Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

UK OCC Charts Midweeks Thread: 2021

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Beautyisbeauty
    replied
    They should just create a new chart for catalog songs updated every week and call it a day. You´d still have charts based on consumption and, at the same time, adapted to a streaming-driven market.

    Leave a comment:


  • InFamous
    replied
    Originally posted by bm08 View Post

    Firstly, you have no idea what I am "extremely invested" in so not sure what that has to do with this. It would be preferable to not assume this.

    Secondly, whether the same songs are playing on loop is irrelevant to the fact that those songs are being streamed based on the rules given.

    My point is simple. Apply the rules to all songs at all times of the year. If the issue is passive consumption of music, then remove its impact on the charts for all songs. Just because it is being 'abused' this time of year doesnt mean it isnt also abused other times of the year. It is narrow sighted to simply say the system is broken only 1 month of the entire year.
    Ok.

    But the effect is clearly exaccerbated when it comes to the Christmas songs.

    A quick look at the charts will tell you that. Also, I personally am not remotely bothered by the Christmas songs resurging for a month every year, but it is clear that it would not happen without the extreme passive listening. I mean is anyone really putting on Christmas songs at home now ? A massive percentage of the streams are simply passive ambient listening and I dont believe this is true for other songs at other times of years to the same extent.

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by InFamous View Post

    Lol I know you are extremely invested in protecting the Christmas songs so youre not going to see this rationally.
    Walk into any shop, anywhere in the country from Dec 1st and they all have the same Christmas music playing on loop. Trying to deny this is.. a choice.
    Firstly, you have no idea what I am "extremely invested" in so not sure what that has to do with this. It would be preferable to not assume this.

    Secondly, whether the same songs are playing on loop is irrelevant to the fact that those songs are being streamed based on the rules given.

    My point is simple. Apply the rules to all songs at all times of the year. If the issue is passive consumption of music, then remove its impact on the charts for all songs. Just because it is being 'abused' this time of year doesnt mean it isnt also abused other times of the year. It is narrow sighted to simply say the system is broken only 1 month of the entire year.

    Leave a comment:


  • InFamous
    replied
    Originally posted by bm08 View Post

    Yes, because we have data to support that every store in the country is playing the same genre playlist containing the same songs literally 24/7 this time of year.

    This is quite frankly hyperbolic.
    Lol I know you are extremely invested in protecting the Christmas songs so youre not going to see this rationally.
    Walk into any shop, anywhere in the country from Dec 1st and they all have the same Christmas music playing on loop. Trying to deny this is.. a choice.

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by InFamous View Post

    It is highly unlikely that every store in the country is playing the same genre playlist containing the same songs literally 24/7 at any other time of the year. Its not remotely the same.
    Yes, because we have data to support that every store in the country is playing the same genre playlist containing the same songs literally 24/7 this time of year.

    This is quite frankly hyperbolic.

    Leave a comment:


  • InFamous
    replied
    Originally posted by bm08 View Post

    But why is that relevant only for Christmas songs? As another user pointed out, this isnt the only time of year when shopping centres and stores play music from playlists.
    It is highly unlikely that every store in the country is playing the same genre playlist containing the same songs literally 24/7 at any other time of the year. Its not remotely the same.

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by InFamous View Post

    This is not true when it comes to Xmas songs. As that poster rightful pointed out every shopping centre and store is playing all those Xmas playlists on loop across the country and that's all being counted for the charts now.
    But why is that relevant only for Christmas songs? As another user pointed out, this isnt the only time of year when shopping centres and stores play music from playlists.

    Leave a comment:


  • InFamous
    replied
    Originally posted by bm08 View Post

    But sales are becoming increasingly negligible. Would you rather no songs becoming certified at all?

    If you reduce the weight of streaming, it should be for all songs not just for "old" songs. After all, one could easily make the argument it is more difficult for "old" songs to perform well on streaming than songs by newer (whiter, male) artists.
    This is not true when it comes to Xmas songs. As that poster rightful pointed out every shopping centre and store is playing all those Xmas playlists on loop across the country and that's all being counted for the charts now.

