The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

There are 9 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending March 5th 1960.

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending March 5th 1960								NME	RM	MM	DISC	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	80	60	38	50	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
2	1	Poor Me - Adam Faith					1	1	1	2	3	6702
1	2	Why - Anthony Newley					2	2	3	1	1	6640
7	3	Running Bear - Johnny Preston					3	3	2	3	6	6294
3	4	A Voice In The Wilderness - Cliff Richard					4	5	4	4	2	6176
6	5	On A Slow Boat To China - Emile Ford and The Checkmates					5	4	5	5	4	6058
4	6	Way Down Yonder In New Orleans - Freddy Cannon					6=	6	6	7	7	5612
5	7	Pretty Blue Eyes - Craig Douglas					6=	7	8	6	5	5550
19	8	Delaware - Perry Como					8	8	7	8	11	5154
8	9	Beyond The Sea (La Mer) - Bobby Darin					9	10	10	9	8	4926
10	10	Be Mine - Lance Fortune					10	11	9	10	10	4768
14	11	Bonnie Came Back - Duane Eddy					14	12	12	16	16	3980
16	12	You Got What It Takes - Marv Johnson					15	12	14	18	13	3934
9	13	Starry Eyed - Michael Holliday					12=	14	18	13	9	3924
11	14	Harbour Lights - The Platters					12=	14	17	11	12	3910
12	15	Summer Set - Mr. Acker Bilk					11	9	11	12		3682
20	16	Who Could Be Bluer - Jerry Lordan					16	16	16	17	20	3182
24	17	Royal Event - Russ Conway					18=	17	15		18	2730
15	18	What Do You Want To Make Those Eyes At Me For - Emile Ford and The Checkmates					17	21		14	14	2296
13	19	Misty - Johnny Mathis					18=	20		15	15	2288
NEW	20	Theme From 'A Summer Place' - Percy Faith					20	18	13			2120
NEW	21	Hit And Miss - The John Barry Seven						24	20	19		1676
23	22	Let It Be Me - The Everly Brothers						19			19	1560
NEW	23	California Here I Come - Freddy Cannon						25	19			1200
25	24	Be My Guest - Fats Domino						22				720
18	25	What Do You Want - Adam Faith									17	700
NEW	26	What In The World's Come Over You - Jack Scott							20			660
27	27	Lucky Devil - Frank Ifield						23				640
NEW	28	Looking High High High - Bryan Johnson								20		418
26	29	Rawhide - Frankie Laine						26				400
17	30	Heartaches By The Number - Guy Mitchell						27				320
		El Paso - Marty Robbins						28				240
		Time And The River - Nat King Cole						29				160
		Oh Carol - Neil Sedaka						29				160

[MrTibbs]

Chart Commentary

In comes one of my all time favourite instrumentals this week, the wonderful Theme From A Summer Place by Percy Faith.
What a record !!! So evocative.

In too comes The Juke Box Jury theme, Hit And Miss from The John Barry Seven.

The UK Eurovision song contest entry enters too at 28. Least said about that one the better !

[Splodj]

In too comes The Juke Box Jury theme, Hit And Miss from The John Barry Seven.

Still sounds good! I think they were the 'John Barry Seven plus Four' then.

“Coming up next, ‘Juke Box Jury’. Except for viewers in Scotland who will have their own sports programme.”

I heard an interview with David Jacobs in which he said that he threatened to sue the BBC when he heard that they were going to do the show with Pete Murray as chairman, because he had previously presented the idea to the BBC who turned it down. They settled the issue by making him chairman instead.

One feature I liked was how the ‘hit’ bell was on the desk and the shameful ‘miss’ buzzer underneath.

[MrTibbs]

Yeah we seemed to get it at a different time up here.

I loved the novelty of the jukebox. David Jacobs pressed a button and a record was selected and placed on the turntable. It was a nice touch although of course it wasn't what we were about to hear.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

There are again 9 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending March 12th 1960.

