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  • #31
    no chart on this planet used to be a popularity chart. Charts measured - for around 60 years - what people bought. As by tradition charts used to be sales charts.

    However, the whole popularity thing occured, once really "popular" stars couldn't get an album hit. It was during the itunes advent when singles sales slowly began to pick up again. It seemed to be unnatural to have songs selling 5-6-7-8 million copies while the album couldn't pass or reach Gold.

    So the whole, albums don't reflect what's popular notion was creating to make way for the transformations we've seen in the past 5 years.

    A 10,000 copies selling #1 charting music album still was the most popular selling album in that week.

    I find it quite ignorant to say that albums sales don't show what is popular anymore. The albums sales market has never been stable, it was either increasing or decreasing. Nobody came to the conclusion that the BB200 in 1960 wouldn't reflect popularity of albums either (we all know that during that time, singles sales also outperformed albums sales).

    So within the confinements of a market, a #1 selling album still is the most popular album among albums buyers. No matter how big or small the market is.

    However, the albums charts around the world stopped functioning as albums chart once digital singles sales, youtube streams and such affected the weekly positions. It's a completely trajedy and sell out, it also only benefits a certain kind of artist and genre and generation.

    The music industry really did hurt themselves by putting all the focus on streaming while abandoning a 6 decades old tradition and the whole generation post 1990.

    The current forms the albums charts are composed of, doesn't reflect popularity any better than a pure sales or pure streaming chart. It only captures a look at music consumption.
    My Chart

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by stevyy
      no chart on this planet used to be a popularity chart. Charts measured - for around 60 years - what people bought. As by tradition charts used to be sales charts.

      However, the whole popularity thing occured, once really "popular" stars couldn't get an album hit. It was during the itunes advent when singles sales slowly began to pick up again. It seemed to be unnatural to have songs selling 5-6-7-8 million copies while the album couldn't pass or reach Gold.

      So the whole, albums don't reflect what's popular notion was creating to make way for the transformations we've seen in the past 5 years.

      A 10,000 copies selling #1 charting music album still was the most popular selling album in that week.

      I find it quite ignorant to say that albums sales don't show what is popular anymore. The albums sales market has never been stable, it was either increasing or decreasing. Nobody came to the conclusion that the BB200 in 1960 wouldn't reflect popularity of albums either (we all know that during that time, singles sales also outperformed albums sales).

      So within the confinements of a market, a #1 selling album still is the most popular album among albums buyers. No matter how big or small the market is.

      However, the albums charts around the world stopped functioning as albums chart once digital singles sales, youtube streams and such affected the weekly positions. It's a completely trajedy and sell out, it also only benefits a certain kind of artist and genre and generation.

      The music industry really did hurt themselves by putting all the focus on streaming while abandoning a 6 decades old tradition and the whole generation post 1990.

      The current forms the albums charts are composed of, doesn't reflect popularity any better than a pure sales or pure streaming chart. It only captures a look at music consumption.
      Yes, sales were the only thing measured because they were the only form of consumption that consumers controlled. But now we have another form of consumption that consumers control, and the industry makes money from. Comparing 1960 to 2016 is just stupid, it's like you WANT to live in the past lol. By your logic, 'why include digital sales? For 50 years prior to that ONLY physical sales were included', why should we actually advance in time to how music is consumed in society today?

      Also never ever said album sales don't determine popularity anymore. I said they do less than perhaps, 15 years ago, and the popularity continues to decline and will decline more in the future and they are not the ONLY way to determine popularity. Sales determine popularity, and streams determine popularity, hence Sales Plus Streaming's purpose.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by iHypeMusic
        Originally posted by stevyy
        no chart on this planet used to be a popularity chart. Charts measured - for around 60 years - what people bought. As by tradition charts used to be sales charts.

        However, the whole popularity thing occured, once really "popular" stars couldn't get an album hit. It was during the itunes advent when singles sales slowly began to pick up again. It seemed to be unnatural to have songs selling 5-6-7-8 million copies while the album couldn't pass or reach Gold.

        So the whole, albums don't reflect what's popular notion was creating to make way for the transformations we've seen in the past 5 years.

        A 10,000 copies selling #1 charting music album still was the most popular selling album in that week.

        I find it quite ignorant to say that albums sales don't show what is popular anymore. The albums sales market has never been stable, it was either increasing or decreasing. Nobody came to the conclusion that the BB200 in 1960 wouldn't reflect popularity of albums either (we all know that during that time, singles sales also outperformed albums sales).

        So within the confinements of a market, a #1 selling album still is the most popular album among albums buyers. No matter how big or small the market is.

        However, the albums charts around the world stopped functioning as albums chart once digital singles sales, youtube streams and such affected the weekly positions. It's a completely trajedy and sell out, it also only benefits a certain kind of artist and genre and generation.

