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  • The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending January 4th 1969 NME MM RR Total
    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 85 Points
    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
    1 1 Lily The Pink - The Scaffold 1 1 1 2 15965
    4 2 Build Me Up Buttercup - The Foundations 2 2 2 3 15430
    8 3 Ob-La-Di-Ob-La-Da - The Marmalade 3 3 5 1 14650
    2 4 One Two Three O'Leary - Des O'Connor 4 4 3 8 14355
    3 5 Ain't Got No..I Got Life - Nina Simone 5= 5 4 7 13990
    5 6 I'm The Urban Spaceman - The Bonzo Dog Doo Dah Band 5= 6 5 5 13710
    6 7 Sabre Dance - Love Sculpture 7= 7 7 6 12925
    12 8 Albatross - Fleetwood Mac 7= 8 8 4 12645
    10 9 Race With The Devil - The Gun 9 10 9 11 11400
    9 10 May I Have The Next Dream With You - Malcolm Roberts 10 9 10 16 10925
    7 11 The Good The Bad And The Ugly - Hugo Montenegro 11 10 11 15 10560
    11 12 I'm A Tiger - Lulu 12 12 12 13 10080
    13 13 A Minute Of Your Time - Tom Jones 14= 13 13 17 9290
    17 14 Son Of A Preacher Man - Dusty Springfield 13 17 14 9 8920
    15 15 Private Number - William Bell and Judy Clay 14= 14 15 14 8845
    16 16 Love Child - Diana Ross and The Supremes 17 15 16 18 8055
    24 17 Something's Happening - Herman's Hermits 16 16 18 10 8035
    14 18 Breaking Down The Walls Of Heartache - The Bandwagon 18 24 17 19 5920
    22 19 Ob-La-Di-Ob-La-Da - The Bedrocks 19 18 23 20 5535
    19 20 Harper Valley P.T.A. - Jeannie C. Riley 22 20 20 26 5375
    23 21 If I Knew Then What I Know Now - Val Doonican 21 19 22 23 5330
    21 22 Elenore - The Turtles 24 22 21 25 4810
    18 23 This Old Heart Of Mine - The Isley Brothers 23 26 19 22 4765
    NEW 24 For Once In My Life - Stevie Wonder 20 23 28 12 3965
    27 25 Stop Her On Sight (SOS) - Edwin Starr 25 21 25 3500
    20 26 Eloise - Barry Ryan 29= 24 1750
    29 27 Don't Forget To Catch Me - Cliff Richard 26 29 29 21 1750
    30 28 Atlantis - Donovan 27 25 30 28 1705
    25 29 Quick Joey Small - The Kasenetz-Katz Singing Orchestral Circus 28 26 27 1590
    26 30 Those Were The Days - Mary Hopkin 27 29 1170
    I'm In A Different World - The Four Tops 27 800
    On Mother Kelly's Doorstep - Danny La Rue 28 600
    Please Don't go - Donald Peers 29 24 595
    Fox On The Run - Manfred Mann 30 200
    Toy - The Casuals 30 85
    28 I Shall Be Released - The Tremeloes
    The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

    The Way It Was Meant To Be

    Comment


    • Absolutely awesome and huge thanks for starting this and finishing it all off. Over 200 pages, and 130,000 views is one of our biggest topics ever here, so thank you for this mammoth project.
      http://thechartbook.co.uk - for the latest are best chart book - By Decade!
      Now including NME, Record Mirror and Melody Maker from the UK and some Billboard charts

      Comment


      • .. and there they are guys, the UAC 1955 to 1969 week by week. I hope I have achieved what I set out to do just over 2 years ago, revisit history, take the BBC charts, add another level to make them more robust, re-compile them to remove errors, and deliver an averaged chart fit for that era.

        That was my role, but it was by no means a one man show. I need to thank every one of you 24 guys who liked and followed this thread from beginning to end. 24 likes is a fantastic achievement on this site. The thread to date has over 130,000 views. In my wildest hopes at the outset I never believed I would achieve anything near that but you all made sure it happened.

        I do need to take this opportunity at the end of this thread to single out and sincerely thank a few names in particular who put their shoulder to the wheel and advised me, supported me through thick, thin, moments of frustration with data etc to make it to the end of this journey.