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending March 12th 1960								NME	RM	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	80	60	38	50	30	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC				TOP	30	Scored
1	1	Poor Me - Adam Faith					1	1	2	1	1	1	7680
3	2	Running Bear - Johnny Preston					2	2	1	2	2	2	7542
8	3	Delaware - Perry Como					3	3	3	4	4	8	6986
5	4	On A Slow Boat To China - Emile Ford and The Checkmates					4	4	4	5	5	3	6908
2	5	Why - Anthony Newley					5	5	6	3	6	4	6704
4	6	A Voice In The Wilderness - Cliff Richard					6	8	5	6	3	10	6380
7	7	Pretty Blue Eyes - Craig Douglas					7=	11	8	7	7	6	5842
6	8	Way Down Yonder In New Orleans - Freddy Cannon					7=	6	10	9	8	12	5816
12	9	You Got What It Takes - Marv Johnson					9=	9	9	8	13	7	5574
15	10	Summer Set - Mr. Acker Bilk					11	10	11	11	9	5	5520
10	11	Be Mine - Lance Fortune					9=	12	7	10	10	11	5408
20	12	Theme From 'A Summer Place' - Percy Faith					13	7	12	16	19	16	4680
9	13	Beyond The Sea (La Mer) - Bobby Darin					12	14	15	13	11	9	4664
16	14	Who Could Be Bluer - Jerry Lordan					14	15	14	17	12	17	4202
26	15	What In The World's Come Over You - Jack Scott					15	13	13	12		20	3572
17	16	Royal Event - Russ Conway					17	16	16		18	15	3230
11	17	Bonnie Came Back - Duane Eddy					18	18	19		14	13	3150
14	18	Harbour Lights - The Platters					16	19		14	15	18	2796
21	19	Hit And Miss - The John Barry Seven					19=	22	16		16	26	2520
28	20	Looking High High High - Bryan Johnson					19=	16		20	17		2318
NEW	21	Colette - Billy Fury						26	18	15		22	2058
23	22	California Here I Come - Freddy Cannon						20	20	18			2034
13	23	Starry Eyed - Michael Holliday						25			20	14	1540
22	24	Let It Be Me - The Everly Brothers						21				19	1160
NEW	25	Fings Ain't Wot They Used To Be - Max Bygraves						23					640
NEW	26	Wild One - Bobby Rydell						23					640
NEW	27	Darktown Strutters' Ball - Joe Brown						29		19			616
19	28	Misty - Johnny Mathis						27				25	500
30	29	Heartaches By The Number - Guy Mitchell										21	300
NEW	30	Teen Angel - Mark Dinning						28					240
		What Do You Want To Make Those Eyes At Me For - Emile Ford and The Checkmates										23	240
		What Do You Want - Adam Faith										24	210
		Time And The River - Nat King Cole										27	120
		Rawhide - Frankie Laine										28	90
		Be My Guest - Fats Domino						30					80
		El Paso - Marty Robbins										29	60
		Little White Bull - Tommy Steele										30	30
		* RR started publishing a chart from this week and is also included from this week, so this chart is now a first, an averaged chart based on all 5 charts not just the 4 used by the BBC.

[MrTibbs]

Chart Commentary

RR starts to publish a chart this week based on just 30 returns. So this means The Ultimate Averaged Chart is now compiled from 5 music papers, giving an averaged chart never before compiled. Enjoy !

Incidentally, in an era of Elvis, Everly Bros etc Percy Faith's Summer Place will be America's biggest selling single this year.

[Robbie]

It will be interesting to see what effect the RR chart has on the UAC. Its small sample should be enough to enure it has a minimal effect on the records closer to the top. Looking at the above it's effect on the lower part of the chart is also minimal.

[MrTibbs]

Yeah Robbie thankfully its impact remains minimal.

[Graham76man]

It will be interesting to see what effect the RR chart has on the UAC. Its small sample should be enough to enure it has a minimal effect on the records closer to the top. Looking at the above it's effect on the lower part of the chart is also minimal.

However Melody Maker is only 8 shops higher so that too must have lower effect too. Also like NME it has 30 slots, whereas the others have 20 only. With those slots missing from the other chart, it does mean that 21 to 30 are only an approximate indication of the full survey. All though the inclusion of the RR 30 does end the reign of NME on slots 21 to 30. It still means those slots are not as accurate as the later 60's charts Brian has done. Though having said that Brian's system seems to work on 21 and 22 positions most weeks.
I think what I have said explains why the BBC stuck with only a 20, as the 30 copies one chart too much, especially if it has the highest store level.

