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The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

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  • Originally posted by brian05 View Post
    Is I Wanna Go Home - by Lonnie Donegan the same song as Sloop John B by the Beach Boys?
    Yes.

    Lonnie Donegan: https://www.lyrics.com/lyric/1732281...+Wanna+Go+Home
    Beach Boys: https://www.lyrics.com/lyric/8288663...s/Sloop+John+B

    The full title of the Lonnie D track is "I Wanna Go Home (The Wreck Of The John 'B')" (See http://www.45cat.com/record/7n15267) The Beach Boys just listed the composer as "Arr. Brian Wilson" http://www.45cat.com/record/5602
    http://thechartbook.co.uk - for the latest are best chart book - By Decade!
    Now including NME, Record Mirror and Melody Maker from the UK and some Billboard charts

    Comment


    • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
      Buddy Holly's True Love Ways, new at 29 was a gem of a single and should have done so much better .
      Not much better judging by the owns on 45 Cat. It has 58 owns, and a value of 15. So the owns versus chart position would only get it about 10 places higher than NME. I always remove each pound from the owns giving it only 43. No money and it could get to six on 58 owns.
      It also has a release date of the 20 May so the record didn't wait around to get into NME chart. I wonder if NME were rotating chart shops at this point? For perhaps it was only selling in some stores and then next week, most of the stores were not include, so out it goes!
      Might explain why a new hit comes in then doesn't do anything next week. It's not like when the records were sold cheap in the first week and then full price the next week: hence high new entry and out - of the 1990's.
      Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

      Comment


      • Originally posted by brian05 View Post
        From the OCC web site,

        In turn, we can only do our job with the support of our contracted market research partner, Kantar (formerly Millward Brown)
        I didn't know that Millward Brown had changed hands!
        And Kantar! Quite bizzare. The BBC charts are under control of two men who worked for ITV

        Ian Griffiths (former CFO and COO at ITV was named Chief Financial Officer of Kantar, while Adam Crozier (former chief executive officer of media company ITV) was appointed Chairman.

        Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Graham76man View Post

          I didn't know that Millward Brown had changed hands!
          And Kantar! Quite bizzare. The BBC charts are under control of two men who worked for ITV
          Millward Brown was known as Kantar Millward Brown for a while before Kantar changed the name of all the various divisions it owned to simply Kantar. Interestingly in 2009 Kantar bought the British Market Research Bureau which means that both Millward Brown and the BMRB are now owned by the same company. The BMRB are still in the same office in Ealing where they were based while compiling the UK charts. I wonder if they still have all the sales information from back then? Who knows, it could be hidden in their vaults. When Gallup took over compiling the charts at the end of 1982 I believe they refused to hand anything over to Gallup or even the BPI so kept all of their sales data. Of course the BPI do have all of the sales data from the old chart reports that were compiled by BARS for the music industry. Or at least I hope they still have them. The library has been closed to the public for many years now and the last I heard things were stored in boxes in hallways.
          Last edited by Robbie; Thu December 17, 2020, 00:17.

          Comment


          • Thanks for the info kingofskiffle.
            There are some differences in the lyrics and the Beach Boys have 2 extra verses. Same tune though.

            Comment


            • Im working today guys so will post the next chart tonight .
              The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by brian05 View Post
                Thanks for the info kingofskiffle.
                There are some differences in the lyrics and the Beach Boys have 2 extra verses. Same tune though.
                Wikipedia list dozens of different recordings, the earliest dating from 1935.

                https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sloop_John_B

                Comment


                • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                  There are 10 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

                  Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending June 4th 1960.


