29	24	30	28	2505
NEW	28	The First Cut Is The Deepest - P.P. Arnold					30	22		25		2400
20	29	Knock On Wood - Eddie Floyd					26=	29		24	20	2035
21	30	Jimmy Mack - Martha and The Vandellas					28=		27	29	24	1795
		Birds And Bees - Warm Sounds						25				1200
		Finchley Central - The New Vaudeville Band						26				1000
		I Was Kaiser Bill's Batman - Whistling Jack Smith							29			500
		Gonna Give Her All The Love I've Got - Jimmy Ruffin									26	425
		The Happening - The Supremes							30			250
		Simon Smith And His Amazing Dancing Bear - The Alan Price Set									30	85

[MrTibbs]

The three way tie finally epitomised and laid bare just how inadequate the BBC's system of averaging out was. If they had adopted a more robust and consistent approach it shouldn't have happened as the potential for such a tie should surely have been foreseen.

[Splodj]

An interesting point to ponder is that (almost certainly) the infamous 3-way tie would not have happened if Disc had stayed in the game.

[Graham76man]

An early example of a Radio Station not basing what they play based on what people are buying. This became more common when commercial radio started. Many of them wouldn't play some chart hits and when Punk came along the charts were a no go area for Radio Stations. How many stations today will use the Official top 40 as A grade playlist material?

[Graham76man]

But there are three easy ways to sort out joint positions. 1: Most weeks in chart. 2: Alphabetical. 3: based on last week positions highest first. The BBC could have also just phoned a one shop up at random and ask the owner which of the records sold more in their shop.
But of course none of this mattered to the BBC till the number one became compromised and they gave up on the system after that.

[Robbie]

Yeah some weeks the BBC and The Ultimate Averaged Charts only differ by a handful of positions plus tie breaking. Some weeks there are more differences than others some quite markedly.
When we get to March 1960 to March1962 you will see a lot more differences due to the factoring in of the RM and RR charts which the BBC didn't include at that time. So we might potentially see a greatly different averaged chart for that period.

What I like about the Ultimate Averaged Chart is that it shows that the concept behind the compilation of the Pick Of The Pops chart was sound. It gave a broad overview of what was popular in the charts of the 1960s. However the simplicity of the chart compilation method also left the POTP chart open to problems such as joint postions which your averaged chart doesn't have. The BBC chart didn't have a satisfactory method of dealing with joint positions while the Ultimate Averaged chart does.

[MrTibbs]

Yeah some weeks the BBC and The Ultimate Averaged Charts only differ by a handful of positions plus tie breaking. Some weeks there are more differences than others some quite markedly.
When we get to March 1960 to March1962 you will see a lot more differences due to the factoring in of the RM and RR charts which the BBC didn't include at that time. So we might potentially see a greatly different averaged chart for that period.

[Metalweb]

Despite all the classic singles they came out with in later decades I still think the chilling NYMD1941 is the Bee Gees' most memorable composition (and the obvious inspiration for Bowie's Space Oddity a couple of years later).

It was inspired by the recent Aberfan disaster ("Mr Jones...") and presumably the rather random title (as Graham pointed out earlier, there was no mining disaster in New York in '41) was to avoid accusations of "cashing in" on the tragedy...

[Splodj]

Those of us who listened to Radio London were in a different time warp. The Bee Gees had entered their chart at 21 a full month before, on 6-Apr. On 12-May they played the entire Sgt Pepper album. On 14-May 'A Whiter Shade of Pale' entered their chart at 29, after having been played since late April.

[Graham76man]

That was the Bee Gees second single. The first "Spicks and Specks" only reached reached 66 in March of 1967 so would not have made the top 30.
Lulu's track was of course very popular with the Pirate Radio stations due to the boat reference.
Topol - If I was A Rich Man, was in entirely due to the West End production of the show Fiddler On The Roof that year. It first hit the stage in the USA in 1964, so it took some time to get a production in the UK. I suspect there was a bias still in the charts towards London shops, which might have accounted for it's place in these charts, but it's a catchy tune and so would sell anyway. Most people these days will know it from the film of the same name. But the film wasn't released until 1971 so had no effect here.

There's no footage of Frank and Nancy actually singing Somethin' Stupid. One of the few late 60's number one not to have film of the performance. Some people have cobbled together on YouTube footage of them singing together and put the track over it, but it's not them actually singing the song!

[Robbie]

Pink Floyd made their debut a few weeks ago and now it's the turn of the Bee Gees.

[Splodj]

Ultimate and BBC very close. Just 14/15 swapped, 25 untied and 28/29 swapped.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending May 6th 1967. Enjoy !