        RokinRobin - Without him this project would simply not have happened. He devised the spreadsheet for it and amended it along the way as necessary for changes. He also offered hints and tips along the way on what data might be useful in the thread.
        Kingofskiffle - Assisted me with technical help for the thread, advised me as I progressed on chart matters, and gave various mentions to the UAC in his excellent '70 Years Of UK Singles Charts' books
        Kjell - Supplied me with missing chart data and gave lots of practical advice.
        Braindeadpj - This is the guy with a sharp eye for detail without whom some errors would have slipped through the net. He was my safety net for any errors I missed and advised me on corrections needed to ensure the UAC is spot on on accuracy.
        Splodj - Possesses a wealth of background music knowledge, facts, and interesting anecdotes and shared these with us on a daily basis to enrich the chart numbers being presented and make it much more interesting.

        Many others contributed almost daily too, Robbie, Brian, Membrane, Gambo, Metal, to name but a few and there are so many others who made valuable contributions along the way. To each and every one of you a big, big, thanks for following and 'liking' this.

        So this thread ends, but, give me a few weeks to get my breath back and then I'll be back too with a brand new thread 'The Record Mirror Dealer Return Chart' listing every record charted by a dealer and submitted to RM. This will replace my earlier rather crude version which was compiled using a notebook and calculator as the new version will be spreadsheet led with a potential for a Top 50 and possibly Top 100 but not fixed to those numbers if titles exceed those.
        It's a massive undertaking as by the mid fifties I will be drawing data from around 60 dealer charts, all to be input with every record appearing on them.

        FINALLY, some breaking news for you. As you know I had to put this project on hold due to delays in getting to London and due to Covid for two years to extract the raw data from The Newspaper Library as I only currently have the first year of data.
        Well I can now advise it is about to happen. I'm now booked to go down for 5 days from 1st August this year to collect the remainder of the data till its conclusion in March 1961.

        Yip ! It's about to happen !
        The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

        The Way It Was Meant To Be

        Comment


        • Thanks again for creating this thread and seeing it through to the end. What a mammoth undertaking. Hopefully, I caught most (all?) of the errors for you....
          Glad to hear you're going to be able to get to London sooner rather than later in preparation for your next mammoth project!
          I'll certainly miss checking this thread every day (though of course the Record Mirror thread will take its place once started :-))!

          Comment


          • Thanks for sticking with it. It has totally been worthwhile. It's not just the 24 likes on the 1st post, it's the hundreds of likes throughout all these pages that show how much it has been appreciated.

            Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
            .. and there they are guys, the UAC 1955 to 1969 week by week.

            collect the remainder of the data till its conclusion in March 1961.

            Yip ! It's about to happen !
            I do hope you mean up to March 1962, wouldn't want you to miss a year of work

            I do have one small, possibly cheeky, request. The only charts I am missing are the RM album charts so if you are scanning can you catch them as well
            Keep the fire burning like the first time feeling

            Comment


            • Originally posted by BrainDamageII View Post
              Thanks for sticking with it. It has totally been worthwhile. It's not just the 24 likes on the 1st post, it's the hundreds of likes throughout all these pages that show how much it has been appreciated.



              I do hope you mean up to March 1962, wouldn't want you to miss a year of work

              I do have one small, possibly cheeky, request. The only charts I am missing are the RM album charts so if you are scanning can you catch them as well
              Yeah Brain I will scan the album charts too. I said March 61 because unfortunately RM stopped publishing the dealer charts then grrr
              The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

              The Way It Was Meant To Be

              Comment


              • It should say 30 rather than 20 for the UAC on the bridging chart for the December 28th 1968 chart for Donovan.

                Comment


                • MrTibbs
                  MrTibbs commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Corrected David thanks.

              • Thanks for the thread MrTibbs. It has been a great read. The amount of work you have put into the thread over the past two years has been immense and is much appreciated. Now, put your feet up and have a few weeks rest before you head down to London to obtain those dealer charts!

                Comment


                • A big thank-you from me too.

                  If the British Library have put the RMs on microfilm by now your job will be a lot easier, as you'll be able to zap the pages to your email.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Splodj View Post
                    A big thank-you from me too.

                    If the British Library have put the RMs on microfilm by now your job will be a lot easier, as you'll be able to zap the pages to your email.
                    I never thought on that Splodj but I will find out for sure as that would make it quicker and easier. Thanks for that useful hint.
                    The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                    The Way It Was Meant To Be

                    Comment


                    • Brian, thanks again for all your hard dedicated work on this super duper thread !! I can't believe it's been 2 years on this adventure, wow !! Time sure does fly by, getting faster the older we get... So many good comments and thoughts and input by so many, it was a real historical educational experience for all of us. (I just wish Alan Smith had been here to party with us along the way. He's still out there, I heard from him about 2 months ago.)