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by MadNuno View Post

    As I said, reduce the weight of streaming for all songs and old seasonal songs that charted last season shouldn't have more weight than songs released 13 weeks ago like "Shivers".
    There is no objective reason streams should be differently weighted, especially for certification purposes, simply because a song was released more than "13 weeks ago".

    This is ageist in practice, especially given the fact that older songs already face difficulty being playlisted, being played on tv and radio, etc.

    Leave a comment:


  • MadNuno
    replied
    Originally posted by bm08 View Post

    But sales are becoming increasingly negligible. Would you rather no songs becoming certified at all?

    If you reduce the weight of streaming, it should be for all songs not just for "old" songs. After all, one could easily make the argument it is more difficult for "old" songs to perform well on streaming than songs by newer (whiter, male) artists.
    As I said, reduce the weight of streaming for all songs and old seasonal songs that charted last season shouldn't have more weight than songs released 13 weeks ago like "Shivers".

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by MadNuno View Post

    Sure because they don't have the policy of older records having half the streams and counting less points for chart (as UK have) but just the different ratio one (for both charts and awards certifications).

    I was defending having both (the different stream ratios and the reduced weight of streams of old songs).

    As far as I can see streams will soon make new records and some of these oldies christmas songs some of the most certified awards records as wel (many already have streaming points being 5 times more than pure sales and the difference increases year after year). The streaming certification changes are now certifing the most played songs instead of the best selling songs and as streaming increases songs that are seasonaly played over and over on holiday seasons by shops playlists 24/7 will get ahead in half a dozen years.

    If there are no changes by 2030 most probably most of the TOP 10 most certified songs of all time in UK will be christmas songs when before streaming only "Do They Know Is Christmas?" was among TOP 10 best selling singles ever. In less than 15 years this generose streaming weight ratio will change almost completely the way the All Time Chart 100 most certified songs looked for over 60 years (as it already changed almost 50 of the 100 most certified songs already). Kind of very unrealistic and much appreatiated by the music industry that is marketing to control that the way they need to make more money. Sad.
    But sales are becoming increasingly negligible. Would you rather no songs becoming certified at all?

    If you reduce the weight of streaming, it should be for all songs not just for "old" songs. After all, one could easily make the argument it is more difficult for "old" songs to perform well on streaming than songs by newer (whiter, male) artists.

    Leave a comment:


  • MadNuno
    replied
    Originally posted by huhu78 View Post

    But in Germany it's the same problem: Mariah, WHAM, Melanie Thornton, John Lennon, Rolf Zuckowski...every year.
    Sure because they don't have the policy of older records having half the streams and counting less points for chart (as UK have) but just the different ratio one (for both charts and awards certifications).

    I was defending having both (the different stream ratios and the reduced weight of streams of old songs).

    As far as I can see streams will soon make new records and some of these oldies christmas songs some of the most certified awards records as wel (many already have streaming points being 5 times more than pure sales and the difference increases year after year). The streaming certification changes are now certifing the most played songs instead of the best selling songs and as streaming increases songs that are seasonaly played over and over on holiday seasons by shops playlists 24/7 will get ahead in half a dozen years.

    If there are no changes by 2030 most probably most of the TOP 10 most certified songs of all time in UK will be christmas songs when before streaming only "Do They Know Is Christmas?" was among TOP 10 best selling singles ever. In less than 15 years this generose streaming weight ratio will change almost completely the way the All Time Chart 100 most certified songs looked for over 60 years (as it already changed almost 50 of the 100 most certified songs already). Kind of very unrealistic and much appreatiated by the music industry that is marketing to control that the way they need to make more money. Sad how they are trying to re-write history - nothing new.
    Last edited by MadNuno; Tue December 7, 2021, 11:50.

    Leave a comment:


  • huhu78
    replied
    Originally posted by MadNuno View Post
    Streaming have too much power and so have old christmas songs.