        The music industry really did hurt themselves by putting all the focus on streaming while abandoning a 6 decades old tradition and the whole generation post 1990.

        The current forms the albums charts are composed of, doesn't reflect popularity any better than a pure sales or pure streaming chart. It only captures a look at music consumption.
        Yes, sales were the only thing measured because they were the only form of consumption that consumers controlled. But now we have another form of consumption that consumers control, and the industry makes money from. Comparing 1960 to 2016 is just stupid, it's like you WANT to live in the past lol. By your logic, 'why include digital sales? For 50 years prior to that ONLY physical sales were included', why should we actually advance in time to how music is consumed in society today?

        Also never ever said album sales don't determine popularity anymore. I said they do less than perhaps, 15 years ago, and the popularity continues to decline and will decline more in the future and they are not the ONLY way to determine popularity. Sales determine popularity, and streams determine popularity, hence Sales Plus Streaming's purpose.
        But you seriously can't see the slant against people over the age of 18. Some snot nose who never paid for a cd in his life can play _____ 30 times in a week, and somehow that counts more than the person who bought a cd and played it ad nauseum in their car or home stereo or something that wasn't locked in to a streaming site or something, and the kid who didn't pay for music suddenly has more value.

        Album SALES don't dictate "popularity" any more than what album happened to sell more copies on one certain week any more than tv ratings or movie tickets don't necessarily determine what movie or tv show is more popular on social media. Basically BB just altered it to give in to the stans who follow each weeks chart move like it's a serial.

        If Drake was as big a cultural force and entity as Taylor Swift or Adele, his album sales would reflect that. They don't. Could you imagine how abominable the chart would've been in 2010 because of Beliebers?

        Billboard essentially took a big dump in the face of every artist who doesn't rely on 12 year old girls to survive. Many of those artists "need" chart positions more than Drake does because it can be what can make or break them actually bothering to record another album, since many artists who aren't "pop stars" and don't have the windfall coming their way have a harder time getting the funds to make their music. A top 10 debut even if it falls to #70 the next week is enough to make them feel the urge to keep going forward instead of breaking up or just becoming a touring act like many acts from the 60s-90s who continue to tour but never make new music because they don't think there's an audience left. Many older artists flat out have said they won't record another album because they don't think it'd be worth it.... yet a decent chart position is enough to keep them going forward.
        My top 100 artists (2018 edition)

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by NothingFails
          Originally posted by iHypeMusic
          Originally posted by stevyy
          no chart on this planet used to be a popularity chart. Charts measured - for around 60 years - what people bought. As by tradition charts used to be sales charts.

          However, the whole popularity thing occured, once really "popular" stars couldn't get an album hit. It was during the itunes advent when singles sales slowly began to pick up again. It seemed to be unnatural to have songs selling 5-6-7-8 million copies while the album couldn't pass or reach Gold.

          So the whole, albums don't reflect what's popular notion was creating to make way for the transformations we've seen in the past 5 years.

          A 10,000 copies selling #1 charting music album still was the most popular selling album in that week.

          I find it quite ignorant to say that albums sales don't show what is popular anymore. The albums sales market has never been stable, it was either increasing or decreasing. Nobody came to the conclusion that the BB200 in 1960 wouldn't reflect popularity of albums either (we all know that during that time, singles sales also outperformed albums sales).

          So within the confinements of a market, a #1 selling album still is the most popular album among albums buyers. No matter how big or small the market is.

          However, the albums charts around the world stopped functioning as albums chart once digital singles sales, youtube streams and such affected the weekly positions. It's a completely trajedy and sell out, it also only benefits a certain kind of artist and genre and generation.

          The music industry really did hurt themselves by putting all the focus on streaming while abandoning a 6 decades old tradition and the whole generation post 1990.

          The current forms the albums charts are composed of, doesn't reflect popularity any better than a pure sales or pure streaming chart. It only captures a look at music consumption.
          Yes, sales were the only thing measured because they were the only form of consumption that consumers controlled. But now we have another form of consumption that consumers control, and the industry makes money from. Comparing 1960 to 2016 is just stupid, it's like you WANT to live in the past lol. By your logic, 'why include digital sales? For 50 years prior to that ONLY physical sales were included', why should we actually advance in time to how music is consumed in society today?

          Also never ever said album sales don't determine popularity anymore. I said they do less than perhaps, 15 years ago, and the popularity continues to decline and will decline more in the future and they are not the ONLY way to determine popularity. Sales determine popularity, and streams determine popularity, hence Sales Plus Streaming's purpose.
          But you seriously can't see the slant against people over the age of 18. Some snot nose who never paid for a cd in his life can play _____ 30 times in a week, and somehow that counts more than the person who bought a cd and played it ad nauseum in their car or home stereo or something that wasn't locked in to a streaming site or something, and the kid who didn't pay for music suddenly has more value.

