The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

[Splodj]

The alternative chart was broadcast by the BBC, so was 'published' - in the same way that non-printed material like music is published. I see it as an amendment that the BBC requested ("we can't not play that twice!") which BMRB agreed to and it is what the overwhelming majority of people will have seen and heard as BMRBs placing of the record that week.

Incidentally - as Je T'aime was originally recorded when Gainsbourg had an affair with Brigitte Bardot, it is a pity Mike Sarne didn't do a 'Come Outside' style duet with her when they had an affair!!

[kingofskiffle]

The alternative chart was never published and since the accepted history has bene to use what Music Week prints therefore that's the way the chart is recorded for history. In 1976 they fixed this and combined Leader of The Pack, presumably because Radio 1 would have said "we can't play the same song twice".

[braindeadpj]

BMRB actually compiled an alternative chart for that week brain which combined both versions so i used that as it represented a total for it rather than
split positions. It never topped NME or MM.

Thanks for your response, I was not aware of this. I always remember seeing the original chart (in Tony Jaspers Top Twenty book) and thinking what a screw up. Good to know there's an alternative one. So being at both 3 and 16 was not enough to overhaul the no.1...

OCC uses the original, how about Guinness? BTW what's position 50 on the alternative chart (as everything else should be the 'same').

[MrTibbs]

BTW how did you handle the fact that Je T'aime was at 3 and 16 in the BMRB due to different record labels, on the 4th October (looks like you had it only at 2 and shifted everything up below 16?).
So Je T'aime was not a no.1 on NME or MM?

BMRB actually compiled an alternative chart for that week brain which combined both versions so i used that as it represented a total for it rather than
split positions. It never topped NME or MM.

[braindeadpj]

BTW how did you handle the fact that Je T'aime was at 3 and 16 in the BMRB due to different record labels, on the 4th October (looks like you had it only at 2 and shifted everything up below 16?).
So Je T'aime was not a no.1 on NME or MM?

[Splodj]

A rare case (the only one?) of NME and MM putting a record at number one before BMRB. Although this is not because BMRB are clinging on to the previous number one, as is usually the case when the situation is reversed.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending October 11th 1969

Here are all 'the uppers, the downers, the just hangin' arounders'

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending October 11th 1969							NME	MM	BMRB	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey			Stores	200	250	100	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart					TOP	30	Scored
3	1	I'll Never Fall In Love Again - Bobbie Gentry					1	1	2	16400
1	2	Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwatwer Revival					2	2	3	15850
2	3	Je T'aime..Moi Non Plus - Jane Birkin and Serge Gainsbourg					3	4	1	15350
4	4	A Boy Named Sue - Johnny Cash					4	3	4	15100
12	5	Lay Lady Lay - Bob Dylan					5	6	5	14050
7	6	Throw Down A Line - Cliff Richard and Hank Marvin					7	5	8	13600
5	7	Don't Forget To Remember - The Bee Gees					6	9	7	12900
6	8	Good Morning Starshine - Oliver					8	8	6	12850
10	9	It's Getting Better - Mama Cass					9	7	9	12600
18	10	Nobody's Child - Karen Young					10	10	10	11550
14	11	Hare Krishna Mantra - The Radha Krishna Temple					11	11	12	10900
21	12	I'm Gonna Make You Mine - Lou Christie					11	12	11	10750
27	13	Space Oddity - David Bowie					18	13	13	8900
9	14	In The Year 2525 - Zager and Evans					14	15	18	8700
8	15	Natural Born Bugie - Humble Pie					16	14	17	8650
15	16	Put Yourself In My Place - The Isley Brothers					15	16	15	8550
11	17	Too Busy Thinking About My Baby - Marvin Gaye					13	19	21	7600
17	18	I Second That Emotion - Diana Ross and The Supremes and The Temptations					17	17	24	7000
24	19	Love At First Sight - Sounds Nice					19	18	22	6550
NEW	20	He Ain't Heavy He's My Brother - The Hollies					20	20	16	6450
NEW	21	Oh Well - Fleetwood Mac					22	21	14	6000
28	22	Do What You Gotta Do - The Four Tops					20	23	19	5400
13	23	Viva Bobby Joe - The Equals					23	22	23	4650
16	24	Cloud Nine - The Temptations					24	25	20	4000
20	25	Soul Deep - The Box Tops					26	24		2750
25	26	Birth - The Peddlers					26	26		2250
19	27	My Cherie Amour - Stevie Wonder						27	27	1400
NEW	28	Am I The Same Girl - Dusty Springfield					25			1200
NEW	29	Sugar Sugar - The Archies					28	29		1100
22	30	Honky Tonk Women - The Rolling Stones						28	28	1050
23		Saved By The Bell - Robin Gibb					30	30	25	1050
B		Love's Been Good To Me - Frank Sinatra							26	500
B		Everybody's Talkin' - Nilsson					29			400
		I'm A Better Man - Engelbert Humperdinck							29	200
29		Wet Dream - Max Romeo							30	100
26		Marrakesh Express - Crosby Stills and Nash
30		Clean Up Your Own Back Yard - Elvis Presley