                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending June 4th 1960 NME RM MM DISC RR Total
                  Last This The Sound Survey Stores 80 60 38 50 30 Points
                  Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                  1 1 Cathy's Clown - The Everly Brothers 1 1 1 1 1 1 7740
                  2 2 Cradle Of Love - Johnny Preston 2 2 2 2 2 2 7482
                  5 3 Sweet Nothin's - Brenda Lee 4 4 5 5 3 4 6918
                  4 4 Handy Man - Jimmy Jones 3 3 4 4 5 7 6906
                  8 5 Three Steps To Heaven - Eddie Cochran 5 8 6 3 4 3 6594
                  6 6 Shazam - Duane Eddy 6 6 3 6 7 9 6490
                  3 7 Someone Else's Baby / Big Time - Adam Faith 7 5 8 7 8 5 6302
                  9 8 Footsteps - Steve Lawrence 8 7 10 9 9 6 5866
                  11 9 Mama / Robot Man - Connie Francis 10 9 7 8 10 15 5604
                  7 10 Do You Mind - Anthony Newley 9 10 14 10 6 8 5438
                  16 11 I Wanna Go Home - Lonnie Donegan 11 11 9 12 16 18 4782
                  12 12 Stairway To Heaven - Neil Sedaka 12= 17 13 11 14 13 4350
                  10 13 Fall In Love With You / Willie And The Hand Jive - Cliff Richard 12= 15 16 14 13 11 4326
                  13 14 The Heart Of A Teenage Girl - Craig Douglas 14 20 12 13 12 10 4284
                  22 15 Sixteen Reasons - Connie Stevens 15 18 19 17 11 17 3712
                  21 16 Lucky Five - Russ Conway 19 13 11 20 19 3418
                  15 17 He'll Have To Go - Jim Reeves 16 14 15 16 14 3400
                  18 18 The Urge - Freddy Cannon 17 20 18 15 17 26 3118
                  19 19 That's You - Nat King Cole 20 19 17 19 19 25 3036
                  24 20 Let The Little Girl Dance - Billy Bland 18 16 20 20 21 2710
                  17 21 Standing On The Corner - The King Brothers 23 18 16 1740
                  14 22 Stuck On You - Elvis Presley 26 15 20 1530
                  NEW 23 You'll Never Know What You're Missin' - Emile Ford and The Checkmates 25 22 750
                  NEW 24 Got A Girl - The Four Preps 22 720
                  23 25 Theme From 'A Summer Place' - Percy Faith 29 18 30 684
                  NEW 26 That's Love - Billy Fury 24 27 680
                  20 27 Beatnik Fly - Johnny and The Hurricanes 12 570
                  NEW 28 Sweet Dreams - Dave Sampson 27 320
                  NEW 29 Ain't Misbehavin' - Tommy Bruce 27 320
                  RE 30 Mack The Knife - Ella Fitzgerald 23 240
                  Robot Man - Connie Francis 11
                  My Old Man's A Dustman - Lonnie Donegan 24 210
                  Green Jeans - The Flea Rekkers 28 90
                  Milord - Edith Piaf 30 80
                  Kookie Kookie (Lend Me Your Comb) - Ed Byrnes and Connie Stevens 29 60
                  Last edited by MrTibbs; Fri December 18, 2020, 08:02. Reason: Amended chart as Billy Fury had been entered twice instead of once.
                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                  Comment


                  • You've got "That's Love - Billy Fury" twice on that last chart (4th June).

                    Comment


                    • Ah ! Sorry. Will fix that in the morning. Thanks for the heads up.
                      The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                      Comment


                      • Guys, please see amended chart above for June 4th.

                        I had listed Billy Fury for NME then again for RR on two separate lines. I have corrected this so both chart positions are on the same line.
                        As a result Billy is now 26 as opposed to 27 on previous entry.

                        I am meticulous on checking the charts before posting but this somehow bypassed my eagle eye.

                        It is again good that you guys pick up on an occasional typing error here and there and point it out, and I appreciate it. This keeps the charts 100% accurate.
                        The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                        Comment


                        • June 11th will be posted later this morning.
                          The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                          Comment


                          • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                            There are 13 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

                            Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending June 11th 1960.

