The Ultimate Averaged Chart - The BBC Chart Re-Imagined

[MrTibbs]

More BBC errors for 14/2/59: 19 Beverly Sisters - Little Drummer Boy (77)
20= Tommy Dorsey - Tea For Two Cha Cha (78)
20= Pat Boone - I'll Remember Tonight (78)

Yeah you're right David the points totals doesn't justify their chart outcome yet again.

[braindeadpj]

More BBC errors for 14/2/59: 19 Beverly Sisters - Little Drummer Boy (77)
20= Tommy Dorsey - Tea For Two Cha Cha (78)
20= Pat Boone - I'll Remember Tonight (78)

[kingofskiffle]

He worked with a lot of artists in his TV show and added his name to make them sell a bit more and start off. I think he did that with Kenny Ball in 1962 but am
unsure….. I know he did something at that point like ‘lonnie donegan presents…’ but might have the artist wrong!

[MrTibbs]

It might come as a surprise to some people but later this year those popular crooners of the day Miki and Griff will have a minor hit with The Lonnie Donegan Skiffle Group. Apparently Lonnie's backing accompanied a few of their songs.

[Splodj]

McCartney must have been an early admirer as he went to a Donegan concert on 11th November 1956, according to The Beatles Bible.

(Alan Smith posted on that site earlier this year - so presumably is still around.)

[kingofskiffle]

Pub With No Beer is one my dad used to sing (he played the guitar and did perform in some clubs in the early 1970’s). I liked the song a lot

I think Lonnie was doing stuff that got people in and the act developed into that. When I saw him in about 1989 the act was the classic songs because that’s what people wanted. In the 1950’s you had that mix of music and odd acts. Look at for example Ken Dodd and those Victorian music hall type shows on bbc 4.

[Splodj]

'A Pub With No Beer' the first Australian record in the UK charts, I believe. (I like The Dubliners later cover.)

Although Lonnie's first novelty song his stage show always had a humorous streak running through it. Watching him on YouTube I get the impression he saw himself as an entertainer rather than just a singer.

[MrTibbs]

How weird, two months after Christmas and two versions of The Little Drummer boy chart in time for Valentine's Day.
Lonnie Donegan moves on to show his novelty side for the first time but it won't be his last.
Huge variations with Petite Fleur, 14 and 15 in two charts and 27 and nowhere on the other two.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending February 14th 1959

Here are all '' the uppers, the downers, the just hanging 'arounders '

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending February 14th 1959								NME	MM	DISC	RM	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey					75	25	40	60	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
1	1	I Got Stung / One Night - Elvis Presley					1	1	1	1	1	6000
2	2	To Know Him Is To Love Him - The Teddy Bears					2	4	2	4	2	5570
4	3	Kiss Me Honey Honey Kiss Me - Shirley Bassey					3=	3	5	2	4	5530
5	4	As I Love You - Shirley Bassey					3=	2	3	3	6	5495
3	5	Baby Face - Little Richard					5	5	4	7	3	5265
10	6	Does Your Chewing Gum Lose It's Flavour - Lonnie Donegan					6	6	7	5	5	5075
6	7	Problems - The Everly Brothers					7=	8	8	6	7	4740
7	8	Smoke Gets In Your Eyes - The Platters					7=	7	6	8	8	4725
8	9	The Day The Rains Came - Jane Morgan					9	9	11	13	9	4190
22	10	A Pub With No Beer - Slim Dusty					10	11	10	15	10	3925
11	11	High School Confidential - Jerry Lee Lewis					12	12	16	9	13	3760
9	12	It's Only Make Believe - Conway Twitty					11	13	9	11	15	3660
16	13	(All Of A Sudden) My Heart Sings - Paul Anka					14	10	13	16	14	3645
18	14	I'll Be With You In Apple Blossom Time - Rosemary June					13	14	12	14	12	3570
19	15	Wee Tom - Lord Rockingham's XI					15	16		12	11	3085
NEW	16	The Little Drummer Boy - The Beverly Sisters					20	16			19	1845
NEW	17	Petite Fleur - Chris Barber					16	27	14		15	1685
17	18	Chantilly Lace - The Big Bopper						26		20	20	1475
24	19	Livin' Lovin' Doll - Cliff Richard						20		17		1385
13	20	Hoots Mon - Lord Rockingham's XI					18	25	15	18		1370
26	21	I'll Remember Tonight - Pat Boone								19	17	1320
25	22	The World Outside - The Four Aces						18	20			1250
NEW	23	My Happiness - Connie Francis						19	18			1225
12	24	Tea For Two Cha-Cha - The Tommy Dorsey Orchestra					19	15				1200
15	25	Tom Dooley - Lonnie Donegan						22	17			1025
NEW	26	Stagger Lee - Lloyd Price						29			18	930
20	27	You Always Hurt The One You Love - Connie Francis					17			10		840
NEW	28	Gigi - Billy Eckstine						20				825
23	29	The World Outside - Ronnie Hilton						22				675
NEW	29	The Little Drummer Boy - The Harry Simeone Chorale						22				675
29		You're The Top Cha - Al Saxon							19			300
14		Tom Dooley - The Kingston Trio						28				225
		The Wonderful Secret Of Love - Robert Earl						29				150
21		Love Makes The World Go 'Round / Mandolins In The Moonlight - Perry Como
27		Come On Let's Go - Tommy Steele
27		That's My Doll - Frankie Vaughan

