Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • The BMRB seemed to have problems the first few months so maybe a few months prolongation would clarify something. However, it’s more important to get the early sixties done. I share your view of 30 positions. I also see that the average chart 56 - 59 is likely to make a better understanding of the period that Colin Driscoll did in an unstructured way. Do keep up the good work Brian, your produktivitet is amazing.

    Comment


    • The Official Chart seems to have difficulty with the changeover week. Martha Reeves shown as a new entry at 5, when it was actually 4 the previous week.
      https://www.officialcharts.com/chart...19690212/7501/

      Comment


      • Yeah kjell, I agree certainly throughout 1969 the BMRB chart was suspect. It was volatile, fluctuated greatly, had ties from actual record sales which should have been practically impossible. Alan Smith who had contacts at the BMRB advised him that in 1969 in particular they were only getting around 15% of returns that were actually useable for compilation purposes, so I think when you take that into consideration when looking at the 1969 chart it becomes evident that had to be the case.

        Also, when I do 1960 to 1963, I then intend going back and doing 1956, when MM come on stream until 1959 as yes it is important to complete 1956 to February 1969 the 'averaged chart' era.
        THEN for fun I'm going back to 1969 to finish that year and let you see how an averaged chart might have looked had compilation continued considering BMRB, NME, MM.
        Some might say it's mixing oil with water as the BMRB chart was sales versus points for the other two, but it is just for fun and it will be interesting just to see how an averaged chart would have smoothed out its inconsistencies and fluctuations.
        The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

        The Biggest Chart Of The Time

        Comment


        • Splodj there is something very wrong with the 'last' RR chart of February 8th 1969. It is way out of sync with the others, with even Scaffold dropping out of the Top 30 from the Top Ten and yes it does not filter in well with the first week of BMRB.
          The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

          The Biggest Chart Of The Time

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Splodj View Post
            I would be interested to know where the suggestion comes from that NME included advance orders, but it seems more than likely that there were at least two instances where they did.

            Then there was the 11-Dec-65 Melody Maker which set out in detail a justification of why the Beatles ‘Day Tripper / We Can Work It Out’ entered its chart only at number 3. I have not seen the article so do not know if it made an explicit claim about the NME, but it seems that in both cases there is at least an implication that they included advance orders.
            You can buy this edition on eBay for 16. Here is a scan of the article.
            No mention of advance orders.



            There is an interesting UKMix thread here.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
              The first I bought by myself after Christmas in 1963 were The Dave Clark Five, Dusty Springfield and The Beatles I Want To Hold Your Hand with money I got. I had already got She Loves You, and The Twist And Shout EP for Christmas.
              The first record I bought was "You'll never walk alone" by Gerry and the Pacemakers, only because "She loves you" had sold out and no more copies were available until 2 weeks later.

              Comment


              • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                There are 13 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart and The Ultimate Averaged Chart

                Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending April 20th 1968

                The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending April 20th 1968 NME MM RR Total
                Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 85 Points
                Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                2 1 What A Wonderful World - Louis Armstrong 1 1 1 2 15965
                1 2 Congratulations - Cliff Richard 2 2 2 1 15600
                5 3 If I Only Had Time - John Rowles 3 3 3 3 14980
                3 4 Delilah - Tom Jones 4 4 4 4 14445
                8 5 Simon Says - The 1910 Fruitgum Company 5 5 5 5 13910
                4 6 Lady Madonna - The Beatles 6 6 6 6 13375
                11 7 Can't Take My Eyes Off You - Andy Williams 8 8 7 10 12385
                14 8 Jennifer Eccles - The Hollies 7 7 9 7 12340
                6 9 (Sittin' On) The Dock Of The Bay - Otis Redding 9 9 8 8 12105
                7 10 Step Inside Love - Cilla Black 10 10 10 9 11320
                9 11 If I Were A Carpenter - The Four Tops 11 12 12 11 10250
                13 12 Valleri - The Monkees 12 13 11 12 10215
                12 13 Ain't Nothin' But A Houseparty - The Showstoppers 13 11 16 14 9195
                18 14 Something Here In My Heart - The Paper Dolls 15 14 13 18 9005
                16 15 Captain Of Your Ship - Reparata and The Delrons 14 15 14 15 8810
                21 16 I Can't Let Maggie Go - The Honeybus 16 16 17 13 8030
                10 17 Cinderella Rockefella - Esther and Abi Ofarim 17 18 15 16 7875
                20 18 Cry Like A Baby - The Box Tops 18 19 18 17 6840
                17 19 Love Is Blue - Paul Mauriat 19 21 19 19 6020
                26 20 Somewhere In The Country - Gene Pitney 20 20 20 25 5460
                NEW 21 Lazy Sunday - The Small Faces 24 17 24 4550
                15 22 The Legend Of Xanadu - Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick and Tich 21 23 23 21 4450
                NEW 23 White Horses - Jacky 22 24 22 22 4415
                19 24 Rosie - Don Partridge 23 26 25 20 3435
                NEW 25 I Don't Want Our Loving To Die - The Herd 26 22 26 27 3390
                25 26 Little Green Apples - Roger Miller 25 30 21 23 3380
                NEW 27 Hello How Are You - The Easybeats 27 25 28 26 2375
                28 28 Jumbo / The Singer Sang His Song - The Bee Gees 29 30 27 29 1370
                29 29 Forever Came Today - Diana Ross and The Supremes 30 27 29 1300
                30 30 Rock Around The Clock - Bill Haley and The Comets 28 29 24 995
                Pretty Brown Eyes - Jim Reeves 28 600
                Me The Peaceful Heart - Lulu 30 28 505
                She Wears My Ring - Solomon King 30 85
                The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                Comment


                • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                  The divine Honey from Bobby Goldsboro enters mmmmmm !

                  There are 15 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart and The Ultimate Averaged Chart

                  Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending April 27th 1968

                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending April 27th 1968 NME MM RR Total
                  Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 85 Points
                  Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                  1 1 What A Wonderful World - Louis Armstrong 1 1 1 1 16050
                  2 2 Congratulations - Cliff Richard 2 2 3 2 15265
                  3 3 If I Only Had Time - John Rowles 4 4 2 4 14945
                  5 4 Simon Says - The 1910 Fruitgum Company 3 3 4 3 14730
                  7 5 Can't Take My Eyes Off You - Andy Williams 5 6 5 6 13625
                  8 6 Jennifer Eccles - The Hollies 6 5 6 7 13490
                  4 7 Delilah - Tom Jones 7 7 7 5 13010
                  21 8 Lazy Sunday - The Small Faces 8 8 9 10 11885
                  14 9 Something Here In My Heart - The Paper Dolls 10 10 8 12 11565
                  16 10 I Can't Let Maggie Go - The Honeybus 9 11 10 8 11205
                  13 11 Ain't Nothin' But A Houseparty - The Showstoppers 11 9 13 11 10600
                  9 12 (Sittin' On) The Dock Of The Bay - Otis Redding 12 13 11 18 9705
                  18 13 Cry Like A Baby - The Box Tops 13 15 12 15 9310
                  6 14 Lady Madonna - The Beatles 16 12 17 9 9170
                  15 15 Captain Of Your Ship - Reparata and The Delrons 14 14 15 13 8930
                  10 16 Step Inside Love - Cilla Black 15 17 14 14 8495
                  12 17 Valleri - The Monkees 17 16 16 16 8025
                  23 18 White Horses - Jacky 18 22 18 19 6070
                  11 19 If I Were A Carpenter - The Four Tops 19 23 19 17 5790
                  20 20 Somewhere In The Country - Gene Pitney 21 20 20 23 5630
                  25 21 I Don't Want Our Loving To Die - The Herd 20 18 22 22 5615
                  26 22 Little Green Apples - Roger Miller 22 21 21 25 5010
                  NEW 23 A Man Without Love - Engelbert Humperdinck 25 19 26 26 4075
                  17 24 Cinderella Rockefella - Esther and Abi Ofarim 23 24 24 21 4000
                  27 25 Hello How Are You - The Easybeats 24 28 23 20 3535
                  19 26 Love Is Blue - Paul Mauriat 26 27 25 24 2895
                  29 27 Forever Came Today - Diana Ross and The Supremes 27 26 27 28 2255
                  NEW 28 Honey - Bobby Goldsboro 28 25 30 1450
                  30 29 Rock Around The Clock - Bill Haley and The Comets 28 750
                  28 30 Jumbo / The Singer Sang His Song - The Bee Gees 29 29 29 670
                  Rosie - Don Partridge 29 30 485
                  The Legend Of Xanadu - Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick and Tich 30 27 340
                  Peggy Sue - Buddy Holly 30 200
                  The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                  The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                  Comment


