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The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

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  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 30 for Week Ending 24th October 1964.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending October 24th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    1 1 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 1 1 1 1 2 18965
    6 2 (There's) Always Something There To Remind Me - Sandie Shaw 2 2 2 2 1 18500
    2 3 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 3 6 3 4 4 16995
    4 4 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 4 4 4 5 6 16875
    5 5 When You Walk In The Room - The Searchers 5 7 6 6 3 15930
    3 6 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 6 9 5 3 5 15910
    11 7 Walk Away - Matt Monro 7 5 7 8 7 15540
    9 8 We're Through - The Hollies 8 8 8 7 8 14705
    13 9 The Twelfth Of Never - Cliff Richard 9 3 13 10 13 13730
    16 10 How Soon - Henry Mancini 11 10 9 11 10 13485
    8 11 I'm Crying - The Animals 10 11 10 9 9 13320
    7 12 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 13 14 11 15 12 11615
    10 13 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 12 15 12 13 11 11450
    18 14 One Way Love - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 14 12 16 12 15 10810
    12 15 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 15 16 14 16 14 10195
    27 16 Sha La La - Manfred Mann 16 13 18 14 18 9655
    14 17 Together - P J Proby 17 18 17 17 16 8775
    15 18 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 18 21 15 18 17 8490
    24 19 Um Um Um Um Um Um - Wayne Fontana and The Mindbenders 19 20 22 21 22 6215
    20 20 Maybe I Know - Lesley Gore 20 23 21 22 20 5935
    NEW 21 Baby Love - The Supremes 21 17 19 24 4595
    19 22 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 22 19 26 19 4520
    17 23 Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 24 20 29 21 3800
    NEW 24 He's In Town - The Rockin' Berries 23 19 20 29 3670
    NEW 25 Three Little Words - The Applejacks 25= 24 24 27 3550
    28 26 Reach Out For Me - Dionne Warwick 25= 25 28 30 23 2730
    30 27 Goldfinger - Shirley Bassey 27= 22 30 28 27 2690
    26 28 Summer Is Over - Frank Ifield 28 25 30 2185
    25 29 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 23 2000
    NEW 30 Anyway You Want It - The Dave Clark Five 27= 26 23 1800
    Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 29= 26 25 1760
    You Really Got Me - The Kinks 27 26 1425
    Remember (Walking In The Sand) - The Shangri-Las 29= 27 25 1400
    Is It True - Brenda Lee 29 28 755
    Google Eye - The Nashville Teens 24 700
    Walk Tall - Val Doonican 29 400
    Is It Because - The Honeycombs 30 200

    Leave a comment:


  • Robbie
    replied
    Originally posted by Graham76man View Post
    Membranemusic I have used PDF archive all the time, my blog is full of files uploaded by me with no malware on them at all. From what I know of Norton it's crap.
    If you like you can always E-Mail the file and I will upload it for you to PDF archive. And place the link here. You can always paste the link elsewhere once done. PM me if you want to do that.
    Yes, I can vouch that pdf-archive is a safe site. I'd actually forgotten that I have an account there, I think I set one up after you recommended the site a while ago. It works perfectly fine. The site is funded by advertising so possibly it was one of the adverts that triggered something on Norton. However I use an ad-blocker so don't see any ads anyway.

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    replied
    Membranemusic I have used PDF archive all the time, my blog is full of files uploaded by me with no malware on them at all. From what I know of Norton it's crap.
    If you like you can always E-Mail the file and I will upload it for you to PDF archive. And place the link here. You can always paste the link elsewhere once done. PM me if you want to do that.

    Leave a comment:


  • RokinRobinOfLocksley
    commented on 's reply
    Membrane, try putting it in dropbox then...

  • membranemusic
    commented on 's reply
    Thanks for the tip re pdf-archive, graham76man. Unfortunately, Norton is screaming the word ‘malware’ at me for going there and testing a small document. Does anybody have any other suggestions? Sorry to be ultra-cautious.