          Album SALES don't dictate "popularity" any more than what album happened to sell more copies on one certain week any more than tv ratings or movie tickets don't necessarily determine what movie or tv show is more popular on social media. Basically BB just altered it to give in to the stans who follow each weeks chart move like it's a serial.

          If Drake was as big a cultural force and entity as Taylor Swift or Adele, his album sales would reflect that. They don't. Could you imagine how abominable the chart would've been in 2010 because of Beliebers?

          Billboard essentially took a big dump in the face of every artist who doesn't rely on 12 year old girls to survive. Many of those artists "need" chart positions more than Drake does because it can be what can make or break them actually bothering to record another album, since many artists who aren't "pop stars" and don't have the windfall coming their way have a harder time getting the funds to make their music. A top 10 debut even if it falls to #70 the next week is enough to make them feel the urge to keep going forward instead of breaking up or just becoming a touring act like many acts from the 60s-90s who continue to tour but never make new music because they don't think there's an audience left. Many older artists flat out have said they won't record another album because they don't think it'd be worth it.... yet a decent chart position is enough to keep them going forward.
          The problem is you keep referring to streaming as "run by 13 year olds who have never bought an album". You're wrong.

          Streaming AND Sales mostly come from teenagers, as reported by Billboard:

          Business Matters: Teens Listen to Music Most on YouTube, Pay for Music More Than Other Age Groups, Nielsen Study Says
          http://www.billboard.com/biz/articles/n ... music-more
          -- Teens are more likely than other age groups to have purchased music of any format (72% versus an average of 68%) in the last 12 months. It helps that teens aren't always spending their own money: 46% of them used an iTunes gift card in the last year.

          -- Over a third (36%) of teens have bought a CD in the last year while 51% of them have purchased some kind of music download (could be a single track). The averages for all age groups are 41% and 41%, respectively.
          So in essence, the same 13 year olds you keep saying have never bought a CD also buy more music than someone your age, in addition to streaming.

          As said, the charts in general are a young persons game and driven by the young population.

          How many 40+ year olds do you think are listening to the week's top selling single: Justin Bieber & Major Lazer - Cold Water compared to teens? How many 40+ year olds do you think are listening to the week's top selling album: Gucci Mane - Everybody Looking?

          The young age group has just as much influence on sales as streaming, as confirmed by Nielsen and Billboard so there goes your argument on "13 year olds who refuse to buy music being unfairly represented". If they stream and buy music more than any other audience then them having the most representation is realistic.

          Comment


          • #35
            the only sane album chart there is left today, probably with Japan and France, is Germany.

            A revenue chart is the best way for the industry to track popularity. According to the BVMI the German music industry (3rd in the world) is predominantly kept alive by the 30-59 age group.

            The US is - if we believe you - the only music market on this planet in which 13 y,o. may predominantly dominate popular discourse.

            Maybe it's a cultural thing. But unlike the US, veteran acts can still score massive sales in Europe and basically anywhere in the world, but the US. Why is that? Because of 2 decades full of ageism.
            My Chart

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by iHypeMusic
              The problem is you keep referring to streaming as "run by 13 year olds who have never bought an album". You're wrong.
              You say I am, but please provide me with ONE older / non-pop / rock / alternative / etc... artist whose primary fanbase isn't in junior high who has benefited from SPS besides Prince and David Bowie, two artists who literally had to die to do so? I can't name one, can you? Basically all artists who fit into the boxes I mentioned suffer simply because they don't explode on the Twitterverse for the young pop stans to go nuts over.

              With SPS, the album charts today has become something similar to what TRL used to be on MTV in the day.

              I know you're a big Drake fan and like this because the rules work in his favor, but really... it's ridiculously exaggerating his fame. He is hardly MJ or Prince in 1984, Usher in 2004 or Taylor Swift in 2015 for that matter.
              My top 100 artists (2018 edition)

              Comment


              • #37
                The title of this thread is bad
                It's misleading
                Has nothing to do with the content imo

                Comment


                • #38
                  We will be counting "pirate" downloads as sales soon, it is also on demand, and people have to pay ISP for being able to download something, to have an internet connection.
                  Whitney Houston

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Nippian93
                    We will be counting "pirate" downloads as sales soon, it is also on demand, and people have to pay ISP for being able to download something, to have an internet connection.
                    so true. but it's hard to track them, over 2 billion songs have been pirated via Napster alone between 1999/2000 (based on traffic).
                    My Chart

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by stevyy
                      Originally posted by Nippian93
                      We will be counting "pirate" downloads as sales soon, it is also on demand, and people have to pay ISP for being able to download something, to have an internet connection.
                      so true. but it's hard to track them, over 2 billion songs have been pirated via Napster alone between 1999/2000 (based on traffic).
                      and of course it will score higher chart points than those old fashioned people who still like to pay for their music, because "ewwww, old people do that"
                      My top 100 artists (2018 edition)

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by NothingFails
                        Originally posted by iHypeMusic
                        The problem is you keep referring to streaming as "run by 13 year olds who have never bought an album". You're wrong.
                        You say I am, but please provide me with ONE older / non-pop / rock / alternative / etc... artist whose primary fanbase isn't in junior high who has benefited from SPS besides Prince and David Bowie, two artists who literally had to die to do so? I can't name one, can you? Basically all artists who fit into the boxes I mentioned suffer simply because they don't explode on the Twitterverse for the young pop stans to go nuts over.