[MrTibbs]

Two records of opposing quality debut this week. The sublime and endearing Space Oddity by David Bowie which will become a timeless classic, and the appalling, cloying, horrendous Nobody's Child from Karen Young. 'Nuff Said.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending October 4th 1969

Here are all 'the uppers, the downers, the just hangin' arounders'

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending October 4th 1969							NME	MM	BMRB	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey			Stores	200	250	100	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart					TOP	30	Scored
1	1	Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwater Revival					1	1	1	16500
2	2	Je T'aime..Moi Non Plus - Jane Birkin and Serge Gainsbourg					2	3	2	15700
4	3	I'll Never Fall In Love Again - Bobbie Gentry					3	2	3	15650
10	4	A Boy Named Sue - Johnny Cash					5	4	4	14650
3	5	Don't Forget To Remember - The Bee Gees					4	5	5	14500
7	6	Good Morning Starshine - Oliver					8	6	6	13350
11	7	Throw Down A Line - Cliff Richard and Hank Marvin					7	7	7	13200
6	8	Natural Born Bugie - Humble Pie					9	8	11	12150
5	9	In The Year 2525 - Zager and Evans					10	9	10	11800
13	10	It's Getting Better - Mama Cass					11	10	8	11550
8	11	Too Busy Thinking About My Baby - Marvin Gaye					6	12	15	11350
21	12	Lay Lady Lay - Bob Dylan					12	11	9	11000
9	13	Viva Bobby Joe - The Equals					13	13	13	9900
16	14	Hare Krishna Mantra - The Radha Krishna Temple					15	14	12	9350
18	15	Put Yourself In My Place - The Isley Brothers					14	16	24	7850
14	16	Cloud Nine - The Temptations					16	15	30	7100
27	17	I Second That Emotion - Diana Ross and The Supremes and The Temptations					17	20	17	6950
NEW	18	Nobody's Child - Karen Young					19	21	14	6600
12	19	My Cherie Amour - Stevie Wonder					21	18	20	6350
20	20	Soul Deep - The Box Tops					20	17	25	6300
25	21	I'm Gonna Make You Mine - Lou Christie					17	23	16	6300
15	22	Honky Tonk Women - The Rolling Stones					25	19	29	4400
17	23	Saved By The Bell - Robin Gibb					24	23	21	4400
28	24	Love At First Sight - Sounds Nice					30	22	18	3750
19	25	Birth - The Peddlers					23	26	22	3750
23	26	Marrakesh Express - Crosby Stills and Nash					22	25		3300
NEW	27	Space Oddity - David Bowie					27	27	19	3000
NEW	28	Do What You Gotta Do - The Four Tops					25	29	26	2200
24	29	Wet Dream - Max Romeo					29	28		1150
29	30	Clean Up Your Own Back Yard - Elvis Presley					27		28	1100
22		Make Me An Island - Joe Dolan							23	800
26		I'm A Better Man - Engelbert Humperdinck							27	400
		Tears In The Wind - Chicken Shack						30		250
B		Am I The Same Girl - Dusty Springfield					30			200
30		Curly - The Move

[Splodj]

It is implied there that 'son of a bitch' needed to be bleeped out, rather than done for effect.

As a general point about Wiki, I notice that the 'official' peak chart position is the only one mentioned for the UK, whereas for the USA they give positions for Billboard, Cashbox and Billboard sub-charts. This doesn't matter much for 'Sue', but in some cases it would be informative to mention the other UK charts even from 1969 on. An obvious example is 'Tapestry', as discussed on the other thread.

[Metalweb]

I assume that the bleep in 'A Boy Named Sue' was put in as a joke, because the unexpurgated version on the album reveals the missing words to be merely 'son of a bitch'. Even the BBC could have played that!

Whole paragraph about censorship of that phrase on wiki....

A Boy Named Sue - Wikipedia

[Splodj]

the top ten with general agreement

Absolute agreement between the Ultimate and BMRB!

[Splodj]

I assume that the bleep in 'A Boy Named Sue' was put in as a joke, because the unexpurgated version on the album reveals the missing words to be merely 'son of a bitch'. Even the BBC could have played that!