  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 30 for Week Ending 17th October 1964.
    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending October 17th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    1 1 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    3 2 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 2= 3 2 3 3 18030
    2 3 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 2= 4 3 2 2 17765
    5 4 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 4 5 4 4 4 16945
    9 5 When You Walk In The Room - The Searchers 5 6 5 5 7 16140
    20 6 (There's) Always Something There To Remind Me - Sandie Shaw 6 2 9 6 11 15500
    4 7 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 7 11 6 7 5 14860
    7 8 I'm Crying - The Animals 8 8 8 8 8 14605
    12 9 We're Through - The Hollies 9 7 10 9 9 14120
    6 10 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 10 13 7 11 6 13725
    15 11 Walk Away - Matt Monro 11 10 11 10 12 12915
    10 12 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 12 16 12 13 10 11335
    22 13 The Twelfth Of Never - Cliff Richard 14 8 16 15 16 11225
    8 14 Together - P J Proby 13 14 14 12 14 10995
    11 15 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 15 15 13 16 13 10730
    18 16 How Soon - Henry Mancini 16 12 15 14 17 10690
    16 17 Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 17 21 17 19 19 7720
    26 18 One Way Love - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 19 17 22 17 23 7130
    13 19 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 18 26 18 18 15 6910
    24 20 Maybe I Know - Lesley Gore 20 18 23 23 21 6250
    14 21 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 21 29 20 22 20 4985
    19 22 Is It True - Brenda Lee 22 23 24 24 22 4815
    17 23 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 23 21 25 18 4205
    NEW 24 Um Um Um Um Um Um - Wayne Fontana and The Mindbenders 24 19 20 29 3670
    25 25 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 28 19 26 3425
    28 26 Summer Is Over - Frank Ifield 26 24 26 29 25 3360
    NEW 27 Sha La La - Manfred Mann 25 20 21 3200
    NEW 28 Reach Out For Me - Dionne Warwick 27 22 30 26 28 2805
    21 29 The Crying Game - Dave Berry 29 25 30 24 2195
    NEW 30 Goldfinger - Shirley Bassy 30 25 27 1600
    She's Not There - The Zombies 28 27 1090
    Come To Me - Julie Grant 27 1000
    Three Little Words - The Applejacks 28 28 900
    Remember (Walking In The Sand) - The Shangri-Las 27 800
    Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 29 500
    Dancing In The Street - Martha and The Vandellas 30 200
    Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 30 85

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 30 for Week Ending 10th October 1964.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending October 10th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    3 1 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    1 2 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 2 2 2 2 2 18415
    2 3 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 3 3 3 3 3 17780
    4 4 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 4 5 4 4 4 16945
    6 5 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 5 4 5 5 5 16710
    5 6 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 6 7 6 6 6 15675
    14 7 I'm Crying - The Animals 7= 6 8 9 10 14735
    9 8 Together - P J Proby 7= 8 10 7 8 14205
    15 9 When You Walk In The Room - The Searchers 10 9 9 12 9 13670
    7 10 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 9 15 7 8 7 13540
    12 11 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 11 11 11 11 11 12700
    19 12 We're Through - The Hollies 12 10 14 10 14 11995
    11 13 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 13 17 12 13 12 10965
    8 14 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 14 18 13 14 16 10075
    22 15 Walk Away - Matt Monro 15 14 18 15 17 9440
    18 16 Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 16 20 15 17 15 8960
    10 17 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 17 22 16 16 13 8580
    24 18 How Soon - Henry Mancini 18 16 21 18 23 7480
    17 19 Is It True - Brenda Lee 19 19 20 22 18 7155
    NEW 20 (There's) Always Something There To Remind Me - Sandie Shaw 21 12 23 19 7000
    13 21 The Crying Game - Dave Berry 20 24 17 20 21 6850
    NEW 22 The Twelfth Of Never - Cliff Richard 23= 13 28 24 30 5135
    16 23 She's Not There - The Zombies 22 30 19 23 20 4935
    27 24 Maybe I Know - Lesley Gore 23= 23 25 25 22 4465
    21 25 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 25 22 26 19 3770
    NEW 26 One Way Love - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 26 20 21 29 3370
    20 27 Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 27 24 27 2150
    NEW 28 Summer Is Over - Frank Ifield 29 27 27 1800
    26 29 Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 28 26 25 1760
    NEW 30 Bye Bye Baby - Tony Jackson 25 1200
    Reach Out For Me - Dionne Warwick 26 1000
    Do Wah Diddy Diddy - Manfred Mann 29 27 840
    A Hard Day's Night - The Beatles 30 28 28 805
    Um Um Um Um Um Um - Wayne Fontana and The Mindbenders 28 29 800
    Such A Night - Elvis Presley 30 24 595
    Questions I Can't Answer - Heinz 29 30 500
    It's Gonna Be Alright - Gerry and The Pacemakers 26 425
    Three Little Words - The Applejacks 30 200

