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The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

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  • BobPatience
    replied
    And there appears Winchester Cathedral, the 'Best Contemporary (R&R) Recording' of 1967, according to the Recording Academy. Finishing ahead of 'Cherish', 'Monday, Monday', 'Eleanor Rigby', 'Last Train to Clarksville' and last but, definitely, not least 'Good Vibrations'. Not that I think it's a bad song, in fact I find it quite infectious. But I still cannot fathom how a silly Music Hall tune beat masterworks by both Brian Wilson and Paul McCartney. That said, this is far and away not the only instance in which I disagree with the Recording Academy.

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! I'm just in from work hence the late post.

    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 10th September 1966.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 10th 1966 NME MM DISC RR Total
    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 100 85 Points
    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
    3 1 All Or Nothing - The Small Faces 1= 2 1 1 2 18765
    1 2 Yellow Submarine / Eleanor Rigby - The Beatles 1= 1 2 2 1 18700
    2 3 God Only Knows - The Beach Boys 3 3 3 3 3 17780
    7 4 Too Soon To Know - Roy Orbison 4 5 5 4 5 16610
    4 5 They're Coming To Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa ! - Napoleon XIV 5 6 4 6 4 16545
    16 6 Distant Drums - Jim Reeves 6 4 8 5 6 15875
    5 7 Mama - Dave Berry 7 8 6 8 8 15105
    8 8 Lovers Of The World Unite - David and Jonathan 8 7 7 12 7 14740
    18 9 Got To Get You Into My Life - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 10 10 10 9 15 13010
    6 10 With A Girl Like You - The Troggs 9 9 14 10 9 12620
    13 11 Just Like A Woman - Manfred Mann 11 14 9 11 11 12600
    12 12 I Saw Her Again - The Mamas and Papas 12 15 13 7 13 11630
    9 13 Hi-Lili Hi-Lo - The Alan Price Set 14 17 11 13 14 11045
    19 14 Working In The Coal Mine - Lee Dorsey 13 12 16 14 10 11035
    11 15 Visions - Cliff Richard 15 10 15 19 12 11015
    10 16 Summer In The City - The Lovin' Spoonful 17 22 12 16 17 9240
    17 17 More Than Love - Ken Dodd 16 16 17 17 16 9175
    NEW 18 I'm A Boy - The Who 18 13 23 18 20 7835
    14 19 Black Is Black - Los Bravos 19 21 18 22 19 7170
    15 20 The More I See You - Chris Montez 20 23 21 20 18 6305
    30 21 When I Come Home - The Spencer Davis Group 21 25 20 15 23 6230
    NEW 22 Ashes To Ashes - The Mindbenders 22 24 19 21 22 6165
    27 23 How Sweet It Is - Junior Walker and The All Stars 23 20 26 26 27 4290
    23 24 Ain't Too Proud To Beg - The Temptations 24 29 25 24 25 3110
    22 25 Barefootin' - Robert Parker 26 22 29 24 3045
    NEW 26 Little Man - Sonny and Cher 27 18 27 3000
    NEW 27 I Can't Turn You Loose - Otis Redding 30 27 24 2550
    NEW 28 You Can't Hurry Love - The Supremes 29 19 30 2500
    21 29 I Want You - Bob Dylan 28 27 25 26 2025
    25 30 Loving You Is Sweeter Than Ever - The Four Tops 25 23 21 1650
    Big Time Operator - Zoot Money and The Big Roll Band 28 28 28 1605
    Land Of 1,000 Dances - Wilson Pickett 26 30 1250
    Step Out Of Line - Twice As Much 29 500
    Out Of Time - Chris Farlowe 28 30 385
    Winchester Cathedral - The New Vaudeville Band 30 200
    Strangers In The Night - Frank Sinatra 29 170

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    replied
    I did some research into the people thinking they were famous people in mental hospitals connected with the re-incarnation thing where lots of people have had past lives as Cleopatra and Napoleon etc. Obviously if they had past lives (in mental hospitals) these would explain it. But it seems the facts of mental hospitals do not back this up. With nobody (in studies of the patients) claiming to be a famous person. Having said that the bloke who shot John Lennon said he was John Lennon! So maybe it still stands?

    There's a video of it on YouTube, but I don't know if it is the original artist or somebody doing a video for it. Sections of it look old enough though to be from the 60's. The quality is not good either.

    Leave a comment:


  • Metalweb
    replied
    I remember hearing an interview with Jerry Samuels (just googled his real name) in which he claimed he knew several psychiatric patients and they all loved his record!