                            The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending June 11th 1960 NME RM MM DISC RR Total
                            Last This The Sound Survey Stores 80 60 38 50 30 Points
                            Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                            1 1 Cathy's Clown - The Everly Brothers 1 1 1 1 1 1 7740
                            2 2 Cradle Of Love - Johnny Preston 2 2 2 2 2 2 7482
                            5 3 Three Steps To Heaven - Eddie Cochran 4 5 3 3 5 3 6964
                            9 4 Mama / Robot Man - Connie Francis* 6 8 3 5 4 7 6838
                            4 5 Handy Man - Jimmy Jones 5 3 5 6 7 5 6730
                            3 6 Sweet Nothin's - Brenda Lee 3 4 6 4 3 15 6566
                            6 7 Shazam - Duane Eddy 7 6 7 7 6 4 6412
                            11 8 I Wanna Go Home - Lonnie Donegan 8 7 8 8 9 6 6024
                            7 9 Someone Else's Baby / Big Time- Adam Faith 10 10 11 14 11 13 5066
                            8 10 Footsteps - Steve Lawrence 11 17 10 9 10 8 4956
                            15 11 Sixteen Reasons - Connie Stevens 9 12 17 11 8 19 4630
                            12 12 Stairway To Heaven - Neil Sedaka 12 14 16 10 15 9 4518
                            16 13 Lucky Five - Russ Conway 19 16 9 18 14 3680
                            17 14 He'll Have To Go - Jim Reeves 16= 11 14 19 17 3496
                            14 15 The Heart Of A Teenage Girl - Craig Douglas 15 25 15 15 12 16 3448
                            10 16 Do You Mind - Anthony Newley 13 19 13 13 10 3174
                            19 17 That's You - Nat King Cole 16= 13 19 17 24 3070
                            13 18 Fall In Love With You / Willie And The Hand Jive - Cliff Richard 14 21 12 14 11 2972
                            29 19 Ain't Misbehavin' - Tommy Bruce 20 18 12 17 2712
                            20 20 Let The Little Girl Dance - Billy Bland 18 15 18 19 20 2704
                            NEW 21 Down Yonder - Johnny and The Hurricanes 23 12 16 2350
                            18 22 The Urge - Freddy Cannon 24 20 16 18 2118
                            26 23 That's Love - Billy Fury 22 20 21 1680
                            23 24 You'll Never Know What You're Missin' - Emile Ford and The Checkmates 30 18 12 1430
                            NEW 25 River Stay 'Way From My Door - Frank Sinatra 20 880
                            22 26 Stuck On You - Elvis Presley 20 26 700
                            21 27 Standing On The Corner - The King Brothers 28 22 510
                            NEW 28 Mustapha - Bob Azzam 26 400
                            RE 29 Milord - Edith Piaf 27 320
                            28 30 Sweet Dreams - Dave Sampson 28 29 300
                            Robot Man - Connie Francis 9
                            Green Jeans - The Flee-Rekkers 23 240
                            Theme From 'A Summer Place' - Percy Faith 25 180
                            True Love Ways - Buddy Holly 27 120
                            Got A Girl - The Four Preps 28 90
                            My Old Man's A Dustman - Lonnie Donegan 30 30
                            * This week the split sides would have affected NME's
                            averaged chart position so an average was taken
                            from the other 4 charts giving an average of 4.75
                            and awarded to NME to give a more representative
                            chart position for both sides together.
                            0
                            The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                            Comment


                            • My birth date chart (exact day)
                              Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                              Comment


                              • Lots of good stuff on that chart to welcome you
                                The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                                Comment


                                • It's great to see 5 charts battling it out. It reminds me of the heady days of 1978-1979 when 5 charts (3 business, 2 consumer) were busy trying to outdo each other!

                                  Comment


                                  • Great work MrTibbs! Apologies for the delay in mentioning this, but I just noticed that the entry of Sandy Nelson with Teen Beat on the 6/2/1960 chart was actually a re-entry.

                                    Comment


                                    • Now corrected ta
                                      The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                                      Comment


                                      • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                                        There are 15 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

                                        Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending June 18th 1960.