                      Comment


                      • For your info guys after a few weeks break I intend to start the next Extended RM project mid August so watch out for the new thread around that time.
                        The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                        The Way It Was Meant To Be

                        Comment


                        • What wonderful work Brian, and is now a very important point of reference as well. Congratulations

                          Comment


                          • I have a question. I have done a similar work to yourself, (although by no means as accurate), in relation to the US Charts of the 60s. In the absence of definitive data re sample sizes etc, I utilised a method similar to that employed by the BBC. Although my method for eliminating ties was much more ruthless, I still had to tolerate some tied positions. I am thinking of putting my work into book form and selling it as an ebook. This is something you should seriously consider in respect of your own magnificent effort which I have been following with great interest. If we did publish books containing our average charts, would we be in breach of copyright? Could we be subject to legal action? Have you ever considered this point? Once again your work is to be commended.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Magician View Post
                              I have a question. I have done a similar work to yourself, (although by no means as accurate), in relation to the US Charts of the 60s. In the absence of definitive data re sample sizes etc, I utilised a method similar to that employed by the BBC. Although my method for eliminating ties was much more ruthless, I still had to tolerate some tied positions. I am thinking of putting my work into book form and selling it as an ebook. This is something you should seriously consider in respect of your own magnificent effort which I have been following with great interest. If we did publish books containing our average charts, would we be in breach of copyright? Could we be subject to legal action? Have you ever considered this point? Once again your work is to be commended.
                              Several books exist on Amazon utilising data from the UK charts, both with and without the official charts company guidance. I would suggest that using the entire NME chart as is may be liable to copyright, but simply stating you used it would be fine. The records themselves are not subject to copyright as far as titles, etc go - unless you include images of the artwork. My view, am not a trained lawyer and this is not legal advice.
                              http://thechartbook.co.uk - for the latest are best chart book - By Decade!
                              Now including NME, Record Mirror and Melody Maker from the UK and some Billboard charts

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by kingofskiffle View Post

                                Several books exist on Amazon utilising data from the UK charts, both with and without the official charts company guidance. I would suggest that using the entire NME chart as is may be liable to copyright, but simply stating you used it would be fine. The records themselves are not subject to copyright as far as titles, etc go - unless you include images of the artwork. My view, am not a trained lawyer and this is not legal advice.
                                I used Billboard, Cashbox and Music Vendor/Record World, allocated chart points in the same way that they did to compile the BBC chart so the end product looks nothing like the source charts. The differences between the charts was much greater in some cases than the source charts for the BBC charts. It would be interesting to see how anyone could file a copyright claim but the ingenuity of the legal profession means one must exercise an abundance of caution. I wouldn’t for example do as Mr Tibbs has done and quote the data from the source charts. I wonder who has copyright for the BBC Chart.

                                Comment


                                • As a taster, here is the US Average Top Twenty of sixty years ago. Yes I know this thread relates to the alternative to the POTP chart and I don’t propose to make a habit of it but there is a common thread and I would also encourage Mr Tibbs to put his work in book form.

                                  21 July 1962
                                  1 1 Roses Are Red (My Love) Bobby Vinton
                                  2 4 The Wah Watusi The Orlons
                                  3 3 I Can't Stop Loving You Ray Charles
                                  4 2 The Stripper David Rose and His Orchestra
                                  5 6 Sealed With A Kiss Brian Hyland
                                  6 5 Wolverton Mountain Claude King
                                  7 11 Speedy Gonzales Pat Boone
                                  8 10 Gravy (For My Mashed Potatoes) Dee Dee Sharp
                                  9 16 Ahab, The Arab Ray Stevens
                                  10 19 Breaking Up Is Hard To Do Neil Sedaka
                                  11 12 Johnny Get Angry Joanie Sommers
                                  12 7 Palisades Park Freddy Cannon
                                  13 9 Al Di La' Emilio Pericoli
                                  14 14 Theme From Dr. Kildare (Three Stars Will Shine Tonight) Richard Chamberlain
                                  15 8 It Keeps Right On A-Hurtin' Johnny Tillotson
                                  16 17 Having A Party Sam Cooke
                                  17 Dancin' Party Chubby Checker
                                  18 Twist And Shout The Isley Brothers
                                  19 You'll Lose A Good Thing Barbara Lynn
                                  20 20 I'll Never Dance Again Bobby Rydell

                                  Comment


                                  • I would encourage you to start a new thread with this, as it is a good idea. You can then gauge interest for a book, if thats what you ultimately want to do.
                                    http://thechartbook.co.uk - for the latest are best chart book - By Decade!
                                    Now including NME, Record Mirror and Melody Maker from the UK and some Billboard charts