    This must have been in the early 70s when the single was re-issued, made the breakers and almost re-charted.

    Wonder where the cliché of asylum inmates thinking they're Napoleon comes from - presumably it pre-dates this.....

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Yeah Graham they both worked in The State Hospital at Carstairs in forensic psychiatry, and were appalled at me wanting to buy that record. The lecture I got lol

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    commented on 's reply
    Going mad because a woman's left you OR
    Going mad because your dogs left you

    Which would have got the radio producers banning the record most?

    I would have thought being in love with a dog?? So to put the verse in would would increase the risk of a ban.

  • Graham76man
    commented on 's reply
    Wow you had some forward thinking parents there, unless they worked with mental health issues or connected with it.

  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers !

    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 3rd September 1966.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 3rd 1966 NME MM DISC RR Total
    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 100 85 Points
    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
    1 1 Yellow Submarine / Eleanor Rigby - The Beatles 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    2 2 God Only Knows - The Beach Boys 2 2 2 2 2 18415
    8 3 All Or Nothing - The Small Faces 3 3 3 3 3 17780
    4 4 They're Coming To Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa ! - Napoleon XIV 4 4 4 4 4 17145
    5 5 Mama - Dave Berry 5 6 5 5 6 16225
    3 6 With A Girl Like You - The Troggs 6 5 6 7 5 16060
    15 7 Too Soon To Know - Roy Orbison 7 7 10 6 8 14505
    13 8 Lovers Of The World Unite - David and Jonathan 8 9 9 14 9 13470
    10 9 Hi-Lili Hi-Lo - The Alan Price Set 11= 10 7 16 12 13315
    7 10 Summer In The City - The Lovin' Spoonful 9 13 8 12 10 13035
    6 11 Visions - Cliff Richard 10 8 15 13 7 12440
    12 12 I Saw Her Again - The Mamas and Papas 11= 15 11 8 11 12200
    17 13 Just Like A Woman - Manfred Mann 13 14 12 10 13 11780
    9 14 Black Is Black - Los Bravos 14 12 13 9 16 11775
    11 15 The More I See You - Chris Montez 15 16 14 11 14 10695
    20 16 Distant Drums - Jim Reeves 16 11 17 15 17 10290
    14 17 More Than Love - Ken Dodd 17 18 16 17 15 9110
    24 18 Got To Get You Into My Life - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 18 17 18 18 18 8455
    27 19 Working In The Coal Mine - Lee Dorsey 19 19 19 19 19 7620
    16 20 Out Of Time - Chris Farlowe 20 22 21 22 23 5880
    18 21 I Want You - Bob Dylan 21 25 20 25 20 5485
    29 22 Barefootin' - Robert Parker 23 27 24 21 24 4145
    25 23 Ain't Too Proud To Beg - The Temptations 24 23 27 26 21 3950
    28 24 Give Me Your Word - Billy Fury 25 28 22 24 27 3890
    23 25 Loving You Is Sweeter Than Ever - The Four Tops 22 25 28 20 22 3815
    19 26 Love Letters - Elvis Presley 26 23 23 28 3055
    NEW 27 How Sweet It Is - Junior Walker and The All Stars 27 21 30 2100
    NEW 28 Big Time Operator - Zoot Money and The Big Roll Band 30= 25 25 2010
    21 29 I Couldn't Live Without Your Love - Petula Clark 28 28 26 1850
    NEW 30 When I Come Home - The Spencer Davis Group 29 24 1400
    Revolver (LP) - The Beatles 20 2200
    Strangers In The Night - Frank Sinatra 30= 29 26 925
    Goin' Back - Dusty Springfield 30 29 30 535
    Warm And Tender Love - Percy Sledge 27 400
    Blowin' In The Wind - Stevie Wonder 28 300
    Goodbye Bluebird - Wayne Fontana 30 200
    Ashes To Ashes - The Mindbenders 29 170

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers !

    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 27th August 1966.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending August 27th 1966 NME MM DISC RR Total
    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 100 85 Points
    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
    1 1 Yellow Submarine/ Eleanor Rigby - The Beatles 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    3 2 God Only Knows - The Beach Boys 2 2 2 2 2 18415
    2 3 With A Girl Like You - The Troggs 3 3 3 3 3 17780
    10 4 They're Coming To Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa ! - Napoleon XIV 4 4 5 4 4 16895
    5 5 Mama - Dave Berry 5 5 4 6 5 16660
    8 6 Visions - Cliff Richard 6 7 7 7 7 15240
    7 7 Summer In The City - The Lovin' Spoonful 9 9 6 10 12 14365
    18 8 All Or Nothing - The Small Faces 8 6 10 9 9 14320
    4 9 Black Is Black - Los Bravos 7 8 12 5 6 14075
    11 10 Hi-Lili Hi-Lo - The Alan Price Set 11 10 8 11 11 13650
    6 11 The More I See You - Chris Montez 10 11 11 8 8 13255
    13 12 I Saw Her Again - The Mamas and Papas 12= 14 9 12 13 12330
    14 13 Lovers Of The World Unite - David and Jonathan 12= 12 13 13 10 11885
    15 14 More Than Love - Ken Dodd 14 15 14 15 14 10495
    23 15 Too Soon To Know - Roy Orbison 15 13 16 14 17 10240
    9 16 Out Of Time - Chris Farlowe 16 16 15 17 15 9760
    21 17 Just Like A Woman - Manfred Mann 17 17 18 19 16 8525
    16 18 I Want You - Bob Dylan 18 21 17 18 18 7905
    12 19 Love Letters - Elvis Presley 19 22 19 16 19 7320
    NEW 20 Distant Drums - Jim Reeves 20 20 22 25 22 5815
    17 21 I Couldn't Live Without Your Love - Petula Clark 21 30 21 20 20 4735
    19 22 Goin' Back - Dusty Springfield 22 20 21 21 4600
    25 23 Loving You Is Sweeter Than Ever - The Four Tops 23 23 24 24 26 4475
    NEW 24 Got To Get You Into My Life - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 24 18 27 23 3680
    26 25 Ain't Too Proud To Beg - The Temptations 26 25 26 29 24 3245
    24 26 Strangers In The Night - Frank Sinatra 25 28 25 23 27 3240
    NEW 27 Working In The Coal Mine - Lee Dorsey 29 24 28 22 29 3220
    29 28 Give Me Your Word - Billy Fury 28 23 28 30 2385
    28 29 Barefootin' - Robert Parker 27 27 30 26 25 2060
    22 30 Get Away - Georgie Fame and The Blue Flames 30 27 30 28 1355
    Revolver (LP) - The Beatles 19 2400
    How Sweet It is - Junior Walker and The All Stars 26 1000
    Sunny Afternoon - The Kinks 29 500
    Blowin' In The Wind - Stevie Wonder 29 400

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    replied
    I'm being very pedantic here, but the title is: "They're Coming To Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa!"

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    I loved the record at the time as a kid and my parents refused to let me buy it as they said it was still derogative to people with mental health issues so I bought The Small Faces instead. Memories. Memories.

    Leave a comment:


  • Metalweb
    replied
    Wasn't the line about the dog an afterthought - put in to minimise controversy and hopefully avoid airplay bans?

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    replied
    They're Coming To Take Me Away Ha Ha - is actually about a bloke in love with a dog, which has run off! Hence the lines "mutt" and ASPCA - American Society Prevention Cruelty (to) Animals!
    The flip side is the same song backwards!

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    commented on 's reply
    The Official Chart date system is messy. With them using publication dates rather than the week of sales. But I believe they were using the same week system as the others. In fact all the papers came out Thursday. Some later carried the Saturday date after Thursday, but still were in the shops Thursday.
    So the charts went Monday to Saturday - sent out to the papers Monday - compiled and printed for Thursday.
    Then when they changed the release date of records to Friday a few years ago. The Official Chart went back to Thursday for the chart date to give new records a full seven days of sales.

  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers !

    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 20th August 1966.

    Enjoy !