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending May 6th 1967								NME	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	200	250	100	85	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
1	1	Puppet On A String - Sandie Shaw					1	1	1	1	1	19050
2	2	Somethin' Stupid - Frank and Nancy Sinatra					2	2	2	2	2	18415
3	3	A Little Bit Me, A Little Bit You - The Monkees					3	3	5	3	4	17195
5	4	Purple Haze - The Jimi Hendrix Experience					4	5	4	4	3	17030
4	5	Ha ! Ha ! Said The Clown - Manfred Mann					5	6	3	5	7	16640
11	6	Dedicated To The One I Love - The Mamas And Papas					6	4	6	6	6	16275
10	7	I Can Hear The Grass Grow - The Move					7	7	9	7	5	14910
12	8	Funny Familiar Forgotten Feelings - Tom Jones					8	8	8	8	9	14520
9	9	Seven Drunken Nights - The Dubliners					9	9	7	9	13	14130
16	10	The Boat That I Row - Lulu					10	10	10	10	10	13335
7	11	I'm Gonna Get Me A Gun - Cat Stevens					11	11	11	14	8	12655
6	12	Release Me - Engelbert Humperdinck					12	14	13	11	11	11600
26	13	Silence Is Golden - The Tremeloes					13	13	14	13	15	11010
14	14	Happy Together - The Turtles					15	16	12	15	14	10795
24	15	Pictures Of Lily - The Who					14	12	16	12	16	10725
8	16	Bernadette - The Four Tops					16	15	15	16	12	10315
20	17	Hi Ho Silver Lining - Jeff Beck					17	17	17	19	17	8690
15	18	It's All Over - Cliff Richard					18	18	18	21	18	7955
13	19	This Is My Song - Harry Secombe					19	19	19	18	20	7635
21	20	Knock On Wood - Eddie Floyd					20	23	21	17	19	6520
22	21	Jimmy Mack - Martha and The Vandellas					21	24	20	20	21	6100
17	22	I Was Kaiser Bill's Batman - Whistling Jack Smith					22	21	22	24	23	5630
25	23	Maroc 7 / Bombay Duck - The Shadows					23	25	23	26	24	4295
NEW	24	Sweet Soul Music - Arthur Conley					24	20		23	29	3170
19	25	Because I Love You - Georgie Fame					25=	28	25	25	26	3125
18	26	Simon Smith And His Amazing Dancing Bear - The Alan Price Set					25=	30	24	28	22	3015
NEW	27	New York Mining Disaster 1941 - The Bee Gees					27	26		22	27	2240
30	28	Gonna Give Her All The Love I've Got - Jimmy Ruffin					29	22			30	1885
23	29	Edelweiss - Vince Hill					28		26		25	1760
NEW	30	If I Were A Rich Man - Topol					30		27	27		1400
		Birds And Bees - Warm Sounds						27				800
		Al Capone - Prince Buster							28			750
		Get Me To The World On Time - The Electric Prunes						28				600
		Arnold Layne - Pink Floyd							30		28	505
		Oh How I Miss You - The Bachelors							29			500
		Then I Kissed Her - The Beach Boys								29		200
		Casino Royale - Herb Alpert								30		100

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending April 29th 1967. Enjoy !

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending April 29th 1967								NME	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	200	250	100	85	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
1	1	Puppet On A String - Sandie Shaw					1	1	1	1	1	19050
2	2	Somethin' Stupid - Frank and Nancy Sinatra					2	2	2	2	2	18415
3	3	A Little Bit Me, A Little Bit You - The Monkees					3	3	3	3	3	17780
4	4	Ha ! Ha ! Said The Clown - Manfred Mann					4	4	4	4	4	17145
7	5	Purple Haze - The Jimi Hendrix Experience					5	5	5	6	5	16410
5	6	Release Me - Engelbert Humperdinck					6	6	7	5	8	15555
10	7	I'm Gonna Get Me A Gun - Cat Stevens					7	8	6	7	6	15375
9	8	Bernadette - The Four Tops					8	7	10	8	10	14135
12	9	Seven Drunken Nights - The Dubliners					10	9	8	10	11	13950
17	10	I Can Hear The Grass Grow - The Move					9	11	9	9	7	13740
18	11	Dedicated To The One I Love - The Mamas And Papas					11	10	12	11	9	12820
19	12	Funny Familiar Forgotten Feelings - Tom Jones					12	13	11	12	13	12030
6	13	This Is My Song - Harry Secombe					14	12	15	13	14	11045
14	14	Happy Together - The Turtles					13	14	14	14	12	10965
8	15	It's All Over - Cliff Richard					15	16	13	15	15	10460
28	16	The Boat That I Row - Lulu					16	15	16	16	16	9725
13	17	I Was Kaiser Bill's Batman - Whistling Jack Smith					17	17	18	18	17	8540
11	18	Simon Smith And His Amazing Dancing Bear - The Alan Price Set					18	18	19	21	18	7705
15	19	Because I Love You - Georgie Fame					19	19	20	17	21	7400
24	20	Hi Ho Silver Lining - Jeff Beck					20	23	17	19	24	6895
22	21	Knock On Wood - Eddie Floyd					21	21	23	22	19	5920
23	22	Jimmy Mack - Martha and The Vandellas					22	22	22	20	22	5915
16	23	Edelweiss - Vince Hill					23	29	21	23	20	4635
NEW	24	Pictures Of Lily - The Who					25	19	28	24		3850
NEW	25	Maroc 7 / Bombay Duck - The Shadows					24	25	25	25	26	3725
NEW	26	Silence Is Golden - The Tremeloes					26	24	26	28	29	3120
26	27	Arnold Layne - Pink Floyd					27		24		23	2430
21	28	Penny Lane / Strawberry Fields Forever - The Beatles					29		27	26		1500
30	29	Al Capone - Prince Buster					28	28	30		25	1360
NEW	30	Gonna Give Her All The Love I've Got - Jimmy Ruffin					30	27		27		1200
		Sweet Soul Music - Arthur Conley						26				1000
		Georgy Girl - The Seekers						30		30	27	640
		Touch Me, Touch Me - Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick and Tich							29			500
		Oh How I Miss You - The Bachelors								29	30	285
		Memories Are Made Of This - Val Doonican									28	255