                  • Although I was still very young (pre-school age) at this point I do know the vast majority of records in the above chart. However I've never heard of John Rowles or his top 3 hit 'If I Only Had Time'.

                    The vocal styling of Steve Marriott on 'Lazy Sunday' seems to have been the blueprint for Damon Albarn's (of Blur) vocal style. Good song.

                    I remember 'Honey' from its second time of being a hit, in 1975. It's a bit maudlin and sickly sweet but I can see the appeal of the song. I remember (in 1975) Tony Blackburn on Radio 1 seemed to have a soft spot for the song.

                    'White Horses' by Jacky brings back lovely childhood memories to me. I used to watch "The White Horses" when it was repeated on BBC1 during what must have been every summer holidays during the 1970s. Only 13 episodes were ever made and were dubbed from German into English. The BBC wiped all the dubbed episodes in the late 1970s but 12 still survive as audio only and part of one episode exists as an off-air recording and is (or was) on YouTube. But the theme tune - wow, it's excellent. It's so evocative of my childhood. In the early days of YouTube I made a comment on an upload of the song that Jackie Lee herself had made, saying how it lovely the song was. I got a reply from Miss Lee herself thanking me for my comments.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by brian05 View Post
                      You can buy this edition on eBay for 16. Here is a scan of the article.
                      No mention of advance orders.
                      Thanks - interesting to read the article and see that there is no mention of NME (and Disc) putting the record straight in at number one.

                      Comment


                      • "White Horses" is indeed instantly familiar to anyone of an age to be watching children's television in the late 60s, though I've no memory at all of the programme itself.

                        I'm sure John Otway, no less, once called "Honey" (which he covered) the saddest song ever written. I like it too, but then I've always been a "death disc" fan for some reason! We tend to associate them mostly with the early 60s but their chart heyday was the mid 70s. From memory I'm sure there was one week in early '74 when the whole Top 3 (Terry Jacks, Paper Lace, Hot Chocolate) were death discs. The re-release of "Honey" was riding this wave, as was SAHB's cover of "Delilah" around the same time.

                        Easybeat's "Hello How Are You" may have only been a minor hit but I bet Jeff Lynne was a fan - it's an obvious influence on ELO's "Telephone Line"!

                        Comment


                        • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                          1968 just keeps getting better. All 3 new entries this week are belters. Scott Walker does Rod McKuen's Joanna, gorgeous ballad, Love Affair's Rainbow Valley, I remember spinning around on the waltzers at the fair with that one blaring out, and Union Gap's Young Girl, the sound of summer 1968.

                          There are 9 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart and The Ultimate Averaged Chart