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 3rd October 1964.

    * Denotes an average score awarded to RR, as RR excluded EP's, but the record appeared in all 3 other music paper charts.
    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending October 3rd 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    1 1 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    3 2 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 2 3 2 2 3 18130
    6 3 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 3 2 3 3 4 17895
    2 4 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 4 4 4 4 2 17315
    4 5 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 5 5 5 5 5 16510
    11 6 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 6 6 6 6 7 15790
    8 7 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 7 7 8 7 6 15075
    5 8 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 8 8 7 8 10 14685
    12 9 Together - P J Proby 9 8 9 9 11 14000
    7 10 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 10 13 10 11 8 12805
    9 11 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 11 12 11 10 9 12770
    14 12 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 12 11 13 12 12 12015
    10 13 The Crying Game - Dave Berry 13 16 12 13 13 11080
    19 14 I'm Crying - The Animals 14 10 18 14 15 10510
    23 15 When You Walk In The Room - The Searchers 15 14 15 15 16 10275
    13 16 She's Not There - The Zombies 16 20 14 16 14 9395
    18 17 Is It True - Brenda Lee 17= 18 16 19 18 8655
    20 18 Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 17= 17 17 18 19 8620
    25 19 We're Through - The Hollies 17= 15 19 17 20 8535
    17 20 Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 21 22 21 20 * 6250
    16 21 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 20 23 20 24 17 6240
    27 22 Walk Away - Matt Monro 22 20 23 21 22 5965
    15 23 Do Wah Diddy Diddy - Manfred Mann 23 25 22 22 27 4690
    29 24 How Soon - Henry Mancini 24 19 26 23 4450
    22 25 Such A Night - Elvis Presley 25 27 25 28 21 3450
    24 26 Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 27 24 30 23 2530
    NEW 27 Maybe I Know - Lesley Gore 26 24 30 25 28 2505
    28 28 It's Gonna Be Alright - Gerry and The Pacemakers 29 26 27 26 2425
    21 29 A Hard Day's Night - The Beatles 28 28 26 24 1845
    26 30 It's For You - Cilla Black 30 29 25 1010
    One Way Love - Cliff Bennett and The Rebel Rousers 29 27 800
    Seven Daffodils - The Cherokees 28 600
    Bye Bye Baby - Tony Jackson 30 200
    Three Little Words - The Applejacks 29 200
    You Never Can Tell - Chuck Berry 29 170
    I Should Have Known Better - The Naturals 30 85

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 26th September 1964.