[Graham76man]

As I predicted Jeff Beck enters all the top 30 without selling a single copy. Only after these charts were published did Beck start to sell, but only at 79. The other version by The Attack was the one in the actual chart. But as that video I posted in a previous post shows when somebody like Don Arden wanted a record in the chart it was. He was not the only one Joe Meek was well into chart hyping. Meek bought 10 to 20 in each shop and they would chart, he would then tell the DJ's it's charted and they would do the rest to sell the record. 100 copies would get you up the chart. At least 60 shops were in London.

[MrTibbs]

Yeah there was no consistency in their application of tie breakers.

[Splodj]

Strange how the BBC did not break a tie for number one using the 'trend' method, but did for other positions.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

A joint #1 on the BBC chart.

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending April 22nd 1967. Enjoy !

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending April 22nd 1967								NME	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	200	250	100	85	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
2	1	Puppet On A String - Sandie Shaw					1=	1	1	2	2	18865
1	2	Somethin' Stupid - Frank and Nancy Sinatra					1=	2	2	1	1	18600
3	3	A Little Bit Me, A Little Bit You - The Monkees					3	3	3	3	3	17780
5	4	Ha ! Ha ! Said The Clown - Manfred Mann					4	4	4	4	4	17145
4	5	Release Me - Engelbert Humperdinck					5	5	6	5	5	16260
6	6	This Is My Song - Harry Secombe					6	6	7	6	7	15540
10	7	Purple Haze - The Jimi Hendrix Experience					7	7	8	7	6	15075
8	8	It's All Over - Cliff Richard					8	9	5	9	9	14970
12	9	Bernadette - The Four Tops					9	8	11	8	8	13855
16	10	I'm Gonna Get Me A Gun - Cat Stevens					10	11	9	11	10	13285
7	11	Simon Smith And His Amazing Dancing Bear - The Alan Price Set					11	10	10	12	11	13050
20	12	Seven Drunken Nights - The Dubliners					12	13	12	10	14	11895
9	13	I Was Kaiser Bill's Batman - Whistling Jack Smith					13	12	13	15	13	11430
17	14	Happy Together - The Turtles					14	17	14	13	12	10465
18	15	Because I Love You - Georgie Fame					15	14	18	14	15	9710
11	16	Edelweiss - Vince Hill					16	16	15	16	17	9690
29	17	I Can Hear The Grass Grow - The Move					17	15	17	18	16	9275
26	18	Dedicated To The One I Love - The Mamas And Papas					18	18	16	17	18	8855
NEW	19	Funny Familiar Forgotten Feelings - Tom Jones					19	19	20	19	24	6945
13	20	Georgy Girl - The Seekers					22	21	21	26	22	5765
14	21	Penny Lane / Strawberry Fields Forever - The Beatles					21	26	19	21	23	5680
23	22	Knock On Wood - Eddie Floyd					20	24	22	22	19	5570
30	23	Jimmy Mack - Martha and The Vandellas					23=	20	26	24	26	4575
NEW	24	Hi Ho Silver Lining - Jeff Beck					23=	24	24	20	28	4505
15	25	This Is My Song - Petula Clark					26	29	23	23	27	3540
22	26	Arnold Layne - Pink Floyd					25		25	27	20	2835
19	27	Memories Are Made Of This - Val Doonican					27	26	27	28	25	2810
NEW	28	The Boat That I Row - Lulu					29	22		25		2400
21	29	Touch Me, Touch Me - Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick and Tich					28	28	28	30	21	2300
25	30	Al Capone - Prince Buster					30	23	30	29	29	2220
		There's A Kind Of Hush - Herman's Hermits							29			500
		Maroc 7 - The Shadows						30				200
		You Got What It Takes - The Dave Clark Five									30	85

[Splodj]

So as the record probably didn't make the top ten on first release (well it didn't in RR) so I guess the BBC chart probably didn't have it in.