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by kingofskiffle View Post
                                      I would encourage you to start a new thread with this, as it is a good idea. You can then gauge interest for a book, if thats what you ultimately want to do.
                                      I’ve taken preliminary legal advice. Apparently it wouldn’t be a breach of copyright so I’ll just give it some thought about how best to go about it. Not expecting floods of interest as this whole topic is something of a niche interest. The market would be limited. It would probably have to be an ebook for that reason. Apparently someone has already started a thread on the subject. I was more interested in the concept of putting the material into book form, hence commenting on this thread. I reiterate, the U.K. average chart compiled by Mr Tibbs would be of much more interest, my effort is more akin to the original BBC chart and probably just as prone to errors.

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by Magician View Post
                                        I have a question. I have done a similar work to yourself, (although by no means as accurate), in relation to the US Charts of the 60s. In the absence of definitive data re sample sizes etc, I utilised a method similar to that employed by the BBC. Although my method for eliminating ties was much more ruthless, I still had to tolerate some tied positions. I am thinking of putting my work into book form and selling it as an ebook. This is something you should seriously consider in respect of your own magnificent effort which I have been following with great interest. If we did publish books containing our average charts, would we be in breach of copyright? Could we be subject to legal action? Have you ever considered this point? Once again your work is to be commended.
                                        I have been asked a good few times Magician if I have plans to publish them in an ebook but not thought about it seriously yet to be honest. But who knows lol. I agree with kingofskiffle I too would like to see more of your charts in a thread and thanks too for your kind words of support for this thread.
                                        The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                        The Way It Was Meant To Be

                                        Comment


                                        • Morning All. Just to update you on progress with my next project.

                                          THE RECORD MIRROR CHARTS, REVISED, RE-CALCULATED AND FULLY EXTENDED.

                                          I have now returned from London armed with hours and hours of research into all Record Mirror's Charts from 1954 to 1961 enabling me to begin this long awaited project.
                                          I now have every one of Record Mirror's dealer charts in my possession amounting to over 1500 part pages taken from RM. I was lucky because I had great difficulty in accessing some of the old volumes because they are no longer available for viewing by the public due to their deteriorating and very fragile condition. I had to go to great lengths to prove the purpose of my research before the British Library reluctantly agreed me access and then only under the condition of strict supervised access.

                                          This research also allowed me to copy all RM's Album Charts too from 1956 through March 1962 when it adopted RR as its chart source.

                                          So hopefully tomorrow, or failing that Monday I will open a new thread and give a detailed introduction and outline about the project, methodology, background etc.

                                          I hope all of you who enjoyed the UAC will 'Like' and follow this new thread which will take Record Mirror's charts to a whole new level not seen before.
                                          The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                          The Way It Was Meant To Be

                                          Comment


                                          • It sounds like you had a very fruitful visit to London MrTibbs. Also, it's possible that you could be the last person to be able to access some of those older volumes of Record Mirror. I'm looking forward to the thread!

                                            Comment


                                            • Originally posted by Robbie View Post
                                              It sounds like you had a very fruitful visit to London MrTibbs. Also, it's possible that you could be the last person to be able to access some of those older volumes of Record Mirror. I'm looking forward to the thread!
                                              Yeah Robbie the Head Archivist confirmed that to me. He advised when I had finished with the volumes concerned that they will be filed as and I quote 'Unfit For Use. In Very Poor Condition' until such as a time they can be converted to Microfilm and that is likely to be years down the line due to the amount of documents awaiting this.
                                              The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                              The Way It Was Meant To Be

                                              Comment


                                              • Well done Me Tibbs. There must have been a terrible moment when you thought your visit would be to no avail!

                                                Going back to the copyright issue mentioned a few posts ago ...

                                                If a composite chart is a breach of copyright then I don't understand how Pop Weekly was allowed to publish one for so long, albeit a week late. I assume their UK chart was compiled without permission of the contributory charts as, unlike on POTP, they were not mentioned.