    If Streaming points were cut in half like in Germany (200 streams are a chart sale instead of 100 streams) and older songs points are cut to half (all songs older than 3 years and that charted during that period of time) then we could have the problem solved. Older songs that are revivaled only once would still chart high until being cut and older songs that come back every year on Holidays due to playlists streams would not be hugelly favored by it (they are already very promoted and so they also sell well too).
    But in Germany it's the same problem: Mariah, WHAM, Melanie Thornton, John Lennon, Rolf Zuckowski...every year.

    Leave a comment:


  • SholasBoy
    replied
    Kelly Clarkson looks like she’ll have her best outing for Underneath The Tree this year despite the fact she has a brand new Christmas album.

    Leave a comment:


  • braindeadpj
    replied
    So Wham! is currently no.1 without ACR. Mariah 2, Ed and Elton 3, Pogues 4 and possibly Adele at 5 (depending on Shakin' Steven's "sales"!
    Last edited by braindeadpj; Mon December 6, 2021, 19:38.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blondini
    replied
    Nevermind has staggered physical releases of the deluxe versions - though the Super Deluxe wasn't due until the 17th according to Amazon, it may have shipped early. The vinyl of this isn't due till next May!


    Polo G shouldn't be regarded as new, it's the previous Hall Of Fame album plus the second volume at the start as a "deluxe". Same as Eminem did and all those Kid Laroi versions.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blondini
    replied
    Official Singles / Albums Chart Update
    Source: OCC
    Missing Data: unknown

    Top 100 Singles

    1 Ed Sheeran & Elton John - Merry Christmas (33,109) *
    2 Adele - Easy On Me (19,281)
    3 Wham! - Last Christmas (18,701)
    4 Mariah Carey - All I Want For Christmas Is You (18,142)
    5 The Pogues feat. Kirsty MacColl - Fairytale Of New York (12,751)

    6-10
    6 Shakin' Stevens - Merry Christmas Everyone
    8 Michael Bublé - It's Beginning To Look A lot Like Christmas
    9 Brenda Lee - Rockin' Around The Christmas Tree
    10 George Ezra - Come On Home For Christmas

    11-20
    11 Band Aid - Do They Know It's Christmas?
    12 Elton John - Step Into Christmas
    13 Kelly Clarkson - Underneath The Tree
    16 Ariana Grande - Santa Tell Me
    18 Andy Williams - It's The Most Wonderful Time of the Year

    21-30
    21 Wizzard - I Wish It Could Be Christmas Everyday
    24 Paul McCartney - Wonderful Christmastime ^
    25 Chris Rea - Driving Home For Christmas
    27 Olivia Dean - The Christmas Song *

    31-40
    31 Slade - Merry Xmas Everybody ^
    32 Bobby Helms - Jingle Bell Rock ^
    33 Leona Lewis - One More Sleep ^
    35 John & Yoko & The Plastic Ono Band - Happy Xmas (War Is Over) ^
    36 Camila Cabello - I'll Be Home For Christmas *
    37 The Ronettes - Sleigh Ride ^
    39 Taylor Swift - Christmas Tree Farm *
    40 Michael Bublé - Holly Jolly Christmas ^

    47 ABBA - Little Things

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Top 100 Albums

    1 Adele - 30 (30,022)
    2 JLS - 2.0 (20,134) [19,208 physicals, 576 downloads, 350 streaming] *
    3 Ed Sheeran - = (14,932)
    4 ABBA - Voyage (11,263)
    5 Michael Bublé - Christmas (5,861)

    6-10
    6 The Lottery Winners - Something To Leave The House For (5,602) *
    8 Little Mix - Between Us
    9 André Rieu & His Johann Strauss Orchestra - Happy Together

    11-20
    13 Volbeat - Servant Of The Mind *
    18 Nirvana - Nevermind ^

    21-30
    28 Fleetwood Mac - Rumours
    29 Amy Winehouse - Back To Black ^

    31-40
    31 Polo G - Hall Of Fame 2.0 *
    35 Arctic Monkeys - AM
    39 Jamie Cullum - The Pianoman At Christmas ^
    40 Michael Ball & Alfie Boe - Together At Christmas ^

    Click on the above relevant links.
    Last edited by Blondini; Mon December 6, 2021, 19:58.