                                        The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending June 18th 1960 NME RM MM DISC RR
                                        Last This The Sound Survey Stores 80 60 38 50 30
                                        Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30
                                        1 1 Cathy's Clown - The Everly Brothers 1 1 1 1 1 1
                                        4 2 Robot Man / Mama - Connie Francis * 4 7 2 4 2 4
                                        2 3 Cradle Of Love - Johnny Preston 2 2 4 2 3 5
                                        3 4 Three Steps To Heaven - Eddie Cochran 3 3 3 3 4 2
                                        5 5 Handy Man - Jimmy Jones 5 4 6 5 5 3
                                        8 6 I Wanna Go Home - Lonnie Donegan 6= 5 5 7 8 6
                                        7 7 Shazam - Duane Eddy 6= 6 7 8 6 7
                                        6 8 Sweet Nothin's - Brenda Lee 8 9 8 6 7 9
                                        11 9 Sixteen Reasons - Connie Stevens 9 11 12 10 9 11
                                        12 10 Stairway To Heaven - Neil Sedaka 12= 12 14 16 16 8
                                        19 11 Ain't Misbehavin' - Tommy Bruce 10 8 9 12 21
                                        14 12 He'll Have To Go - Jim Reeves 12= 19 11 14 11 22
                                        21 13 Down Yonder - Johnny and The Hurricanes 11 13 10 9 26
                                        NEW 14 Angela Jones - Michael Cox 17 20 17 13 15
                                        9 15 Someone Else's Baby / Big Time - Adam Faith 12= 16 15 13 15
                                        NEW 16 Good Timin' - Jimmy Jones 15= 14 15 11
                                        13 17 Lucky Five - Russ Conway 20 12 20 17
                                        10 18 Footsteps - Steve Lawrence 15= 15 10 10
                                        17 19 That's You - Nat King Cole 22 19 18 13
                                        25 20 River Stay 'Way From My Door - Frank Sinatra 20 17 16 19 27
                                        16 21 Do You Mind - Anthony Newley 18 25 12 14
                                        24 22 You'll Never Know What You're Missin' - Emile Ford and The Checkmates 24 18 12
                                        20 23 Let The Little Girl Dance - Billy Bland 22 17 16
                                        18 24 Fall In Love With You / Willie And The Hand Jive - Cliff Richard 19 26 14 18
                                        22 25 The Urge - Freddy Cannon 18 19 19
                                        23 26 That's Love - Billy Fury 27 17 20
                                        28 27 Mustapha - Bob Azzam 18
                                        NEW 28 Pistol Packin' Mama - Gene Vincent 28 20
                                        15 29 The Heart Of A Teenage Girl - Craig Douglas 20 23
                                        30 30 Sweet Dreams - Dave Sampson 28 30
                                        Mama - Connie Francis 10
                                        Romantica - Jane Morgan 28
                                        Stuck On You - Elvis Presley 24
                                        True Love Ways - Buddy Holly 25
                                        Beatnik Fly - Johnny and The Hurricanes 28
                                        Theme From 'A Summer Place' - Percy Faith 29
                                        * This week the split sides would have affected NME's
                                        averaged chart position so an average was taken
                                        from the other 4 charts giving an average of 3
                                        and awarded to NME to give a more representative
                                        chart position for both sides together.


                                        The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                                        Comment


                                        • Joe Meek managing to get a record on his independent Triumph label into the charts at 14.

                                          Comment


                                          • Originally posted by Splodj View Post
                                            Joe Meek managing to get a record on his independent Triumph label into the charts at 14.
                                            Unfortunately Joe Meek was the type of guy that would also buy up records in the known chart shops. Well recorded. The record was consider a joke. For how could a small label fill the massive amount of record shops? It was said at the time that if people asked for it, that they were told to try the chemist.
                                            The version of the song that presumably was bought at the time for it's still in my record collection was by Johnny Ferguson. Even so it is also in one of my relation's record collection, on the MGM label. It was also the first time I began to suspect the charts. For it's not in the hit singles book. I knew this was odd because my family were not big record buyers. So for them to buy a none hit was strange to say the least.
                                            Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                                            Comment


                                            • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
                                              Lots of good stuff on that chart to welcome you
                                              At home too. And the doctor's name was "Livingstone" believe it or not.
                                              He was my doctor for many years and I got some strange looks when officials at school etc asked for my doctor's name
                                              Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                                              Comment


                                              • Johnny Ferguson's version of Angela Jones will chart soon too.
                                                The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                                                Comment


                                                • I have to admit I loved Joe Meek's sound. I have lots of his hits and lesser ones too.
                                                  The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

                                                  Comment


                                                  • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                                                    There are 10 differences this week in chart positions between the BBC Chart Top 20 and The Ultimate Averaged Chart Top 20.