[MrTibbs]

There is a lot of consistency between the three charts again this week in the top ten with general agreement and records at most just one position out between any chart.

Some good records too around the chart, especially, David Bowie about to break in, Crosby Stills and Nash, Mama Cass, Lou Christie,The Box Tops and Bob Dylan hanging around too.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending September 27th 1969

Here are all 'the uppers, the downers, the just hangin' arounders'

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 27th 1969							NME	MM	BMRB	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey			Stores	200	250	100	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart					TOP	30	Scored
1	1	Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwater Revival					1	1	1	16500
4	2	Je T'aime..Moi Non Plus - Jane Birkin and Serge Gainsbourg					2	3	2	15700
3	3	Don't Forget To Remember - The Bee Gees					3	2	3	15650
10	4	I'll Never Fall In Love Again - Bobbie Gentry					4	4	4	14850
2	5	In The Year 2525 - Zager and Evans					6	5	5	14100
5	6	Natural Born Bugie - Humble Pie					5	6	6	13950
8	7	Good Morning Starshine - Oliver					8	7	7	13000
6	8	Too Busy Thinking About My Baby - Marvin Gaye					7	8	8	12850
7	9	Viva Bobby Joe - The Equals					9	9	9	12100
22	10	A Boy Named Sue - Johnny Cash					10	10	10	11550
18	11	Throw Down A Line - Cliff Richard and Hank Marvin					11	11	14	10700
9	12	My Cherie Amour - Stevie Wonder					13	12	16	9850
20	13	It's Getting Better - Mama Cass					14	14	11	9650
14	14	Cloud Nine - The Temptations					19	13	15	8500
11	15	Honky Tonk Women - The Rolling Stones					15	16	18	8250
28	16	Hare Krishna Mantra - The Radha Krishna Temple					12	19	19	8000
12	17	Saved By The Bell - Robin Gibb					18	15	23	7400
23	18	Put Yourself In My Place - The Isley Brothers					16	22	13	7050
16	19	Birth - The Peddlers					17	18		6050
24	20	Soul Deep - The Box Tops					23	17	22	6000
27	21	Lay Lady Lay - Bob Dylan					25	20	12	5850
13	22	Make Me An Island - Joe Dolan					19	21	24	5600
17	23	Marrakesh Express - Crosby Stills and Nash					22	23	17	5200
25	24	Wet Dream - Max Romeo					24	25	26	3400
29	25	I'm Gonna Make You Mine - Lou Christie					21		28	2300
19	26	I'm A Better Man - Engelbert Humperdinck						24	29	1950
NEW	27	I Second That Emotion - Diana Ross and the Supremes and The Temptations					27	27		1800
NEW	28	Love At First Sight - Sounds Nice					26	30	27	1650
26	29	Clean Up Your Own Back Yard - Elvis Presley					28		21	1600
15	30	Curly - The Move					30	26		1450
B		Nobody's Child - Karen Young							20	1100
21		Early In The Morning - Vanity Fare					29	29	30	1000
30		Tears In The Wind - Chicken Shack						28		750
B		Space Oddity - David Bowie							25	600

[MrTibbs]

I really do like how they all agree on the number 1.

Ha Ha, yeah enjoy the moment, that said they often will, or sometimes two out of the three will agree, but there are some times ahead when there will be a three way split on #1

[Robbie]

Cliff's duet with Hank Marvin is interesting as by this point the hits had dried up for The Shadows and they had disbanded at the end of 1968 (they would later reunite and score hits in the 70s and 80s). Perhaps this was Cliff's way of helping out his former backing group's lead guitarist.

[Splodj]

It won't last!

[kingofskiffle]

I really do like how they all agree on the number 1.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending September 20th 1969

Here are all 'the uppers, the downers, the just hangin' arounders'