                                                Comment


                                                • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
                                                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending January 4th 1964 BBC NME RM MM Disc RR
                                                  Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart
                                                  Week Week Title and Artist Total Chart Positions 30
                                                  1 1 I Want To Hold Your Hand - The Beatles 1 1 1 1 1
                                                  2 2 Glad All Over - The Dave Clark Five 2 2 2 2 2
                                                  3 3 She Loves You - The Beatles 3 3 3 3 3
                                                  4 4 Dominique - The Singing Nun 6= 5 4 7 7
                                                  7 5 I Only Want To Be With You - Dusty Springfield 5 4 7 5 6
                                                  6 6 You Were Made For Me - Freddie and The Dreamers 4 8 5 4 4
                                                  8 7 Twenty Four Hours From Tulsa - Gene Pitney 6= 6 6 6 5
                                                  5 8 Secret Love - Kathy Kirby 8 7 8 8 9
                                                  11 9 Swinging On A Star - Big Dee Irwin 9 9 9 12 11
                                                  21 10 Hippy Hippy Shake - The Swinging Blue Jeans 10 9 12 10 13
                                                  9 11 Maria Elena - Los Indios Tabajaras 11 11 11 15 8
                                                  14 12 I Wanna Be Your Man - The Rolling Stones 13 12 10 16 15
                                                  10 13 Don't Talk To Him - Cliff Richard 12 12 14 11 10
                                                  12 14 Geronimo - The Shadows 15 14 13 20 12
                                                  13 15 Twist And Shout (EP) - The Beatles 16 17 16 13 15
                                                  16 16 You'll Never Walk Alone - Gerry and The Pacemakers 18 16 15 18 16
                                                  15 17 Kiss Me Quick - Elvis Presley 17 15 19 14 14
                                                  20 18 Chris Sandford - Not Too Little Not Too Much 19 22 18 19 18
                                                  24 19 Stay - The Hollies 21 18 21 28 17
                                                  17 20 The Beatles Hits (EP) - The Beatles 20 19 24 17 20
                                                  18 21 I'll Keep You Satisfied - Billy J Kramer and The Dakotas 22 23 20 21 21
                                                  23 22 We Are In Love - Adam Faith 23 21 22 24 20
                                                  29 23 Money - Bern Elliot and The Fenmen 24 26 17 19
                                                  19 24 All I Want For Christmas Is A Beatle - Dora Bryan 25 27 23 27 24
                                                  22 25 It's Almost Tomorrow - Mark Wynter 26 24 25 25 30
                                                  26 26 Do You Really Love Me Too - Billy Fury 28 25 29 22
                                                  25 27 If I Ruled The World - Harry Secombe 27 26 26 22
                                                  27 28 I (Who Have Nothing) - Shirley Bassey 29 28 25
                                                  NEW 29 What To Do - Buddy Holly 27 28
                                                  NEW 30 At The Palace - Wilfrid Brambell and Harry H Corbett 30= 28 26
                                                  Do You Hear What I Hear - Bing Crosby 30= 23
                                                  Blue Bayou / Mean Woman Blues - Roy Orbison 23
                                                  Country Boy - Heinz 29 27
                                                  Hungry For Love - Johnny Kidd and The Pirates 30 30
                                                  The Beatles No 1 (EP) - The Beatles 29
                                                  From Russia With Love - Matt Monro 29
                                                  I'm In Love - The Fourmost 30
                                                  With The Beatles (LP) - The Beatles 20 9
                                                  Hello Mr Tibbs

                                                  In your post #7 The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending January 4th 1964

                                                  https://www.ukmix.org/forum/chart-di...0#post10418390

                                                  This is specific for the Record Retailer Column

                                                  You have the following..................................................RR

                                                  14 12 I Wanna Be Your Man - The Rolling Stones........15
                                                  13 15 Twist And Shout (EP) - The Beatles....................15

                                                  17 20 The Beatles Hits (EP) - The Beatles...................20
                                                  23 22 We Are In Love - Adam Faith..............................20

                                                  I was not aware that Record Retailer included EP's in their Charts.

                                                  Is this an oversight or can you share the reasoning please.

                                                  The previous weeks charts does not include The Beatles EP's in The Record Retailer Charts

                                                  #2720 Fri May 28, 2021, 04:10

                                                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending December 28th 1963

                                                  https://www.ukmix.org/forum/chart-di...0#post10633760

                                                  The week after
                                                  Week Ending January 11th 1964 does not include The Beatles EP's in The Record Retailer Charts

                                                  #18 Wed June 17, 2020, 23:34

                                                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending January 11th 1964

                                                  https://www.ukmix.org/forum/chart-di...8#post10418798

                                                  I am just curious. Not being critical as I can see this was a monumental effort. Well done.

                                                  Your assistance would be greatfully appreciated.

                                                  I enjoyed reading all your posts.

                                                  Most respectfully

                                                  Germanicus
                                                  Last edited by Germanicus; Fri September 16, 2022, 21:01.

                                                  Comment

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