Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • The Beatles edge up the chart again this week but no thanks to the NME as Love Me Do is still invisible to them for a 4th straight week.
    The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

    The Biggest Chart Of The Time

    Comment


    • I estimate that if NME had combined the Cliff record they would have placed it at 2 this week, so would have had the same Top 4 as Disc.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Splodj View Post
        I estimate that if NME had combined the Cliff record they would have placed it at 2 this week, so would have had the same Top 4 as Disc.
        This was always going to be the problem with NME and their cursed split sides, we were never going to know the true extent of their split sides when joined together to give one position. This therefore led to estimates at best based on the average of the other charts to try and give this some definition.
        The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

        The Biggest Chart Of The Time

        Comment


        • I don't how the EMI chart (composite + top up) dealt with the issue but they also listed sides separately. Perhaps they relied on the top up element to separate them. On 26-Jan-63 they had the peculiar situation of Cliff (Next Time) being ousted at number one by Cliff (Bachelor Boy).

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Splodj View Post
            On 26-Jan-63 they had the peculiar situation of Cliff (Next Time) being ousted at number one by Cliff (Bachelor Boy).
            Now that is a strange one ! The methodology behind that move puzzles me.
            The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

            The Biggest Chart Of The Time

            Comment


            • Guys, does anybody have, or know anybody who has, copies of the record charts compiled by EMI ?

              I have a list of the EMI #1's that I got from Dave way back. He was going to let me have the full charts but sadly left or passed away before this could be followed through.

              It's a long shot I know, I can but try
              The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

              The Biggest Chart Of The Time

              Comment


              • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
                Guys, does anybody have, or know anybody who has, copies of the record charts compiled by EMI ?

                I have a list of the EMI #1's that I got from Dave way back. He was going to let me have the full charts but sadly left or passed away before this could be followed through.

                It's a long shot I know, I can but try
                I think you will find them on the American Radio site where we get all the old papers, they are listed under the UK music press section.
                Education for anyone aged 12 to 16 has made a mess of the world!

                Comment


                • Coincidently Return to Sender went Silver last week,

                  Elvis Presley - Return To Sender - RCA - Silver - Single - 02.04.2021 - 19.11.2004

                  Of course it got a Silver Disc in 1962 for 250,000 plus shipments.

                  Comment


                  • Greetings Pop Pickers !

                    Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending December 22nd 1962

                    The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending December 22nd 1962 NME MM DISC RR Total
                    Last This The Sound Survey Stores 80 110 50 30 Points
                    Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                    1 1 Return To Sender - Elvis Presley 1 1 1 1 1 8100
                    5 2 The Next Time / Bachelor Boy - Cliff Richard* 2 3 3 2 2 7696
                    2 3 Lovesick Blues / She Taught Me How To Yodel - Frank Ifield 3 3 2 3 3 7670
                    3 4 Sun Arise - Rolf Harris 4 2 4 4 4 7450
                    7 5 (Dance With The) Guitar Man - Duane Eddy 5 5 5 8 6 6840
                    4 6 Bobby's Girl - Susan Maughan 6 7 6 6 5 6700
                    11 7 Rockin' Around The Christmas Tree - Brenda Lee 7 8 8 7 7 6290
                    20 8 Dance On - The Shadows 8 6 11 5 11 6100
                    6 9 Let's Dance - Chris Montez 9 9 7 9 12 6070
                    8 10 The Swiss Maid - Del Shannon 10 11 9 10 8 5760
                    10 11 Telstar - The Tornados 11 10 10 13 9 5550
                    14 12 It Only Took A Minute - Joe Brown 13 12 12 12 13 5100
                    9 13 Devil Woman - Marty Robbins 12 14 13 11 10 4970
                    12 14 The Main Attraction - Pat Boone 14 15 14 15 14 4460
                    17 15 Desafinado - Stan Getz and Charlie Byrd 15 20 18 14 18 3550
                    16 16 A Forever Kind Of Love - Bobby Vee 16 23 16 17 19 3350
                    18 17 Must Be Madison - Joe Loss 18 22 17 16 24 3220
                    13 18 Sherry - The Four Seasons 17 25 15 20 17 3210
                    24 19 Like I Do - Maureen Evans 19 20 24 19 20 2580
                    30 20 Your Cheating Heart - Ray Charles 20 15 23 25 1860
                    19 21 The 'James Bond' Theme - John Barry 21 21 26 16 1800
                    15 22 Venus In Blue Jeans - Mark Wynter 25 19 27 23 1760
                    22 23 Love Me Tender - Richard Chamberlain 22 20 15 1690
                    21 24 No One Can Make My Sunshine Smile - The Everly Brothers 23= 26 23 29 21 1680
                    28 25 Baby Take A Bow - Adam Faith 26 17 30 24 30 1610
                    NEW 26 Go Away Little Girl - Mark Wynter 23= 19 18 1610
                    NEW 27 Up On The Roof - Kenny Lynch 27 18 28 26 1340
                    25 28 Love Me Do - The Beatles 28 22 22 1260
                    NEW 29 Me And My Shadow - Frank Sinatra and Sammy Davis Jnr. 29 24 22 1010
                    26 30 Because Of Love - Billy Fury 25 29 720
                    * This week the split sides would have affected NME's averaged chart position so an average was taken from the other 3 charts giving an average of 2.3 to Cliff Richard and awarded to NME to give a more representative chart position for both sides together.
                    Bachelor Boy - Cliff Richard 13
                    Always You And Me - Russ Conway 30 29 21 720
                    23 The Loco-Motion - Little Eva 26 28 640
                    B Can Can '62 - Peter Jay and The Jaywalkers 27 440
                    27 Ramblin' Rose - Nat King Cole 28 330
                    B Up On The Roof - Julie Grant 27 320
                    B Just For Kicks - Mike Sarne 25 300
                    Gossip Calypso - Bernard Cribbins 28 240
                    B He's A Rebel - The Crystals 29 160
                    B We're Gonna Go Fishin' - Hank Locklin 27 120
                    B Island Of Dreams - The Springfields 30 80
                    X Go Away Little Girl - Ray Bennett 30 50
                    29 Oh Lonesome Me - Craig Douglas
                    The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                    The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                    Comment