    * Denotes an average score awarded to RR, as RR excluded EP's, but the record appeared in all 3 other music paper charts.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 26th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    2 1 I'm Into Something Good - Heman's Hermits 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    4 2 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 2 3 2 2 2 18215
    8 3 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 3 2 3 5 4 17695
    6 4 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 4 4 5 3 6 16825
    1 5 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 5 6 4 4 5 16660
    13 6 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 6 5 6 6 8 15905
    3 7 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 7 8 7 7 3 15380
    5 8 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 8 7 8 8 7 14890
    9 9 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 9 9 10 9 9 13720
    7 10 The Crying Game - Dave Berry 10 11 9 10 10 13385
    12 11 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 11 10 11 11 11 12900
    19 12 Together - P J Proby 12 12 12 12 13 11980
    11 13 She's Not There - The Zombies 14 14 13 13 16 10975
    16 14 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 13 13 15 15 12 10815
    10 15 Do Wah Diddy Diddy - Manfred Mann 15 17 14 14 15 10110
    18 16 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 16 18 16 17 14 9195
    14 17 Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 17 19 18 16 * 8289
    21 18 Is It True - Brenda Lee 18 20 17 19 17 8090
    27 19 I'm Crying - The Animals 19 15 23 21 20 7135
    26 20 Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 20 16 22 20 22 7115
    15 21 A Hard Day's Night - The Beatles 21 27 19 18 19 6120
    17 22 Such A Night - Elvis Presley 22 25 20 22 18 5955
    NEW 23 When You Walk In The Room - The Searchers 23 22 24 23 21 5200
    22 24 Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 24 28 21 24 25 4310
    NEW 25 We're Through - The Hollies 25 21 27 26 27 3840
    20 26 It's For You - Cilla Black 26= 25 27 23 2580
    NEW 27 Walk Away - Matt Monro 26= 24 25 26 2425
    24 28 It's Gonna Be Alright - Gerry and The Pacemakers 28 26 24 1845
    NEW 29 How Soon - Henrt Mancini 29 23 1600
    NEW 30 Happiness - Ken Dodd 26 1000
    It's All Over Now - The Rolling Stones 30 30 29 28 955
    I Get Around - The Beach Boys 28 30 835
    You Never Can Tell - Chuck Berry 30 29 420
    Come To Me - Julie Grant 29 400
    Maybe I Know - Lesley Gore 28 300
    The Letter - The Long And Short 29 200
    I Should Have Known Better - The Naturals 30 100

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    commented on 's reply
    Yes please. Where do I find it?

    As Brian says, I doubt if the rules are applied consistently. 'Direction of travel' is the usual tiebreaking criteria, but not always - although of course the exceptions may be mistakes.

  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 19th September 1964.

    * Denotes an average score awarded to RR, as RR excluded EP's, but the record appeared in all 3 other music paper charts.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 19th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Total Chart Positions 30 Scored
    2 1 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 1 2 1 2 1 18750
    6 2 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 2 1 2 1 3 18630
    1 3 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 3 4 3 3 2 17665
    8 4 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 4 3 5 4 5 17010
    3 5 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 5 7 4 5 4 16445
    4 6 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 6 5 6 6 7 15990
    5 7 The Crying Game - Daver Berry 7 8 7 8 6 15025
    12 8 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 8 6 9 7 9 14770
    10 9 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 9 9 8 9 10 14135
    7 10 Do Wah Diddy Diddy - Manfred Mann 10 12 10 10 8 13105
    14 11 She's Not There - The Zombies 11 13 11 11 12 12215
    20 12 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 12 11 14 13 13 11580
    30 13 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 13 10 14 14 17 11340
    11 14 Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 14= 14 13 16 * 10820
    9 15 A Hard Day's Night - The Beatles 14= 18 12 12 15 10610
    18 16 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 17= 16 17 18 16 9075
    15 17 Such A Night - Elvis Presley 16 19 18 15 14 8695
    16 18 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 17= 20 19 17 11 8300
    24 19 Together - P J Proby 19 15 20 19 19 8170
    13 20 It's For You - Cilla Black 20 23 16 20 18 7555
    25 21 Is It True - Brenda Lee 21 17 23 21 23 6480
    23 22 Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 22 21 21 23 22 6065
    17 23 I Get Around - The Beach Boys 23 22 22 21 4000
    28 24 It's Gonna Be Alright - Gerry and The Pacemakers 25 24 25 28 24 3795
    21 25 It's All Over Now - The Rolling Stones 24 28 24 26 20 3785
    NEW 26 Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 26 22 25 29 2570
    NEW 27 I'm Crying - The Animals 25 24 1900
    26 28 I Should Have Known Better - The Naturals 26 29 28 1755
    19 29 Tobacco Road - The Nashville Teens 28= 27 27 27 1740
    22 30 Call Up The Groups - The Barron Knights 28= 26 26 1675
    You Never Can Tell - Chuck Berry 27 28 29 25 1460
    How Soon - Henry Mancini 30 27 800
    When You Walk In The Room - The Searchers 29 400
    On The Beach - Cliff Richard 30 250
    Come To Me - Julie Grant 30 200
    We're Through - The Hollies 30 200
    Walk Away - Matt Monro 30 100
    Seven Daffodils - The Mojos 30 85