                          Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending May 4th 1968

                          The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending May 4th 1968 NME MM RR Total
                          Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 85 Points
                          Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                          1 1 What A Wonderful World - Louis Armstrong 1 1 1 1 16050
                          4 2 Simon Says - The 1910 Fruitgum Company 2 2 2 2 15515
                          3 3 If I Only Had Time - John Rowles 4 4 3 4 14695
                          8 4 Lazy Sunday - The Small Faces 3 3 5 3 14480
                          2 5 Congratulations - Cliff Richard 5 5 4 6 14075
                          5 6 Can't Take My Eyes Off You - Andy Williams 6 6 6 5 13460
                          6 7 Jennifer Eccles - The Hollies 7 8 7 8 12555
                          23 8 A Man Without Love - Engelbert Humperdinck 8 7 10 7 12090
                          9 9 Something Here In My Heart - The Paper Dolls 10 10 9 11 11400
                          10 10 I Can't Let Maggie Go - The Honeybus 9 13 8 9 11220
                          7 11 Delilah - Tom Jones 11 12 11 10 10585
                          21 12 I Don't Want Our Loving To Die - The Herd 12 11 13 12 10115
                          11 13 Ain't Nothin' But A Houseparty - The Showstoppers 13 9 15 13 9930
                          13 14 Cry Like A Baby - The Box Tops 14 14 12 15 9510
                          18 15 White Horses - Jacky 15 15 14 14 8895
                          15 16 Captain Of Your Ship - Reparata and The Delrons 16 18 17 17 7290
                          20 17 Somewhere In The Country - Gene Pitney 18 19 16 19 7170
                          28 18 Honey - Bobby Goldsboro 19 16 19 20 6935
                          NEW 19 Young Girl - The Union Gap 17 17 20 16 6825
                          17 20 Valleri - The Monkees 20 22 18 18 6155
                          25 21 Hello How Are You - The Easybeats 21 20 21 23 5380
                          22 22 Little Green Apples - Roger Miller 22 21 23 22 4765
                          12 23 (Sittin' On) The Dock Of The Bay - Otis Redding 23 24 22 21 4500
                          14 24 Lady Madonna - The Beatles 24 23 25 26 3525
                          16 25 Step Inside Love - Cilla Black 25 26 24 27 3090
                          27 26 Forever Came Today - Diana Ross and The Supremes 27 25 26 28 2705
                          NEW 27 Rainbow Valley - The Love Affair 26 27 27 24 2395
                          19 28 If I Were A Carpenter - The Four Tops 28 28 28 25 1860
                          24 29 Cinderella Rockefella - Esther and Abi Ofarim 29 29 29 670
                          NEW 30 Joanna - Scott Walker 30 29 400
                          Love Is Blue - Paul Mauriat 30 30 335
                          Sleepy Joe - Herman's Hermits 30 200
                          The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                          The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
                            Greetings Pop Pickers !

                            Sleepy Joe - Herman's Hermits
                            Talk about being ahead of your time. A song about him 52 years before he becomes president
                            Keep the fire burning like the first time feeling

                            Comment


                            • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                              There are just 5 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart and The Ultimate Averaged Chart.

                              As Brain mentioned in comes Sleepy Joe, and another 1968 gem from Julie Driscoll etc which later became the theme for Absolutely Fabulous. Rock on Patsy and Edina.

                              Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending May 11th 1968.

                              The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending May 11th 1968 NME MM RR Total
                              Last This The Sound Survey Stores 200 250 85 Points
                              Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                              1 1 What A Wonderful World - Louis Armstrong 1 1 1 1 16050
                              2 2 Simon Says - The 1910 Fruitgum Company 2= 2 2 3 15430
                              4 3 Lazy Sunday - The Small Faces 2= 3 2 2 15315
                              8 4 A Man Without Love - Engelbert Humperdinck 4 4 4 4 14445
                              19 5 Young Girl - The Union Gap 5 5 5 7 13740
                              18 6 Honey - Bobby Goldsboro 6 6 6 9 13120
                              12 7 I Don't Want Our Loving To Die - The Herd 7 8 8 5 12560
                              6 8 Can't Take My Eyes Off You - Andy Williams 8 9 7 6 12525
                              3 9 If I Only Had Time - John Rowles 9 7 9 8 12255
                              5 10 Congratulations - Cliff Richard 10 10 10 11 11150
                              15 11 White Horses - Jacky 11 11 11 12 10615
                              7 12 Jennifer Eccles - The Hollies 12 13 13 10 9885
                              9 13 Something Here In My Heart - The Paper Dolls 13 15 12 13 9480
                              10 14 I Can't Let Maggie Go - The Honeybus 14 14 14 14 9095
                              13 15 Ain't Nothin' But A Houseparty - The Showstoppers 15 12 16 16 8825
                              14 16 Cry Like A Baby - The Box Tops 16 16 15 17 8190
                              11 17 Delilah - Tom Jones 17 17 18 15 7410
                              27 18 Rainbow Valley - The Love Affair 18 18 17 18 7205
                              17 19 Somewhere In The Country - Gene Pitney 19 19 19 20 6335
                              21 20 Hello How Are You - The Easybeats 20 21 21 21 5350
                              22 21 Little Green Apples - Roger Miller 21 26 20 19 4770
                              30 22 Joanna - Scott Walker 22 20 24 23 4630
                              NEW 23 Sleepy Joe - Herman's Hermits 23 23 27 22 3365
                              26 24 Forever Came Today - Diana Ross and The Supremes 25 27 22 28 3305
                              NEW 25 This Wheel's On Fire - Julie Driscoll and The Brian Auger Trinity 24 25 26 26 2875
                              16 26 Captain Of Your Ship - Reparata and The Delrons 26 23 24 2595
                              20 27 Valleri - The Monkees 27 25 27 1840
                              NEW 28 Helule Helule - The Tremeloes 28 22 1800
                              NEW 29 Do You Know The Way To San Jose - Dionne Warwick 30 24 1400
                              23 30 (Sittin' On) The Dock Of The Bay - Otis Redding 29 28 25 1260
                              Rock Around The Clock - Bill Haley and The Comets 30 29 29 870
                              Wonderboy - The Kinks 28 600
                              When We Were Young - Solomon King 29 400
                              If I Were A Carpenter - The Four Tops 30 250
                              Step Inside Love - Cilla Black 30 85
                              The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                              The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                              Comment