                    • Cliff closes in for hopefully another #1, but will the split sides affect this. The Shadows take a big leap into the top ten.

                      Up On The Roof is a new entry this week for Kenny Lynch and is the version that will be the bigger hit, but the version played to death on Radio Luxembourg back then and the version I always preferred is Julie Grant's superior version.
                      The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                      The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                      Comment


                      • Kenny Lynch is another victim of 'official' chart revisionism, as co-writer of 'Sha-la-la-la-lee'.

                        His 'Misery' was a flop even though it was sandwiched between his two big hits. It was released just before the Please Please Me album, in that hallowed period we are about to enter 'between the end of the Chatterley ban and the Beatles first LP'!

                        Comment


                        • Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending December 29th 1962
                          The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending December 29th 1962 NME MM DISC RR Total
                          Last This The Sound Survey Stores 80 110 50 30 Points
                          Week Week The Top 30 Singles Chart BBC TOP 30 Scored
                          2 1 The Next Time / Bachelor Boy - Cliff Richard 2 1 1 2 4770
                          1 2 Return To Sender - Elvis Presley 1 2 2 1 4670
                          8 3 Dance On - The Shadows 5 3 3 3 4480
                          4 4 Sun Arise - Rolf Harris 4 4 4 7 4230
                          3 5 Lovesick Blues / She Taught Me How To yodel - Frank Ifield 3 5 5 5 4160
                          5 6 (Dance With The) Guitar Man - Duane Eddy 6 6 7 4 4010
                          7 7 Rockin' Around The Christmas Tree - Brenda Lee 7 6 6 6 4000
                          9 8 Let's Dance - Chris Montez 9 8 9 10 3570
                          6 9 Bobby's Girl - Susan Maughan 8 10 8 9 3490
                          12 10 It Only Took A Minute - Joe Brown 12 11 10 15 3130
                          11 11 Telstar - The Tornados 10 12 16 8 2960
                          10 12 The Swiss Maid - Del Shannon 11 16 11 12 2770
                          14 13 The Main Attraction - Pat Boone 13 14 13 16 2710
                          20 14 Your Cheating Heart - Ray Charles 18 14 19 13 2500
                          15 15 Desafinado - Stan Getz and Charlie Byrd 15 20 12 11 2430
                          27 16 Up On The Roof - Kenny Lynch 22= 13 20 22 2260
                          17 17 Must Be Madison - Joe Loss 16 18 14 21 2190
                          26 18 Go Away Little Girl - Mark Wynter 22= 17 15 28 2010
                          29 19 Me And My Shadow - Frank Sinatra and Sammy Davis Jnr. 20= 19 17 20 1990
                          13 20 Devil Woman - Marty Robbins 14 22 21 14 1730
                          19 21 Like I Do - Maureen Evans 20= 20 18 29 1590
                          16 22 A Forever Kind Of Love - Bobby Vee 17 23 22 19 1450
                          25 23 Baby Take A Bow - Adam Faith 24 26 25 23 940
                          NEW 24 Island Of Dreams - The Springfields 26 25 28 24 840
                          18 25 Sherry - The Four Seasons 19 23 25 580
                          NEW 26 Don't You Think It's Time - Mike Berry 27 26 570
                          NEW 27 Gossip Calypso - Bernard Cribbins 29 24 560
                          28 28 Love Me Do - The Beatles 25 17 420
                          NEW 29 We're Gonna Go Fishin' - Hank Locklin 27 18 390
                          NEW 30 Up On The Roof - Julie Grant 29 27 360
                          * MM did not compile a chart this week. Also the BBC chart positions are way off this week. Did they maybe include the repeated week of MM chart or just got the figures wrong because Elvis can't be #1, Frank Ifield #3 and lots of other positions have to be wrong as well.
                          Bachelor Boy - Cliff Richard 9
                          Always You And Me - Russ Conway 24 350
                          X Merry Christmas You Suckers - Paddy Roberts 28 240
                          B He's A Rebel - The Crystals 28 30 26 200
                          X Up On The Roof - The Drifters 29 160
                          23 Love Me Tender - Richard Chamberlain 30 27 120
                          X Go Away Little Girl - Ray Bennett 29 100
                          I Remember You - Frank Ifield 30 30
                          21 The 'James Bond' Theme - John Barry
                          22 Venus In Blue Jeans - Mark Wynter
                          24 No One Can Make My Sunshine Smile - The Everly Brothers
                          30 Because Of Love - Billy Fury
                          The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                          The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                          Comment