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 20th 1969							NME	MM	BMRB	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey			Stores	200	250	100	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart					TOP	30	Scored
2	1	Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwater Revival					1	1	1	16500
1	2	In The Year 2525 - Zager and Evans					3	2	3	15650
5	3	Don't Forget To Remember - The Bee Gees					2	4	2	15450
7	4	Je T'aime..Moi Non Plus - Jane Birkin and Serge Gainsbourg					4	3	4	15100
6	5	Natural Born Bugie - Humble Pie					5	5	5	14300
3	6	Too Busy Thinking About My Baby - Marvin Gaye					6	6	6	13750
4	7	Viva Bobby Joe - The Equals					7	7	7	13200
11	8	Good Morning Starshine - Oliver					9	8	8	12450
8	9	My Cherie Amour - Stevie Wonder					8	9	11	12100
18	10	I'll Never Fall In Love Again - Bobbie Gentry					10	11	9	11400
9	11	Honky Tonk Women - The Rolling Stones					11	10	10	11350
10	12	Saved By The Bell - Robin Gibb					12	13	12	10200
13	13	Make Me An Island - Joe Dolan					16	14	13	9050
15	14	Cloud Nine - The Temptations					13	12	27	8750
14	15	Curly - The Move					14	15	20	8500
21	16	Birth - The Peddlers					18	16	17	7750
22	17	Marrakesh Express - Crosby Stills and Nash					15	19	25	6800
NEW	18	Throw Down A Line - Cliff Richard and Hank Marvin					17	22	14	6750
17	19	I'm A Better Man - Engelbert Humperdinck					21	18	18	6550
25	20	It's Getting Better - Mama Cass					19	21	16	6400
12	21	Early In The Morning - Vanity Fare					23	17	21	6100
NEW	22	A Boy Named Sue - Johnny Cash					27	24	15	4150
29	23	Put Yourself In My Place - The Isley Brothers					19	26	28	3950
24	24	Soul Deep - The Box Tops					30	20	23	3750
16	25	Wet Dream - Max Romeo					25	23	26	3700
26	26	Clean Up Your Own Back Yard - Elvis Presley					22	27	22	3700
NEW	27	Lay Lady Lay - Bob Dylan					24	25	30	3000
NEW	28	Hare Krishna Mantra - The Radha Krishna Temple					28	30	19	2050
NEW	29	I'm Gonna Make You Mine - Lou Christie					26			1000
NEW	30	Tears In The Wind - Chicken Shack						28	29	950
B		Love At First Sight - Sounds Nice							24	700
19		Conversations - Cilla Black						29		500
X		25 Miles - Edwin Starr					29			400
20		Bringing On Back The Good Times - The Love Affair
23		Si Tu Dois Partir - Fairport Convention
27		Goodnight Midnight - Clodagh Rodgers
28		Give Peace A Chance - The Plastic Ono Band
30		In The Ghetto - Elvis Presley

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending September 13th 1969

Here are all 'the uppers, the downers, the just hangin' arounders'

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 13th 1969							NME	MM	BMRB	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey			Stores	200	250	100	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart					TOP	30	Scored
1	1	In The Year 2525 - Zager and Evans					1	1	1	16500
6	2	Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwater Revival					2	2	2	15950
2	3	Too Busy Thinking About My Baby - Marvin Gaye					4	3	5	15000
7	4	Viva Bobby Joe - The Equals					6	4	7	14150
8	5	Don't Forget To Remember - The Bee Gees					3	8	3	14150
9	6	Natural Born Bugie - Humble Pie					8	5	4	13800
12	7	Je T'aime..Moi Non Plus - Jane Birkin and Serge Gainsbourg					5	7	6	13700
5	8	My Cherie Amour - Stevie Wonder					7	6	8	13350
3	9	Honky Tonk Women - The Rolling Stones					9	9	9	12100
4	10	Saved By The Bell - Robin Gibb					10	10	10	11550
14	11	Good Morning Starshine - Oliver					11	11	11	11000
11	12	Early In The Morning - Vanity Fare					12	12	14	10250
10	13	Make Me An Island - Joe Dolan					13	13	12	10000
13	14	Curly - The Move					14	14	13	9450
20	15	Cloud Nine - The Temptations					17	15	16	8300
18	16	Wet Dream - Max Romeo					18	17	18	7400
23	17	I'm A Better Man - Engelbert Humperdinck					23	16	15	6950
25	18	I'll Never Fall In Love Again - Bobbie Gentry					15	21	19	6900
15	19	Conversations - Cilla Black					22	18	21	6050
16	20	Bringing On Back The Good Times - The Love Affair					16	20		5750
NEW	21	Birth - The Peddlers					20	19	27	5600
27	22	Marrakesh Express - Crosby Stills and Nash					26	24	17	4150
21	23	Si Tu Dois Partir - Fairport Convention					21	23		4000
28	24	Soul Deep - The Box Tops						22	24	2950
NEW	25	It's Getting Better - Mama Cass					27	25	26	2800
30	26	Clean Up Your Own Back Yard - Elvis Presley					19	30		2650
17	27	Goodnight Midnight - Clodagh Rodgers						26	20	2350
19	28	Give Peace A Chance - The Plastic Ono Band					28	28	22	2250
NEW	29	Put Yourself In My Place - The Isley Brothers					24		23	2200
22	30	In The Ghetto - Elvis Presley						27	28	1300
B		Tears In The Wind - Chicken Shack					25			1200
29		Tears Won't Wash Away My Heartaches - Ken Dodd							25	600
26		When Two Worlds Collide - Jim Reeves						29		500
X		Soul Clap '69 - Booker T. and The MG's					29			400
		Heather Honey - Tommy Roe							29	200
B		Throw Down A Line - Cliff Richard and Hank Marvin					30			200
B		Lay Lady Lay - Bob Dylan							30	100
24		I Can Sing A Rainbow/Love Is Blue - The Dells

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers !