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Yeah guys, the music paper store returns make a big difference in separating out the multiple ties accurately and fairly, dependant on sample size. As Robin says Splodj the BBC had tie breaker rules but unfortunately they didn't always apply then consistently and changed the rule throughout the years .

    Here is the next chart guys.

    Leave a comment:


  • RokinRobinOfLocksley
    replied
    Splodj, the BBC tie-breaker rules can be found in the BBC chart file as put together by Trevor Ager. Do you need a copy?

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    replied
    But there were 9 other records in the BBC Top 20 which tied on scores and they untied - at positions 5/6, 9/10, 13/14 and 18/19/20. Over several weeks now the vast majority of their ties in the Top 20 have been broken, and I cannot determine a rule for when they don't tiebreak. However in this case I suppose they left number one as a tie because of the sensibility of the top position and the exact symmetry of the scores for the two contenders.

    Leave a comment:


  • Robbie
    replied
    ^
    Very close at the top, just 65 points between the top 2 tracks. The weighting based on individual newspaper charts and the amount of chart return shops per paper proves its worth by separating out the two records which is better than the BBC POTP joint number 1 position.

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 12th September 1964.

    * Denotes an average score awarded to RR, as RR excluded EP's, but the record appeared in all 3 other music paper charts.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 12th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    1 1 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 1= 2 1 1 2 18765
    3 2 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 1= 1 2 2 1 18700
    4 3 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 3 5 3 4 3 17280
    5 4 I Wouldn't Trade You For The World - The Bachelors 4 4 5 3 4 16995
    6 5 The Crying Game - Dave Berry 6 6 4 7 5 16360
    15 6 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 5 3 7 5 7 16240
    2 7 Do Wah Diddy Diddy - Manfred Mann 7 8 5 6 6 15725
    14 8 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 8 9 8 8 8 14405
    7 9 A Hard Day's Night - The Beatles 10 12 9 9 10 13285
    16 10 As Tears Go By - Marianne Faithfull 9 11 10 10 9 13220
    10 11 Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 11 10 13 12 * 12249
    20 12 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 12 7 14 11 18 12155
    8 13 It's For You - Cilla Black 14 14 11 15 11 11700
    19 14 She's Not There - The Zombies 13 13 12 14 12 11665
    17 15 Such A Night - Elvis Presley 15 16 17 13 13 9830
    18 16 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 16 21 15 16 14 8945
    11 17 I Get Around - The Beach Boys 17 20 16 17 15 8710
    25 18 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 22 15 22 22 21 7200
    9 19 Tobacco Road - The Nashville Teens 19 22 19 18 20 7035
    23 20 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 18 19 21 23 16 6975
    13 21 It's All Over Now - The Rolling Stones 20 23 20 19 17 6740
    12 22 Call Up The Groups - The Barron Knights 21 26 18 20 19 6370
    NEW 23 Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 23 18 23 27 22 5765
    NEW 24 Together - P J Proby 24 23 26 25 25 3960
    NEW 25 Is It True - Brenda Lee 25 17 24 30 3585
    28 26 I Should Have Known Better - The Naturals 27 29 25 28 24 2795
    21 27 It's Only Make Believe - Billy Fury 30 30 24 29 2120
    NEW 28 It's Gonna Be Alright - Gerry and The Pacemakers 28= 25 29 28 1655
    29 29 You Never Can Tell - Chuck Berry 28= 29 30 23 1280
    NEW 30 Oh Pretty Woman - Roy Orbison 28 26 1100
    A Hard Day's Night (LP) - The Beatles 26 21 1000
    On The Beach - Cliff Richard 28 27 1090
    I Found Out The Hard Way - The Four Pennies 27 1000
    Bread And Butter - The Newbeats 27 800
    I Just Don't Know What To Do With Myself - Dusty Springfield 26 425
    From A Window - Billy J Kramer and The Dakotas 30 250