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending August 20th 1966 NME MM DISC RR Total
    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 100 85 Points
    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
    4 1 Yellow Submarine / Eleanor Rigby - The Beatles 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    1 2 With A Girl Like You - The Troggs 2 2 2 2 2 18415
    7 3 God Only Knows - The Beach Boys 3 3 4 3 3 17530
    2 4 Black Is Black - Los Bravos 4 5 3 4 4 17195
    6 5 Mama - Dave Berry 5 4 5 7 5 16510
    3 6 The More I See You - Chris Montez 6 6 6 5 6 15975
    8 7 Summer In The City - The Lovin' Spoonful 7 7 8 6 8 15005
    10 8 Visions - Cliff Richard 8 10 7 9 7 14440
    5 9 Out Of Time - Chris Farlowe 9 9 9 8 9 14070
    26 10 They're Coming To Take Me Away Ha Ha - Napoleon XIV 10 8 11 10 10 13485
    14 11 Hi-Lili Hi-Lo - The Alan Price Set 11 11 10 11 12 12865
    9 12 Love Letters - Elvis Presley 12 13 13 14 11 11500
    16 13 I Saw Her Again - The Mamas and Papas 13= 14 12 12 15 11410
    18 14 Lovers Of The World Unite - David and Jonathan 13= 12 14 13 14 11295
    21 15 More Than Love - Ken Dodd 15 16 15 17 16 9675
    17 16 I Want You - Bob Dylan 16 17 16 15 17 9340
    11 17 I Couldn't Live Without Your Love - Petula Clark 17 20 18 16 13 8480
    NEW 18 All Or Nothing - The Small Faces 18 15 19 18 20 8435
    13 19 Goin' Back - Dusty Springfield 19 19 17 19 19 8120
    15 20 Sunny Afternoon - The Kinks 21 25 20 20 22 5815
    28 21 Just Like A Woman - Manfred Mann 20 22 22 25 18 5755
    12 22 Get Away - Georgie Fame and The Blue Flames 22 26 21 21 21 5350
    NEW 23 Too Soon To Know - Roy Orbison 23 21 28 22 25 4160
    20 24 Strangers In The Night - Frank Sinatra 24 28 23 23 23 4080
    29 25 Loving You Is Sweeter Than Ever - The Four Tops 25 24 25 26 26 3825
    27 26 Ain't Too Proud To Beg - The Temptations 26 23 24 29 29 3720
    19 27 Nobody Needs Your Love - Gene Pitney 27 26 24 24 2545
    NEW 28 Barefootin' - Robert Parker 28 29 29 27 27 1640
    NEW 29 Give Me Your Word - Billy Fury 29 27 30 28 1355
    23 30 I Love How You Love Me - Paul and Barry Ryan 30 27 28 1100
    Revolver (LP) - The Beatles 18 2600
    River Deep Mountain High - Ike and Tina Turner 30 250
    Got To Get You Into My Life - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 30 200
    (Baby) You Don't Have To Tell Me - The Walker Brothers 30 85

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    That's a valid point actually going forward Splodj, thanks. I will keep that in mind should a similar tie appear again. I can't believe that didn't even occur to me at the time.

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    replied
    I see that the Official Chart uses the Thursday as it's date, presumably because that is when RR appeared.

    Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
    When a tie does occur, albeit rarely, because of the greater points system, I break this by favouring whichever was highest placed in the MM chart as it had the highest number of store returns.
    I realise you are referring to the MM Top 30, but on 6-Aug Ken Dodd at 41 was higher than Percy Sledge which had yet to enter the 50. Delving into the lower reaches of the MM chart when necessary might be worth considering as a valid way of tiebreaking.

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    commented on 's reply
    For that to happen, when literally nearly every shop was selling the most copies, implies that what the shops wanted to put down as a best seller was up to them and that some just stuck the album as the top seller. Maybe as little as 7 shops had the album listed, assuming the NME used ALL 200 stores and they gave 30 points to each store!

  • Graham76man
    replied
    Originally posted by Robbie View Post
    In at number 4, one of the best and one of the worst Beatles tracks on one double A side single... the AA side being one of their best. The single was released on Friday 5 August 1966, the same day as the parent album 'Revolver' was also released. I'm assuming the album was an instant number 1 in all the newspaper charts? I notice NME charted it at number 25 on thier Singles chart.
    The problem with using the Week Ending System is that it makes the chart seem slow when you compare it with the release date. But the start of the week, plus if they had a computer system that could have gathered the data fast, would have seen the 13 August Chart broadcastered on Sunday 7 August. Which meant that it was only two days of sales for the Beatles single and album. You at the time would have not seen these charts in the papers till Thursday after the Sunday and Fluff wouldn't play them till 14 of August. This situation continued till Gallup put in place a system that allowed the charts to be issued the day after the last count had taken place. Putting all the papers printing last Sunday's chart and TOTP using the same Sunday chart. Both of course lost out due to them broadcasting or printing what was already known.

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Yeah Eleanor Rigby was without doubt the standout side. Yellow Submarine I always found too banal for my taste.
    Interestingly though it was yet another double sided record that NME chose not to split for chart purposes like they still did with other double sided hits from other artists !!!