    Leave a comment:


  • idontremember
    replied
    Originally posted by MadNuno View Post
    Streaming have too much power and so have old christmas songs.

    If Streaming points were cut in half like in Germany (200 streams are a chart sale instead of 100 streams) and older songs points are cut to half (all songs older than 3 years and that charted during that period of time) then we could have the problem solved. Older songs that are revivaled only once would still chart high until being cut and older songs that come back every year on Holidays due to playlists streams would not be hugelly favored by it (they are already very promoted and so they also sell well too).

    It's estimated that almost 60% of the Christmas songs streams come from shops playing christmas playlists so it's safe to say that over 50% of the streams are from passive listeniners (some are influenced to buy or play the song later at home already and so they are being favored by all means).

    Before streaming era it was rare for a Christmas song to even return to TOP 40. Now they even return to #01 (or get there for the first time ever) and during some weeks over 50% of the TOP 10, TOP 20 and TOP 40 are Christmas songs (mostly old christmas songs!).

    Could this be more anoying? This is the more objective analysis I can make as... In my personal opinion (as I never liked silly christmas songs) they would do a chart just for Christmas songs (like the Billboard Holiday Chart) and they would never ever chart on the main chart again!

    First of all, I find it curious to blame playlists for the flood of christmas songs on the charts. As if malls and stores only used playlists at this time of year. Following this logic, then the rest of the year, the songs that are on the main playlists are also somehow invalidating the charts.

    Charts, for me, reflects "now", what is being consumed NOW, It makes no sense don't show the reality of the market. Right now that's what most people listen. If it's about consumption, then let it be about consumption, objectively speaking, and not about what those few interested in following numbers like or don't like to see in what illustrates reality.

    Don't like the mid-November/December charts? Don't see it and return to follow in January. Accept that it hurts less.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blondini
    replied
    https://www.officialcharts.com/chart...bum-20__34601/

    06 December 2021
    JLS heading for highest new entry of the week with new album 2.0

    Can the boys challenge Adele for the top spot on the Official Albums Chart?
    By George Griffiths
    Adele has a challenge in her third week for Number 1 on the Official Albums Chart with 30. The superstar's fourth album is currently on track to top the chart for a third consecutive week in a row, but has competition in the form of JLS.

    2.0 - JLS' first album of original material in eight years - is currently 30’s biggest challenger to knock Adele off her spot at the top of the chart. In our midweek update, 2.0 is currently pacing for this week’s highest new entry at Number 2. It would be JLS’ sixth UK Top 10 album, continuing an unbroken streak since their debut in 2009.



    Elsewhere in the Top 10, the start of the festive season continues to be kind to Michael Buble’s Christmas album. It could rise up 1 place to Number 5, its highest peak of the year so far. At Number 6, we could have a new entry from indie-pop band The Lottery Winners, who could secure their first UK Top 10 entry with third album Something To Leave The House For.
    MORE: JLS' Official Charts history in full


    Following on from the announcement that Little Mix will enter an extended hiatus to focus on solo music in 2022, Perrie, Leigh-Anne and Jade’s recent greatest hits collection Between Us could rise up one spot to Number 8, while Andre Rieu and his Johann Strauss Orchestra could enter the Top 10 for the first time with Happy Together, currently up three places to Number 9. It would be Rieu’s 12th UK Top 10 album.

    Outside the Top 10, Danish rock band Volbeat are eyeing a new entry at Number 13 with Servant of the Mind, while a 30th anniversary box set release of Nirvana’s Nevermind could snag this week’s biggest jump, up 33 places to Number 18. Another classic album, Amy Winehouse’s final record Back To Black is looking to re-enter the Top 40, jumping 29 spots to Number 29 off the back of a new exhibit, Amy: Beyond The Stage, currently on display at London’s Design Museum.