[MrTibbs]

Yeah i would agree with that Graham. 21 to 30 are fun positions as only NME initially then RR now had an extended chart. It will be late 1962 when MM and Disc extend to a Top 30 and 21 to 30 become robust.

But. Its good to see how these positions shape up meantime.

[brian05]

You may be interested to learn that Amazon have issued Kindle versions of The Official Charts - The Sixties.
Only costs £9.99 instead of £20 for the paperback version. It includes the UK’s Official singles and albums charts from 1952 to the present day. Also included are the accompanying EP Charts, which were published between March 1960 and December 1967. (2,330 pages)

One advantage of e-books (versus their print equivalents) however is the search function, which can be used to search for any titles, artists, labels or even key words, using the search function built into your e-reader or tablet app.

The free sample for The Official Charts - The Sixties will be auto-delivered wirelessly to your iPad.

If you click on Look Inside you can read this,

[Splodj]

"... which at the turn of the decade featured just 20 titles for singles ..."

Is this a misprint, or does it mean they are only using the Top 20 of the NMEs Top 30?

[MrTibbs]

What a load of hogwash that 'Look Inside' article is.

I've seen lots of pitiful attempts over the years to justify the RR chart but that article takes it to a whole new level.

Record Mirror's own chart was scrapped in March 1962 so that reference is totally inaccurate. Then to compare store returns is a joke. RR had 30 meagre stores compared to around 400 between NME, MM, and Disc. Even the simplest mathematical brain could calculate on that basis they were right and RR was wrong.

But sadly they are still blind and deaf to any criticism of RR. They need to take a look at my charts side by side for the first time, and take a long hard look at just who is out of step every single week.

[Graham76man]

The only really good excuse for the RR chart inclusion was that it was a top 50 and it did not cut the chart down. We all know that if Melody Maker had not cut the chart down, or if NME had made it a top 50 roughly the same time. Then the first Guinness chart book would have used one of them instead. They knew that both were more accurate than RR. But if you only use a top 30, so many records get missed out and that was the driving factor.

Chart dates are also confusing on the Record Retailer charts, still reflected on the OCC site itself. The week ending dates on NOT always the Saturday. Some I have seen are Thursday fitting in with the publication dates. The OCC should take a look at the Calender sites at correct these dates. Some people use the charts for birthdays. If you happened to born on a Friday or Saturday you could get the wrong chart for your birthday! And I am not talking about the stupid decision when they moved the chart publication to Friday a few years ago.

[kingofskiffle]

"... which at the turn of the decade featured just 20 titles for singles ..."

Is this a misprint, or does it mean they are only using the Top 20 of the NMEs Top 30?

Must be a misprint as the book uses the full Top 30 from NME.

[kingofskiffle]

What a load of hogwash that 'Look Inside' article is.

I've seen lots of pitiful attempts over the years to justify the RR chart but that article takes it to a whole new level.

Record Mirror's own chart was scrapped in March 1962 so that reference is totally inaccurate. Then to compare store returns is a joke. RR had 30 meagre stores compared to around 400 between NME, MM, and Disc. Even the simplest mathematical brain could calculate on that basis they were right and RR was wrong.

But sadly they are still blind and deaf to any criticism of RR. They need to take a look at my charts side by side for the first time, and take a long hard look at just who is out of step every single week.

They do - but remember the OCC probably dont want to admit they are wrong. And, in the face of over 40 years of “history” since the first Guinness book in 1977 its a lot to overturn, which they simply will not do.

[RokinRobinOfLocksley]

I don't think it has been revealed how or why the OCC went with RR as 'official for the 60s' in 2001. They apparently didn't do much research on the matter, or talk to someone with diehard chart knowledge.

Alan Smith's excellent 50s/60s UK chart history article still had not been written as of 2001, I think the first version got published in Record Collector in 2005, so the OCC couldn't have used that info. After the OCC had made its decision to go with RR, Alan went to Dave McAleer who was then working at the OCC, and explained the situation to him. Dave told Alan that if the OCC had known about the info he had gathered, they most likely would NOT have chosen RR to represent the 60s. Alan told me this by email, I don't know if it's public knowledge, and I hope I don't get Dave in trouble, ha.