                              • What an era for music, every week a classic song is entering the charts. This week it's 'Do You Know The Way To San Jose' by Dionne Warwick. It's one of those songs I can never get out of my head for days after hearing it.

                                Two songs at number 2 on the POTP chart and this is down to there being a tie on the Melody Maker chart. Sadly the Ultimate Averaged Chart gives the nod to 'Simon Says' ahead of the excellent 'Lazy Sunday'. Had POTP operated a tie-break system for this week which record would have been at number 2?

                                Comment


                                • Lazy Sunday would have been number 2, because it had risen from 3 the previous week. Using the same 'trend' method the Bee Gees would have been number one in the week of the infamous 3-way tie.

                                  But as you have shown, Billboard reported that Robin Scott (controller of Radios 1 and 2) before then had already met with BMRB and been presented with their plans for a sales based chart. The problem he would have had was getting internal BBC approval for the significant increase in cost. I cannot help thinking that ties were at that time allowed more than before because they wanted to show a new chart was needed.

                                  Incidentally although the BBC's Robin Scott was not the Pop Muzic one, he did co-write a number one in 1955 - Softly Softly by Ruby Murray.

                                  Comment


                                  • It would have been wrong though on the 31st August to place the Bee Gees at #1 on the upcoming 31st August chart given that it wasn't #1 on any individual chart, whereas The Beach Boys and Herb Alpert were.

                                    Sales wise it is generally thought that Herb Alpert did just pip the opposition on this week. Dave Taylor agreed backed by supplementary information from E.M.I. who compiled their own chart by averaging similar to the BBC but additionally sampled a further 10% of shops. This indicated Herb Alpert on top.
                                    Simon v Sunday, I too prefer Sunday and was disappointed to see Simon nudge ahead, but in any chart we have to accept that sometimes sales or points are close and sometimes our favourites lose out in the objective process.

                                    The BBC process for breaking ties was haphazard at best, one minute one system was used, and the next minute another, plus, you objectively can't use a chart position or direction of travel from another week to influence the current week as the two don't correlate.
                                    Only actual sales would determine which was the sales leader and sadly as we have so often lamented those don't exist week by week from back then.
                                    That is why I believe the best, and I say just best, not the precise, way to break a tie for the time retrospectively is simply to use the chart which used the biggest sample. For this period the MM.
                                    The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                    The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                                    Comment


                                    • There is a special TOTP supplement in Music Week to celebrate it's 25th anniversary - click here. Scroll down to page 25.
                                      Some great photographs.