                                                    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending June 25th 1960.

                                                    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending June 25th 1960 NME RM MM DISC RR Total
                                                    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 80 60 38 50 30 Points
                                                    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                                                    1 1 Cathy's Clown - The Everly Brothers 1 1 1 1 2 6 7540
                                                    2 2 Robot Man / Mama - Connie Francis 2 3 2 3 1 2 7414
                                                    4 3 Three Steps To Heaven - Eddie Cochran 3 2 3 2 3 1 7402
                                                    3 4 Cradle Of Love - Johnny Preston 4 6 6 5 4 4 6648
                                                    5 5 Handy Man - Jimmy Jones 5 4 7 6 6 3 6640
                                                    11 6 Ain't Misbehavin' - Tommy Bruce 7 6 4 7 8 9 6342
                                                    6 7 I Wanna Go Home - Lonnie Donegan 8 8 8 8 5 5 6174
                                                    16 8 Good Timin' - Jimmy Jones 6 4 5 4 11 18 6136
                                                    8 9 Sweet Nothin's - Brenda Lee 9 9 14 9 7 8 5506
                                                    13 10 Down Yonder - Johnny and The Hurricanes 10 10 9 10 12 16 5198
                                                    9 11 Sixteen Reasons - Connie Stevens 11 12 12 11 10 17 4890
                                                    7 12 Shazam - Duane Eddy 12 15 13 14 9 7 4826
                                                    12 13 He'll Have To Go - Jim Reeves 13 13 11 13 13 12 4794
                                                    14 14 Angela Jones - Michael Cox 14 17 10 12 15 14 4412
                                                    20 15 River Stay 'Way From My Door - Frank Sinatra 16 16 16 16 19 28 3360
                                                    10 16 Stairway To Heaven - Neil Sedaka 17 14 17 17 11 3332
                                                    28 17 Pistol Packin' Mama - Gene Vincent 18 19 15 18 16 30 3194
                                                    18 18 Footsteps - Steve Lawrence 15 20 15 14 13 2878
                                                    19 19 That's You - Nat King Cole 22 19 18 10 2720
                                                    NEW 20 Made You / When Johnny Comes Marching Home - Adam Faith 19 18 18 19 2276
                                                    23 21 Let The Little Girl Dance - Billy Bland 20 26 17 15 1580
                                                    27 22 Mustapha - Bob Azzam 21 27 920
                                                    15 23 Someone Else's Baby / Big Time - Adam Faith 20 19 910
                                                    17 24 Lucky Five - Russ Conway 23 23 880
                                                    NEW 25 Talkin' Army Blues - Josh McCrae 20 660
                                                    NEW 26 Shakin' All Over - Johnny Kidd and The Pirates 28 20 658
                                                    NEW 27 What A Mouth - Tommy Steele 24 560
                                                    25 28 The Urge - Freddy Cannon 27 24 530
                                                    NEW 29 Romantica - Jane Morgan 25 480
                                                    22 30 You'll Never Know What You're Missin' - Emile Ford and The Checkmates 30 22 350
                                                    Mama - Connie Francis 11
                                                    The Heart Of A Teenage Girl - Craig Douglas 20 330
                                                    Fall In Love With You / Willie And The Hand Jive - Cliff Richard 21 300
                                                    Stuck On You - Elvis Presley 25 180
                                                    Bill Bailey Won't You Please Come Home - Bobby Darin 29 160
                                                    That's Love - Billy Fury 26 150
                                                    Why Didn't You Tell Me - Marke Anthony 30 80
                                                    Got A Girl - The Four Preps 29 60
                                                    The Ultimate Averaged Chart. The Definitive Chart Reflecting The Fifties and Sixties.

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