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    replied
    Originally posted by membranemusic View Post
    Hello everybody
    I would like to take the liberty in attaching a pdf scan of a press cutting which I think you will agree is relevant to this thread, and to my knowledge has not been available on the internet before now. In terms of the dates you have reached MrTibbs, it is a little premature, but as you are moving so fast and accurately I thought that would be OK. Apologies for not being able to do an A3 scan, and so it is spread across 2 pages.
    Unfortunately the attachment is over the size limit, and perhaps I could get permission to send the pdfs to the moderator or via dropbox etc.
    I would be interested to hear people’s responses, once I can get an upload to the thread.
    Keep on please mrtibbs.
    You can use PDF archive to upload the file. It will not be too big for them. All you need to do is register which is free. Then upload to the site. You can then put a download link to it.
    PDF archive will not delete the file. And they don't charge you for it. Though you can delete it. And it's much better than dropbox and the rest.

    https://www.pdf-archive.com/

    Leave a comment:


  • Graham76man
    replied
    Originally posted by Splodj View Post
    Also in 1964 there was a World In Action television programme about the pop industry (broadcast 22-Sep) which you can see here ...
    https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/...de-1964-online

    The charts are featured from 9.20.

    There is a scene of someone compiling the Melody Maker charts. Interesting to see that the return sheet visible at 9.33 has spaces for a Top 40 to be filled out - but only the Top 16 have been entered!

    Coincidentally the World In Action programme the week before this was on The Sun, on the day that it launched.
    Very interesting, though at times you can't hear what the commenter is saying for the loud music, which is what they used to say at the time
    As you would expect. The chart returns were filled in by the shop girls! I would put the album inclusions to this method. The other accusation of what the dealers want to sell, I have heard before. Still around when BMRB were doing charts. I do think this was true. Just because the way dealers got the records. I at one time and I suspect a lot of people thought that the shops used to get the records from the record companies sort of free paying the record company back a fee of the amount they sold it at. When in fact the dealers were buying in records from record companies and selling them on at a marked up price. But to do this the dealers had to be persuaded to take so many records in the first place. And that was like selling a Beatles record to a Rolling Stones fan. Of course the dealers needed no selling of those big name acts. They knew they could sell them. But anyone new was a different matter. So the record company reps would persuade the dealers in large numbers to take records they didn't like. And to get the public to buy this "crap" record the dealers would make out it was selling at 10, when it was selling at 45! So when it did get into the chart at number 10, the public started to buy it in the large numbers anyway!
    Some dealers or record shops probably broke lots of records into the charts on their own. One I know for certain that had that power was Brian Epstein and that was before the Beatles! In fact it's why Epstein had some clout with EMI. He was that good at predicting what would make the charts, that if he ordered more than the typical amount of a record. It went around quickly that it would be a hit! And a major distribution push went into action on the record.