You can see where it peaked on post 239.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending April 15th 1967. Enjoy !

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending April 15th 1967								NME	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	200	250	100	85	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
2	1	Somethin' Stupid - Frank and Nancy Sinatra					1	1	1	1	1	19050
4	2	Puppet On A String - Sandie Shaw					2	2	2	2	3	18330
11	3	A Little Bit Me, A Little Bit You - The Monkees					4	4	3	4	4	17395
1	4	Release Me - Engelbert Humperdinck					3	3	5	3	2	17365
14	5	Ha ! Ha! Said The Clown - Manfred Mann					6	6	4	6	6	16375
3	6	This Is My Song - Harry Secombe					5	5	6	5	5	16260
5	7	Simon Smith and His Amazing Dancing Bear - The Alan Price Set					7	7	8	8	7	14890
8	8	It's All Over - Cliff Richard					8=	8	7	9	9	14670
6	9	I Was Kaiser Bill's Batman - Whistling Jack Smith					8=	9	9	7	8	14255
18	10	Purple Haze - The Jimi Hendrix Experience					10	11	10	10	11	13050
7	11	Edelweiss - Vince Hill					11	10	11	11	10	12985
17	12	Bernadette - The Four Tops					12	12	12	12	13	11980
13	13	Georgy Girl - The Seekers					14	15	13	18	14	10445
10	14	Penny Lane / Strawberry Fields Forever - The Beatles					13	16	15	13	12	10415
9	15	This Is My Song - Petula Clark					15	14	17	14	18	9705
30	16	I'm Gonna Get Me A Gun - Cat Stevens					16	13	16	16	21	9700
25	17	Happy Together - The Turtles					17	19	14	15	19	9270
20	18	Because I Love You - Georgie Fame					18	17	18	19	15	8610
12	19	Memories Are Made Of This - Val Doonican					19	21	19	17	17	7590
27	20	Seven Drunken Nights - The Dubliners					20=	18	20	21	25	6860
19	21	Touch Me, Touch Me - Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick and Tich					20=	20	22	20	16	6825
28	22	Arnold Layne - Pink Floyd					23	24	21	22	26	5225
23	23	Knock On Wood - Eddie Floyd					22	24	24	23	20	4885
15	24	There's A Kind Of Hush - Herman's Hermits					24	30	23	24	23	3580
22	25	Al Capone - Prince Buster					25	27	28	27	22	2715
NEW	26	Dedicated To The One I Love - The Mamas And Papas					29	22	30	29		2250
21	27	Love Is Here And Now You're Gone - The Supremes					27		25	30	24	2195
16	28	On A Carousel - The Hollies					26		26	26	27	2090
NEW	29	I Can Hear The Grass Grow - The Move					28	23		28	30	1985
NEW	30	Jimmy Mack - Martha and The Vandellas					30	29	29	25		1500
		Give It To Me - The Troggs							27		29	1170
		Hi Ho Silver Lining - Jeff Beck						26				1000
		You Got What It Takes - The Dave Clark Five						28			28	855

[Graham76man]

I think Leader of The Pack fell into the "death disc" thing, that was popular in the early 60's - Johnny Remember Me etc. It was the Church of England that told the BBC that these discs shouldn't be played. So they didn't.
Back then I think Fluff only had to play the top ten in full. So as the record probably didn't make the top ten on first release (well it didn't in RR) so I guess the BBC chart probably didn't have it in. Then he didn't have to play it! Hence the "pick" thing.

Having a top ten record was the only way you could get a record played for sure on the BBC. Though you might think that sending in a request for record on the "request shows" would also get the record played. But that was never the case. The BBC simply selected the records it wanted to play, then trawled through the sack of requests for the same records! Of course there were plenty.

[Graham76man]

TOTP could get away with playing things as it was on at 7.30, when young kids were in bed, back then. Radio however was much stricter.

[Splodj]

That's a possible candidate.

The only way to discover if it was banned would be to find a recording (or track listing) of the 31-Jan-65 POTP to see if it was played as a Top 20 new entry, as it never made the Top 10.

Edit: 'Leader Of The Pack' was featured as the second act on the 4-Feb-65 edition of Top Of The Pops.

[MrTibbs]

I think, if I remember correctly, that the BBC didn't play Leader Of The Pack by The Shangri-Las back on release in 1965 as it was considered to be in poor taste but I can't remember if POTP played it or not back then.