                                      Comment


                                      • The real popularity of a single has since the 1940s been the willingness to pay for it, so the charts should really be based on sales that early. It’s almost unbelievable that an industry of music with their fantastic fortunes took over a quarter of a century to make a sales based chart, and for starters an unusable one too. In fact, even as late as 69 the points chart with the biggest sample was better. Even in the seventies it happened that MM and NME proved to have the right number one record according to weekly sales figures while the OCC failed. The biggest sample is right almost every time.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by Splodj View Post

                                          Thanks - interesting to read the article and see that there is no mention of NME (and Disc) putting the record straight in at number one.
                                          Let's face it the paper wasn't going to admit the chart was wrong. And with 8,000 shops picking a few at random, or was it random? Might easily prove the point.
                                          I loved the "posh" area shop only selling three copies!
                                          Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                                          Comment


                                          • Originally posted by kjell View Post
                                            The real popularity of a single has since the 1940s been the willingness to pay for it, so the charts should really be based on sales that early. It’s almost unbelievable that an industry of music with their fantastic fortunes took over a quarter of a century to make a sales based chart, and for starters an unusable one too. In fact, even as late as 69 the points chart with the biggest sample was better. Even in the seventies it happened that MM and NME proved to have the right number one record according to weekly sales figures while the OCC failed. The biggest sample is right almost every time.
                                            I don't agree with that at all. I haven't done 1969 charts yet. But by 1970 BMRB were nearly on the ball. Whereas NME and Melody Maker's points charts were slow and off by miles. The key is the TOTP effect on sales. Records nearly always go up the chart after TOTP. The BMRB chart by 1970 was responding to this nearly all the time. The other two put records from TOTP at say 30 when BMRB put them in the 20. I have already detected a few faults in the BMRB chart for 1970 (up to March). But they are not common. And probably down to some shops being missed out on in certain weeks causing fall outs or drops, then coming back.
                                            One effect that nobody would know about till now, is that the Archies follow up single to Sugar Sugar - called Jingle Jangle, missed out on a chart position due to either retailers putting in the old single as selling instead of the new one. Or BMRB doing the same thing.
                                            Not as bad as Gallup counting the sales of KP salted peanuts in the chart (mentioned on a Radio One show after the Sunday chart once). They removed the "nuts" before publishing the chart!
                                            Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                                            Comment


                                            • Originally posted by Graham76man View Post
                                              Let's face it the paper wasn't going to admit the chart was wrong.
                                              But anyone reading the article who was not aware of the context (NME putting them in at number one) would have been perplexed at why Epstein was singling out MM for criticism.

                                              Comment


                                              • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
                                                It would have been wrong though on the 31st August to place the Bee Gees at #1 on the upcoming 31st August chart given that it wasn't #1 on any individual chart, whereas The Beach Boys and Herb Alpert were.
                                                The BBC wouldn't have done it anyway because they never applied their tiebreaker regime to number one.

                                                However the fact that it was not number one in any of their constituent charts did not prevent the BBC from making it a joint number one and (given that they were not going to tiebreak) I think they were right to do so. This also suggests that it would not have prevented them from making it outright number one had it been ahead on points, and again I think they would have been right to do so.

                                                Comment


                                                • Yeah the BBC system was wrong that week on so many levels. It was a perfect example of how the points alone system was weak. When considering a no 1 single how could they possibly consider a single that wasnt no 1 on any chart. It doesnt make sense. Their joint no 1 that week should have been just Beach Boys and Herb.
                                                  The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                                  The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                                                  Comment


                                                  • Originally posted by Splodj View Post
                                                    But anyone reading the article who was not aware of the context (NME putting them in at number one) would have been perplexed at why Epstein was singling out MM for criticism.
                                                    The media is a small world, for some reason they all turn up to the same events and the music press at that time would feed off each other. They paper was probably more interested in what it's rivals said and did then what the readers thought about things. If you were in the music business then, the paper would consider your thoughts and views. If you were a teen buying records then you were nobody to them.

                                                    The media hasn't changed much, just the way we get information has. The news media for example sees experts and victims. Experts being MP's, doctors or in some form of profession. And the victims are the rest of us.
                                                    Epstein was an expert, so had to be questioned or listened to. If Joe Blogs said something about the Beatles not being top he or she was ignored. Only if Joe Blogs was stopped from getting to the top would he be listened to, but as a victim then, not an expert.
                                                    Epstein was attacked by the media when the first Beatles single hit the shops. They accused him and his shops for hyping the record into the charts. Chances are that it was one of the Music press that started the rumour. Maybe Melody Maker itself. Perhaps this was still a sore point, with either Epstein or the paper?
                                                    Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                                                    Comment

                                                    Working...
                                                    X