    Leave a comment:


  • Metalweb
    replied
    Revolver actually peaks at 18 in next week's NME singles chart.

    Agree about Eleanor Rigby - easily my favourite Beatles track.

    Leave a comment:


  • Robbie
    replied
    In at number 4, one of the best and one of the worst Beatles tracks on one double A side single... the AA side being one of their best. The single was released on Friday 5 August 1966, the same day as the parent album 'Revolver' was also released. I'm assuming the album was an instant number 1 in all the newspaper charts? I notice NME charted it at number 25 on thier Singles chart.

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers !

    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 13th August 1966.

    Enjoy !

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending August 13th 1966 NME MM DISC RR Total
    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 100 85 Points
    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
    1 1 With A Girl Like You - The Troggs 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    3 2 Black Is Black - Los Bravos 2 3 2 2 4 18045
    4 3 The More I See You - Chris Montez 3 4 3 3 3 17580
    NEW 4 Yellow Submarine / Eleanor Rigby - The Beatles 4 2 4 4 8 17205
    2 5 Out Of Time - Chris Farlowe 5 6 5 5 2 16565
    7 6 Mama - Dave Berry 6 5 7 6 6 15825
    11 7 God Only Knows - The Beach Boys 7 7 6 7 5 15660
    13 8 Summer In The City - The Lovin' Spoonful 8 9 8 8 9 14320
    5 9 Love Letters - Elvis Presley 9 8 10 9 7 14090
    14 10 Visions - Cliff Richard 10 10 9 10 12 13415
    9 11 I Couldn't Live Without Your Love - Petula Clark 11 11 13 11 10 12285
    6 12 Get Away - Georgie Fame and The Blue Flames 12 14 12 13 11 11650
    8 13 Goin' Back - Dusty Springfield 13 13 11 15 14 11645
    16 14 Hi-Lili Hi-Lo - The Alan Price Set 14 12 15 12 15 11060
    10 15 Sunny Afternoon - The Kinks 15 15 14 14 13 10680
    22 16 I Saw Her Again - The Mamas and Papas 16 16 16 16 17 9440
    20 17 I Want You - Bob Dylan 17 18 19 17 16 8275
    23 18 Lovers Of The World Unite - David and Jonathan 19 19 17 19 24 7695
    12 19 Nobody Needs Your Love - Gene Pitney 18 21 18 18 19 7570
    19 20 Strangers In The Night - Frank Sinatra 20 20 21 20 20 6735
    30 21 More Than Love - Ken Dodd 21 22 20 22 22 6215
    15 22 River Deep Mountain High - Ike and Tina Turner 23 24 22 21 18 5755
    21 23 I Love How You Love Me - Paul and Barry Ryan 22 23 25 23 21 4750
    17 24 (Baby) You Don't Have To Tell Me - The Walker Brothers 24 26 24 24 23 4130
    18 25 Bus Stop - The Hollies 25 29 23 25 26 3425
    NEW 26 They’re Coming To Take Me Away Ha Ha - Napoleon XIV 26 17 26 3300
    28 27 Ain't Too Proud To Beg - The Temptations 28 28 27 29 29 1970
    NEW 28 Just Like A Woman - Manfred Mann 27 30 26 27 1790
    26 29 Loving You Is Sweeter Than Ever - The Four Tops 29 27 29 30 1400
    NEW 30 Hanky Panky - Tommy James and The Shondells 28 750
    Revolver (LP) - The Beatles 25 1200
    Hideaway - Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick and Tich 27 28 655
    When A Man Loves A Woman - Percy Sledge 30 25 510
    Paperback Writer - The Beatles 28 30 385
    Barefootin' - Robert Parker 30 250

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    To answer your questions guys. Thus far the Ultimate Chart has had around 6 ties usually around the bottom of the chart and one was in the teens. When a tie does occur, albeit rarely, because of the greater points system, I break this by favouring whichever was highest placed in the MM chart as it had the highest number of store returns. I mentioned I would use this method away back in the intro to the thread.

    it was only fair to have the very rare joint 30 above as both held joint 26 on NME and didn't place on any other chart including MM to separate them.

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    replied
    Did MM have a tiebreaker regime? I've always assumed they did, because of the small number of tied places compared with the NME.

    At this time PIck Of The Pops had a contest where Fluff gave a chart position and invited you to write in saying what you thought would be at that number next week. The correct answers were put in a hat from which a prize winner was picked. I imagine if that position was affected by tied points they made sure there was a tiebreak.

    Leave a comment:

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