Here is the Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending September 6th 1969

Here are all 'the uppers, the downers, the just hangin' arounders'

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending September 6th 1969							NME	MM	BMRB	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey			Stores	200	250	100	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart					TOP	30	Scored
1	1	In The Year 2525 - Zager and Evans					1	1	1	16500
6	2	Too Busy Thinking About My Baby - Marvin Gaye					3	2	6	15350
2	3	Honky Tonk Women - The Rolling Stones					3	4	3	15150
3	4	Saved By The Bell - Robin Gibb					2	3	9	15000
4	5	My Cherie Amour - Stevie Wonder					5	5	4	14400
11	6	Bad Moon Rising - Creedence Clearwater Revival					8	7	2	13500
7	7	Viva Bobby Joe - The Equals					7	6	7	13450
10	8	Don't Forget To Remember - The Bee Gees					6	8	5	13350
15	9	Natural Born Bugie - Humble Pie					10	9	10	11800
5	10	Make Me An Island - Joe Dolan					9	11	11	11400
8	11	Early In The Morning - Vanity Fare					11	10	12	11150
19	12	Je T'aime..Moi Non Plus - Jane Birkin and Serge Gainsbourg					12	13	8	10600
9	13	Curly - The Move					13	12	13	10150
20	14	Good Morning Starshine - Oliver					14	14	14	9350
12	15	Conversations - Cilla Black					16	15	15	8600
16	16	Bringing On Back The Good Times - The Love Affair					15	16	18	8250
14	17	Goodnight Midnight - Clodagh Rodgers					20	17	19	6900
17	18	Wet Dream - Max Romeo					17	19	20	6900
13	19	Give Peace A Chance - The Plastic Ono Band					19	22	16	6150
27	20	Cloud Nine - The Temptations					20	18	28	5750
21	21	Si Tu Dois Partir - Fairport Convention					18	21	25	5700
18	22	In The Ghetto - Elvis Presley					22	20	21	5550
23	23	I'm A Better Man - Engelbert Humperdinck					25	23	17	4600
22	24	I Can Sing A Rainbow/Love Is Blue - The Dells					23	26	23	3650
NEW	25	I'll Never Fall In Love Again - Bobbie Gentry					24	27		2400
25	26	When Two Worlds Collide - Jim Reeves						24	29	1950
NEW	27	Marrakesh Express - Crosby Stills and Nash					27	28	30	1650
NEW	28	Soul Deep - The Box Tops						25		1500
30	29	Tears Won't Wash Away My Heartaches - Ken Dodd						30	22	1150
NEW	30	Clean Up Your Own Back Yard - Elvis Presley					26			1000
B		Birth - The Peddlers						29	27	900
X		Soul Clap '69 - Booker T. and The MG's					27			800
		Heather Honey - Tommy Roe							24	700
B		It's Getting Better - Mama Cass					30		26	700
B		Put Yourself In My Place - The Isley Brothers					29			400
24		Baby Make It Soon - The Marmalade
26		It Mek - Desmond Dekker and The Aces
28		Peaceful - Georgie Fame
29		Barabajagal - Donovan and The Jeff Beck Group

[MrTibbs]

I'm going away the weekend to London guys so here are the Ultimate Average Charts in advance for Saturday and Sunday so you don't miss out

[Splodj]

'Space Oddity' has yet to chart. It was released in time to coincide with the moon trip, but this backfired somewhat ...

The first time I heard it on the radio was on 27 July on the David Symonds show. He said that they had deliberately not played it earlier because they wanted to ensure that the astronauts had returned safely first.

[Robbie]

The sound of Motown really was changing. Although that was to be expected, the clamour for 60s style Motown never went away in the early 1970s as can be seen by the numerous re-issues and chart re-entries of old Motown releases that follow in the next few years.

I meant to post the other day, 20 July 1969 was "one small step for man" but a historic day for mankind as Apollo 11 touched down on the moon and Neil Armstrong walked and talked himself into history. The success of 'In The Year 2525' with its futuristic leanings must have been fuelled by the moon landings although 'Bad Moon Rising' is somewhat of a negative take on things...