RR might have been chosen as the 'official 60s chart' by the OCC in 2001 because they had 50 chart positions each week (which is apparently the reason that Guinness went with RR), but I don't think I've ever heard or read that for sure. The story the OCC gives out now is that RR was the precursor to the 'official' charts started in Feb 1969, as RR was 'the industry chart' prior to the BMRB/BARS industry chart.

Well, we can argue that all night long. RR did not start out as an industry music paper or chart, it was actually an anti-industry music paper/chart, published for independent record shops not tied to any record label. They may have drifted over to eventually becoming 'the industry music paper' after Billboard infused them with lots of cash in 1966. But guess what? The RR chart was compiled no differently than any of the other charts, calculated from an average of their reporting record shop charts, not total sales. The worst thing about RR was that it sampled the smallest number of record shops, and forced tie breakers BASED ON LAST WEEKS CHART INFO, totally bogus. Not to mention it was the least followed, least known chart of the 60s.

But would NME or MM have given the OCC the rights to make them 'official for the 60s' in 2001? Probably, since they both ceased their own charts in 1988.

No, I don't expect the OCC to ever come around. If they truly cared about 60s UK chart history, they would have spent the time and effort years/decades ago to do what Brian is doing now. But for the OCC today, it just doesn't matter, all the 60s charts are 'approximately' the same, RR is good enough, it's too late to change, ugh...

[RokinRobinOfLocksley]

What really boils my blood is the OCC previously stating something like "NME was the chart of the 50s. When the RR chart began in March 1960, it then took over as the official industry chart." Don't know if that bogus language is still in place on the OCC website or not.

Likewise, "RR is now widely accepted as the 'official' chart of the 60s." Which goes to show if you repeat something often enough, everyone will believe it, regardless of the truth.

But yeah, the only useful thing about RR is that it gave us 50 chart positions over 4 years when the other charts did not. And that's good!

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

There are 11 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending March 19th 1960.

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending March 19th 1960								NME	RM	MM	DISC	RR	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey				Stores	80	60	38	50	30	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC				TOP	30	Scored
2	1	Running Bear - Johnny Preston					1	1	1	1	1	1	7740
1	2	Poor Me - Adam Faith					2	2	2	2	2	5	7392
3	3	Delaware - Perry Como					3	3	3	3	3	3	7224
12	4	Theme From 'A Summer Place' - Percy Faith					5=	4	5	4	12	7	6416
5	5	Why - Anthony Newley					7	7	7	7	6	2	6392
9	6	You Got What It Takes - Marv Johnson					4	5	4	6	9	10	6380
11	7	Be Mine - Lance Fortune					8	9	5	8	7	4	6204
4	8	On A Slow Boat To China - Emile Ford and The Checkmates					5=	8	8	5	4	11	6158
7	9	Pretty Blue Eyes - Craig Douglas					9	12	9	9	8	8	5516
6	10	A Voice In The Wilderness - Cliff Richard					10	13	11	11	5	6	5450
15	11	What In The World's Come Over You - Jack Scott					11	6	10	10	16	17	5228
10	12	Summer Set - Mr. Acker Bilk					12	10	13	12	10	9	5192
14	13	Who Could Be Bluer - Jerry Lordan					13	14	16	13	13	18	4234
8	14	Way Down Yonder In New Orleans - Freddy Cannon					14	15		19	11	12	3306
19	15	Hit And Miss -The John Barry Seven					15=	21	12		14	20	3120
16	16	Royal Event - Russ Conway					20=	18	19		17	15	2940
21	17	Colette - Billy Fury					19	19	18	16		14	2820
25	18	Fings Ain't Wot They Used To Be - Max Bygraves					15=	11	15			23	2800
NEW	19	Handy Man - Jimmy Jones					17	16	17	15		29	2708
NEW	20	Beatnik Fly - Johnny and The Hurricanes					18	22	14	14		26	2536
20	21	Looking High High High - Bryan Johnson						20		20	19	25	2078
26	22	Wild One - Bobby Rydell					20=	17	20			24	1990
18	23	Harbour Lights - The Platters						27		18	18	19	1824
13	24	Beyond The Sea (La Mer) - Bobby Darin						23			15	21	1740
NEW	25	Country Boy - Fats Domino						25		17			1012
17	26	Bonnie Came Back - Duane Eddy						28			20	27	910
24	27	Let It Be Me - The Everly Brothers						30				13	620
27	28	Darktown Strutters' Ball - Joe Brown						24					560
NEW	29	My Heart - Gene Vincent										16	450
22	30	California Here I Come - Freddy Cannon						26					400
		Misty - Johnny Mathis										22	270
		Teen Angel - Mark Dinning						29					160
		Starry Eyed - Michael Holliday										28	90
		Johnny Rocco - Marty Wilde										30	30