[braindeadpj]

I wonder whether the BBC decided to split the titles because they were in the top 3 - not sure how though - I was going to say that they split it based on the fact that Little Richard is staying at 2 while The Teddy bears would be climbing to 2, but it would make more sense to be the other way round, so maybe its just that somebody couldn't count??

[Splodj]

Great info.

I suppose you know that Feb-59 was a special time for British records, because 3 of them were in the upper echelons of the Billboard chart simultaneously - inciuding that Chris Barber one you mention.

[MrTibbs]

When the NME chart book came out they said it included some corrections. Have these been identified?

I don't know if they were corrected in later volumes but in the first edition the following were omitted that I am immediately aware off.

1952 20th December Kay Starr Comes-A-Long-A-Love from #3
1959 28th February Petite Fleur Chris Barber from #8

But the first volume also corrected the following error made in the paper at the time.

1972 25th March Donnie Elbert I Can't Help Myself which in the book was slotted in as extra #10 with Floy Joy by The Supremes.

In 1974 19th January Diana Ross All Of My Life was omitted from the paper and was added in later as an extra #17 with Street Life by Roxy Music.

[kingofskiffle]

When the NME chart book came out they said it included some corrections. Have these been identified?

I am not aware of them all - I think it was some of the weeks when entries were omitted (Such as the week Russ Conway Got A Match charted at 30 and yet didn't....)

[Splodj]

There is a very peculiar claim across the web that 'Livin Lovin Doll' was released to pretend that he was fulfilling an obligation to release 'Livin Doll' - as if they wouldn't notice the difference!

------

When the NME chart book came out they said it included some corrections. Have these been identified?

[MrTibbs]

15 27 High Class Baby - Cliff Richard

NEW 28 Livin' Lovin' Doll - Cliff Richard

A much weaker follow-up to his previous hits. A long wait for his first number one?

I agree Brian but two absolute belters to follow this year.

[brian05]

15 27 High Class Baby - Cliff Richard

NEW 28 Livin' Lovin' Doll - Cliff Richard

A much weaker follow-up to his previous hits. A long wait for his first number one?

[Splodj]

One obvious difference is that the BBC is only counting NMEs top 20. For example, Connie Francis is given only 21 points for NME instead of 26. But neither way is ideal; you really need all 4 inputting Top 30s or more for a robust Top 20 output.

[MrTibbs]

Yet another calculation/transcript error on the BBC chart again this week.

I think by now it is blatantly obvious that the level of errors in calculation on the BBC chart far exceeds the level previously thought to be the case. This has only been brought to light because the UAC compilation has initiated a level of scrutiny on the BBC figures previously not undertaken. Until this the figures have been totally accepted and taken at face value.

At the onset my goal was to produce an averaged music paper chart that aside from averaging out simple chart positions, as done by the BBC chart, would also be made more robust by factoring in approximate numbers of shop dealer returns as well as not all charts were equal in that respect. This 'extra level' was designed to eradicate the large number of ties that existed in the BBC chart and to correct the few known errors that were already known to exist within the BBC chart.

But now we know differently following this exercise. The BBC chart can no longer be accepted as a robust, accurate, or viable chart for reference purposes as it seriously flawed both in compilation and authority.
Furthermore I have just pointed out the obvious errors that jumped out of the page at me when transferring the figures to the spreadsheet for the UAC. There are obviously lots more if you look even closer as David (braindeadpj) discovered and mentions above.