                          • Would the figures tally for the BBC chart if the previous week's Melody Maker chart was factored in? I don't know if anyone has a spreadsheet that will enable them to create a quick chart using BBC POTP chart rules.

                            Comment


                            • I would normally be able to do it but am without a PC at the moment. POTP was a review of the year's Top 3's, so perhaps they didn't bother too much in producing a chart for that week.

                              Comment


                              • I entered the previous weeks MM chart positions into the December 29th spreadsheet and yeah with that factored in it does produce a chart that matches the BBC chart for 29th December, so it looks like that is what they did.

                                Crazy, why include a repeated chart along with three new charts that will give an inaccurate chart for that week. It is yet another example that they never really took their own chart seriously.
                                The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                                Comment


                                • Just looking at it, I'd say 3 and 5 should be the other way round. Another transcription typo?

                                  Comment


                                  • Ignore last post. Yes Brian it does seem silly.

                                    Comment


                                    • Interesting. I wonder if the BBC actually produced a chart for Dec 29, 1962? As Splodj says, POTP did a 'review of the year' show for that week. I do see that the next week's POTP show Jan 5, 1963 is available on audio, so perhaps Fluff mentioned each record's prior week position then? If so, then the BBC did indeed calc a chart for Dec 29. If not, then it would appear Dave/Trevor reconstructed it. D/T usually mention in a note when a component chart was not produced for a given week, and there is no note in the chart file for Dec 29.


                                      Comment


                                      • Robin which site hosts these old radio shows ta ?
                                        The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                        The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by MrTibbs View Post
                                          I entered the previous weeks MM chart positions into the December 29th spreadsheet and yeah with that factored in it does produce a chart that matches the BBC chart for 29th December, so it looks like that is what they did.
                                          Are you going to update your chart with the repeated MM chart, or just leave it alone as is?

                                          Comment


                                          • Originally posted by brian05 View Post

                                            Are you going to update your chart with the repeated MM chart, or just leave it alone as is?
                                            No I am not going to update it Brian as it would give an inaccurate chart based on three new charts and the repeat of an old chart. As you can see throughout the years of The Ultimate chart any time a music paper did not compile a chart it was left blank for that week and not included. Only those weekly papers that compiled a chart on any given week were used.
                                            The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                            The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                                            Comment


                                            • OK - that's fine.

                                              Looking forward to 1963 - the year I started collecting records (and Beatlemania descended upon us).

                                              Comment


                                              • Originally posted by brian05 View Post
                                                OK - that's fine.

                                                Looking forward to 1963 - the year I started collecting records (and Beatlemania descended upon us).
                                                I'm working on December 1963 at present Brian with all other months completed and ready to roll and it's a fascinating year. Like you that was my year for truly awakening to the sounds of the sixties and what sounds they were

                                                So, I'll be posting the first chart of 1963 here tomorrow and aiming to post a couple of charts each day. The Beatles are on their way !
                                                The Record Mirror Chart Re-Calculated, Re-Worked, Extended

                                                The Biggest Chart Of The Time

                                                Comment


                                                • Brian, thanks to all the endless hard work of Terry O'Brien, audio from the old Pick of the Pops shows are available here:
                                                  The text and comments about the shows can be found here:
                                                  Terry's POTP facebook page is also worth keeping up with, as he posts new show updates when he gets them:

                                                  Comment


                                                  • According to the 'week ending' Jan 5, 1963 POTP show, the BBC did indeed calculate a chart for Dec 29, 1962, as the last week positions of Jan 5 quoted by Fluff (for the Top 10 of the audio) agree with the Dave/Trevor BBC file. Therefore the Beeb is responsible for using the previous week of MM for Dec 29. Interesting, fascinating...

                                                    A thought: I've always wondered about this. For a missing weekly chart, how accurate/reliable would it be to average together the charts a week before and a week after, and use this for the missing week, and of course document it with a note? I haven't done any number crunching, but it would be easy to do for any 3 week test period. It'd have to be better than skipping that week, or freezing the previous week. Easy to do after the fact, but not in real time for a radio show, as you of course wouldn't know what the next week's chart positions would be, ha.

                                                    Comment

                                                    Working...
                                                    X