[MrTibbs]

Chart Commentary

To exemplify the above conversations and just indicate how out of touch RR was take a close look at this chart. If you take the highest chart position and the lowest chart position between NME, RM, MM, Disc, and then take a look at the RR chart position you will see how often it falls outwith the highest and lowest parameters of the other 4 bigger sample charts.

As an example, 'Poor Me', 2, 2, 2, 2, on NME, RM, MM, Disc, RR 5. 'Why', 7, 7, 7, 6, and RR 2.

This is the extreme example, granted, but RR still falls outwith their scope on so many occasions above. At a glance around 10 occasions in the Top 20.

'Nuff said !

[Splodj]

I suspect that if RR had published their chart untied it would have been apparent what a small sample they were using, and that the bottom 20 would have had multiple ties. So yes they alone carried positions 31-50, but how reliable was that section at this time?

[Graham76man]

What really boils my blood is the OCC previously stating something like "NME was the chart of the 50s. When the RR chart began in March 1960, it then took over as the official industry chart." Don't know if that bogus language is still in place on the OCC website or not.

Likewise, "RR is now widely accepted as the 'official' chart of the 60s." Which goes to show if you repeat something often enough, everyone will believe it, regardless of the truth.

But yeah, the only useful thing about RR is that it gave us 50 chart positions over 4 years when the other charts did not. And that's good!

I believe the early charts of RR were again not really relevant to the music scene. However when Record Mirror switched over to the RR chart, because it was a high circulation paper it would have given the chart legitimacy and make it well known. Having looked at the earlier chart books especially Rock File, they are using the top 50, but quote Record Mirror as the source. Before moving over to RR when BMRB take over.
So there was a trend already to use RR, even in books that used only the top 20 charts!
By 2001 lots of British Hit Singles books had been published, all containing the charts of RR. I can't see the OCC turning it's back on this legacy and using either NME or Melody Maker to 50 or 30's as the "official" charts of the 1960-68 period regardless of any research showing RR charts as crap.

[Graham76man]

With such a low number of shops taking part it would have been easier for the Retailer to ask them for actual record sales figures. All they needed was a full list of records and a box for the amount sold. The dealer would have just put in the number and send it back. I dare say you wouldn't get many ties unlike a point system, which just gives 50 points for the top and one for the bottom. But one shop might have ten at 50 and another 2 sold for two different records. With points the same and tied, sales a clear winner.
Imagine the discussions we would be having now if Retailer had produced a sales chart!

[MrTibbs]

I grind my teeth as I admit it, but the RR charts are indeed here to stay. All boats have sailed in respect of the OCC considering any other chart now. To change now would be tantamount to admitting they were wrong up to now so that isn't going to happen.

Splodj's point above is correct about dubiety over the accuracy of the Top 50 bottom 20. Even when the BMRB chart took over the BBC only referred to the Top 30 because even that 'sales chart' was considered suspect in positions below that.

[MrTibbs]

With such a low number of shops taking part it would have been easier for the Retailer to ask them for actual record sales figures. All they needed was a full list of records and a box for the amount sold. The dealer would have just put in the number and send it back. I dare say you wouldn't get many ties unlike a point system, which just gives 50 points for the top and one for the bottom. But one shop might have ten at 50 and another 2 sold for two different records. With points the same and tied, sales a clear winner.
Imagine the discussions we would be having now if Retailer had produced a sales chart!

But, the BMRB chart which remember was a 'sales chart' was littered with ties during 1969, even as high as the #4 position, something which should have been nigh impossible in a sales chart versus point chart like Graham said.

Something was very wrong to allow that, so probably that supports Alan Smith and Dave Taylor's view that during that time the BMRB were only receiving a mere fraction of the sales diaries from stores to compile the chart.