    Polo G’s deluxe reissue of his third studio album Hall of Fame 2.0 could be another new entry at Number 31 - the original peaked at Number 3 earlier this year. And finally, a further two Christmas records could re-enter the Top 40 this week. Jamie Cullum’s The Pianoman at Christmas is currently up 6 to Number 39, while Michael Ball and Alfie Boe are eyeing a rise of 27 spots to Number 40 with Together At Christmas.

    The Official Albums Chart is revealed every Friday at 5.45pm on OfficialCharts.com and on BBC Radio 1’s Official Chart with Scott Mills from 4pm.
    View the Top 100 Official Albums Chart Update

    Check out the Top 100 Official Singles Chart Update

    Leave a comment:


  • MadNuno
    replied
    Streaming have too much power and so have old christmas songs.

    If Streaming points were cut in half like in Germany (200 streams are a chart sale instead of 100 streams) and older songs points are cut to half (all songs older than 3 years and that charted during that period of time) then we could have the problem solved. Older songs that are revivaled only once would still chart high until being cut and older songs that come back every year on Holidays due to playlists streams would not be hugelly favored by it (they are already very promoted and so they also sell well too).

    It's estimated that almost 60% of the Christmas songs streams come from shops playing christmas playlists so it's safe to say that over 50% of the streams are from passive listeniners (some are influenced to buy or play the song later at home already and so they are being favored by all means).

    Before streaming era it was rare for a Christmas song to even return to TOP 40. Now they even return to #01 (or get there for the first time ever) and during some weeks over 50% of the TOP 10, TOP 20 and TOP 40 are Christmas songs (mostly old christmas songs!).

    Could this be more anoying? This is the more objective analysis I can make as... In my personal opinion (as I never liked silly christmas songs) they would do a chart just for Christmas songs (like the Billboard Holiday Chart) and they would never ever chart on the main chart again!

    Leave a comment:


  • Robbie
    replied
    ^
    Ladbaby was fine for the first year but three years running is a bit too much. And apprently he's releasing a new track again this year. In a way though, it's no worse than the Christmas number 1 every year being yet another forgettable X Factor single. Plus Ladbaby will break the record for the most consecutive Christmas number 1 singles. At the moment he's tied on 3 with The Beatles and Spice Girls... so if he gets it this year I imagine he'll be going for 5 in a row next year...

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by Ewokguy15 View Post

    Ladbaby is terrible but it’s just a bit of fun and all the proceeds go to charity so it’s worth it.
    The charts arent about charity.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ewokguy15
    replied
    Originally posted by bm08 View Post

    The Christmas #1 has been Ladbaby who specifically releases a song for charity to gain the Christmas #1.

    The song is usually not the best performing song though as OCC already cuts older songs streams by half.

    In my opinion, excluding older songs would be harmful to the chart's credibility.
    Ladbaby is terrible but it’s just a bit of fun and all the proceeds go to charity so it’s worth it.

    Leave a comment:


  • ShayLaB
    replied
    The day the ACR rule came in, all bets were off. The correlation between listeners and charts were broken.

    They did this to keep the charts from becoming stale and to make way for new content.

    The charts become stale every single year and the last month of the year is basically out of bounds for all but the biggest acts. Even then they probably don't want to risk their big moment being swept away by the tidal wave of regurgitation.

    These songs do not benefit from being in the chart...they are beyond that.

    If you are 15 seeing the same songs come back each year probably seems fun: by the time you are 20 it'll be the dullest thing ever. I am way beyond that and hate these songs to the bottom of my soul. Bah humbug!!?!

    Leave a comment:


  • bm08
    replied
    Originally posted by Ewokguy15 View Post

    It’s the equivalent to Good 4 U topping the chart every year, not a new fresh single.

    The chart companies will do what they want but I personally would love to see them move Christmas song older than 3 years to a separate chart.

    They will still get the same high streams, it would just be nice to go back to a time when the Christmas #1 wasn’t either Wham or Mariah which it would be for the foreseeable future.
    The Christmas #1 has been Ladbaby who specifically releases a song for charity to gain the Christmas #1.

    The song is usually not the best performing song though as OCC already cuts older songs streams by half.

    In my opinion, excluding older songs would be harmful to the chart's credibility.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X