So, for those of us who like me believe an averaged chart best represents this time period before actual shop sales figures were used by the BMRB I'd like to think I have offered a suitable alternative by introducing the UAC. The BBC principle was correct but too simplistic and poorly executed. The UAC is far from perfect after all it's based on imperfect data from a points system in dealer returns to music papers. Human error would play a part in these returns, manipulation, flawed information downright untruths at times even. But that was the times and these are our only historical records of what was passing across counters at the time.

That is why I believe the averaging process provides the most robust chart. At least if one paper gets it wrong, and they do, just look at any of the chart comparisons on the UAC page and you will see just how often that happens that one is out of sync with the others but the other papers help smooth this out to provide a more balanced chart.

At least I'm satisfied that the UAC is as accurate as possible to the data provided. Being human and in dealing with multiple figures I too have made some errors along the way, some I noticed and corrected as I went along and others you picked up on and I corrected.
I'm therefore satisfied the goal is being met the BBC has been not only been 're-imagined' but restructured as well.

[MrTibbs]

Greetings Pop Pickers

Here is the next Ultimate Averaged Chart for Week Ending February 7th 1959

Here are all '' the uppers, the downers, the just hanging 'arounders '

The Ultimate Averaged Chart - Week Ending February 7th 1959								NME	MM	DISC	RM	Total
Last	This		The Sound Survey					75	25	40	60	Points
Week	Week		The Top 30 Singles Chart				BBC			TOP	30	Scored
1	1	I Got Stung / One Night - Elvis Presley					1	1	1	1	1	6000
3	2	To Know Him Is To Love Him - The Teddy Bears *					3	2	2	3	3	5700
2	3	Baby Face - Little Richard *					2	3	3	2	2	5700
5	4	Kiss Me Honey Honey Kiss Me - Shirley Bassey					4	3	5	4	4	5450
8	5	As I Love You - Shirley Bassey					5	3	4	8	6	5195
7	6	Problems - The Everly Brothers					6=	6	8	6	5	5010
9	7	Smoke Gets In Your Eyes - The Platters					6=	7	6	5	7	4905
4	8	The Day The Rains Came - Jane Morgan					8	7	7	9	8	4660
6	9	It's Only Make Believe - Conway Twitty					9	10	9	7	9	4405
NEW	10	Does Your Chewing Gum Lose It's Flavour - Lonnie Donegan					10=	9	11	17	12	3850
17	11	High School Confidential - Jerry Lee Lewis					10=	14	15	10	10	3775
12	12	Tea For Two Cha-Cha - The Tommy Dorsey Orchestra					12	11	14	18	11	3645
14	13	Hoots Mon - Lord Rockingham's XI					13=	15	13	13	15	3330
11	14	Tom Dooley - The Kingston Trio					13=	18	12	12	14	3230
10	15	Tom Dooley - Lonnie Donegan					16	13	17	15	19	3060
19	16	(All Of A Sudden) My Heart Sings - Paul Anka					13=	12	10		13	3030
15	17	Chantilly Lace - The Big Bopper					17	17		14	18	2510
23	18	I'll Be With You In Apple Blossom Time - Rosemary June					18=	16	19		17	2265
NEW	19	Wee Tom - Lord Rockingham's XI						21	18		16	1975
18	20	You Always Hurt The One You Love - Connie Francis					18=	26		11	20	1835
13	21	Love Makes The World Go 'Round / Mandolins In The Moonlight - Perry Como					20	24	16	16		1500
26	22	A Pub With No Beer - Slim Dusty						20		19		1305
21	23	The World Outside - Ronnie Hilton						18				975
28	24	Livin' Lovin' Doll - Cliff Richard						25		20		890
30	25	The World Outside - The Four Aces						23	20			875
20	26	I'll Remember Tonight - Pat Boone						21				750
16	27	Come On Let's Go - Tommy Steele						28				225
NEW	27	That's My Doll - Frankie Vaughan						28				225
22	29	You're The Top Cha - Al Saxon						30				75
		Mandolins In The Moonlight - Perry Como (B)						27
24		Someday (You'll Want Me To Want You) - Ricky Nelson
25		There Must Be A Way - Joni James
27		High Class Baby - Cliff Richard
29		Cannonball - Duane Eddy
30		Last Night On The Back Porch - Alma Cogan
		* Either the BBC or the manuscipt is wrong again as it lists a #2 and #3 but the points clearly indicate a tie.

[MrTibbs]

Also Pat Boone's I'll Remember The Night is a re-entry on the 31st January chart from the 17th January (when it was at 28).

Yip, now corrected.