    Filling in a dealer return would require either a lot of guess work, or somebody to write down stock levels in the shop. But at the end of the day what a store was selling must have been recorded, just to keep the shop stocked with the best sellers. With several stores selling the same records if the public couldn't get it from you they would go somewhere else. So if you haven't ordered enough you would loose money. If a shop had in stock 50 copies of a record at the start of the week and had only 10 left at the end, then they could compile a chart return on that basis. But the temptation would be to say you sold 40, of the 50, when you had only sold 10. And the other shops would do the same. A quick phone call around the area dealers from the other dealers was all that was needed. You could even get a chain going that extend to a wide area, way beyond. Maybe they were like the Freemasons! They could have even been members of these sorts of groups and you could have a big sale on a record that wasn't selling.

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Sorry guys I had the positions on the master chart but omitted to carry over. Have done now. Thanks for noticing that Robin.

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    replied
    Also in 1964 there was a World In Action television programme about the pop industry (broadcast 22-Sep) which you can see here ...
    https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/...de-1964-online

    The charts are featured from 9.20.

    There is a scene of someone compiling the Melody Maker charts. Interesting to see that the return sheet visible at 9.33 has spaces for a Top 40 to be filled out - but only the Top 16 have been entered!

    Coincidentally the World In Action programme the week before this was on The Sun, on the day that it launched.
    Last edited by Splodj; Fri July 3, 2020, 19:37.

    Leave a comment:


  • RokinRobinOfLocksley
    replied
    Membranemusic, bring on your article, it sounds most interesting !!!

    (Brian, on your 29 Aug 64 chart table, the component chart positions for the LP are blank...)

    Leave a comment:


  • Splodj
    commented on 's reply
    31 points would have put it at 19, below Billy J at 18. Looks like just a general hash-up in the calculation.

  • MrTibbs
    replied
    Greetings Pop Pickers ! Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending 5th September 1964.

    * Denotes an average score awarded as RR excluded EP's, but appeared in all 3 other music paper charts.

    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 5th 1964 BBC NME MM Disc RR Total
    Last This Chart Chart Chart Chart Chart Points
    Week Week Title and Artist Number Of Chart Positions 30 Scored
    1 1 Have I The Right - The Honeycombs 1 1 1 1 1 19050
    2 2 Do Wah Diddy Diddy - Manfred Mann 3 3 2 3 4 17945
    4 3 You Really Got Me - The Kinks 2 2 4 2 2 17915
    3 4 I Won't Forget You - Jim Reeves 4 4 3 4 3 17480
    11 5 I Wouldn't Change You For The World - The Bachelors 5 5 5 5 8 16255
    12 6 The Crying Game - Dave Berry 6 6 6 7 5 15860
    5 7 A Hard Day's Night - The Beatles 7 8 7 6 6 15225
    8 8 It's For You - Cilla Black 8 12 8 8 7 13890
    6 9 Tobacco Road - The Nashville Teens 9 11 11 11 14 12445
    13 10 Five By Five (EP) - The Rolling Stones 11 7 15 16 * 11864
    9 11 I Get Around - The Beach Boys 10 16 10 14 9 11820
    7 12 Call Up The Groups - The Barron Knights 15 18 9 17 11 11200
    10 13 It's All Over Now - The Rolling Stones 12 17 12 15 10 10935
    23 14 Rag Doll - The Four Seasons 13= 10 18 10 17 10740
    27 15 I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits 13= 9 19 9 18 10705
    22 16 As Tears Go By Marianne Faithfull 16 13 16 12 15 10610
    17 17 Such A Night - Elvis Presley 17 14 17 13 13 10230
    15 18 I Love You Because - Jim Reeves 18 21 13 18 12 9415
    21 19 She's Not There - The Zombies 19 19 14 19 16 9125
    NEW 20 Where Did Our Love Go - The Supremes 22 15 27 21 5200
    14 21 It's Only Make Believe - Billy Fury 24 26 20 30 21 4700
    16 22 On The Beach - Cliff Richard 23 24 24 24 23 4530
    24 23 The Wedding - Julie Rogers 21 30 21 23 19 4520
    19 24 From A Window - Billy J Kramer and The Dakotas 25= 25 23 28 22 4265
    NEW 25 Everybody Loves Somebody - Dean Martin 27 20 26 26 29 4120
    20 26 I Found Out The Hard Way - The Four Pennies 28 28 22 29 24 3645
    18 27 I Just Don't Know What To Do With Myself - Dusty Springfield 25= 25 22 20 3335
    NEW 28 I Should Have Known Better - The Naturals 29 27 28 25 25 2660
    NEW 29 You Never Can Tell - Chuck Berry 30 23 30 27 2190
    26 30 Wishin' And Hopin' - The Merseybeats 29 30 585
    A Hard Day's Night (LP) - The Beatles 20 22 20 2900
    You'll Never Get To Heaven - Dionne Warwick 26 425
    Together - P J Proby 29 400
    Rhythm And Greens - The Shadows 27 400
    The Ferris Wheel - The Everly Brothers 28 255
    It's Gonna Be Alright - Gerry and The Pacemakers 30 200

    Leave a comment:


  • MrTibbs
    replied
    As I mentioned above i take approx 1.5 hours per chart, and because the spreadsheet does the work for me this is done in just a bit over an hour. I mention this because like you highlight above Splodj where I see an unusual result I like to double check my input figures again to ensure the error is not at my end. It wasn't. Either it was a BBC compilation error like Robin says, and let's remember there were lots of these over the years, or one of those weeks the RR chart was unavailable. at the time of compilation.
    Yes we would be most interested in seeing that article you refer to above membranemusic. I hope you manage to make it accessible for us too.
    I can now confidently say after reviewing 8 months of The Ultimate Averaged Chart that adding the percentages of record store input has most definitely provided a much more accurate chart, impacting on ties and smoothing out anomalies to give a more accurate result.
    This is your chart of the sixties guys !

    Leave a comment:


  • membranemusic
    replied
    Hello everybody
    I would like to take the liberty in attaching a pdf scan of a press cutting which I think you will agree is relevant to this thread, and to my knowledge has not been available on the internet before now. In terms of the dates you have reached MrTibbs, it is a little premature, but as you are moving so fast and accurately I thought that would be OK. Apologies for not being able to do an A3 scan, and so it is spread across 2 pages.

    This is from The Sun and published early in December 1964 and relevant to the chart week ended 28 Nov 1964. The Sun undertook a thorough investigative article about the UK charts and their accuracy. It bears interesting comparison with the Cable 1976 analysis document, also mentioned in this thread. Interestingly The Sun used actual sales from a sample of 71 stores covering 31,000 sales within that week. To their credit, they reported that they asked 250 stores to co-operate.

    Unfortunately the attachment is over the size limit, and perhaps I could get permission to send the pdfs to the moderator or via dropbox etc.

    I would also like to enclose my excel analysis of their reported sales, revealing the points proportional to each chart position. Someone cleverer than I can possibly prepare a logarithmic graph from The Sun’s figures. Note that the paper’s NME reported chart positions are incorrect. The others I think are correct, but they chose not to print the BBC chart positions. The article may have been prepared before the broadcast of the BBC charts that Sunday. I have therefore added the BBC chart as broadcast, and of course unmodified by mrtibbs’ calculations.
    As with the 1976 figures, it reveals the far greater sales proportionately for the top positions, which will endorse mrtibbs’ view of allocating extra points to a No.1.

    I would be interested to hear people’s responses, once I can get an upload to the thread.
    Keep on please mrtibbs.

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