                        With SPS, the album charts today has become something similar to what TRL used to be on MTV in the day.

                        I know you're a big Drake fan and like this because the rules work in his favor, but really... it's ridiculously exaggerating his fame. He is hardly MJ or Prince in 1984, Usher in 2004 or Taylor Swift in 2015 for that matter.
                        Coldplay is one of the top 10 most streamed acts ever on Spotify. Michael Jackson benefits well from SPS, The Beatles benefit well from SPS, Eminem benefits well from SPS, 2Pac benefits well from SPS, AC/DC benefits well from SPS, The Rolling Stones benefits from SPS, Nirvana benefits well from SPS, and there's others. The ones who aren't alive died before this decade so they don't have any recent spike, and they also sell well weekly on par with good streams. All of them also debuted before this millennium so the whole "13 year old fanbase" and "name older artists" excuses don't work with them. Each of them has albums that constantly chart on Billboard 200 and pull good track sales and streams.

                        And obviously Drake isn't Taylor, MJ, Prince, or Usher. His album has done 3.2M in SPS to date... While there's have all done over 9M+. So no even with SPS, he's not big as them. As I said, weeks at #1 mean NOTHING when determining a bigger album, and never have even when a chart was sales only, so there's really no point in suggesting that or complaining that it suggests it.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by stevyy
                          the only sane album chart there is left today, probably with Japan and France, is Germany.

                          A revenue chart is the best way for the industry to track popularity. According to the BVMI the German music industry (3rd in the world) is predominantly kept alive by the 30-59 age group.

                          The US is - if we believe you - the only music market on this planet in which 13 y,o. may predominantly dominate popular discourse.

                          Maybe it's a cultural thing. But unlike the US, veteran acts can still score massive sales in Europe and basically anywhere in the world, but the US. Why is that? Because of 2 decades full of ageism.
                          "if we believe you"
                          I didn't make any claims. Billboard & Nielsen Soundscan made the claims/article. Why would you believe German music industry on which age group buys music most in Germany but not believe the US music industry on which age group buys music most in US?

                          France's album chart started including audio streaming from all platforms and all users last week just like US, so you're down to Germany and Japan. Their single chart will also include streaming.

                          Streaming hasn't taken off in Japan yet (Spotify isn't even available in Japan) which is why their charts don't have streaming, but when it does take off I guess you'll have just Germany.

                          IFPI also includes streams for their top selling singles the past 2 years, and so them including streams for albums isn't gonna be too far away.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            bc 13 y.o. don't buy music, their parents do (for them).
                            My Chart

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by iHypeMusic
                              Originally posted by stevyy
                              the only sane album chart there is left today, probably with Japan and France, is Germany.

                              A revenue chart is the best way for the industry to track popularity. According to the BVMI the German music industry (3rd in the world) is predominantly kept alive by the 30-59 age group.

                              The US is - if we believe you - the only music market on this planet in which 13 y,o. may predominantly dominate popular discourse.

                              Maybe it's a cultural thing. But unlike the US, veteran acts can still score massive sales in Europe and basically anywhere in the world, but the US. Why is that? Because of 2 decades full of ageism.
                              "if we believe you"
                              I didn't make any claims. Billboard & Nielsen Soundscan made the claims/article. Why would you believe German music industry on which age group buys music most in Germany but not believe the US music industry on which age group buys music most in US?

                              France's album chart started including audio streaming from all platforms and all users last week just like US, so you're down to Germany and Japan. Their single chart will also include streaming.

                              Streaming hasn't taken off in Japan yet (Spotify isn't even available in Japan) which is why their charts don't have streaming, but when it does take off I guess you'll have just Germany.

                              IFPI also includes streams for their top selling singles the past 2 years, and so them including streams for albums isn't gonna be too far away.
                              no, i guess, Germans and Japanes - once the most evil countries in history - believe in purchases. CD sales account for 70% of the German music industry's revenue. <3 same in Japan. It must be a cultural thing. BC we are literally the only countries in the world left with a viable sales driven music industry. <3

                              rise up JapGer, rise up.
                              My Chart

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                I'm so tired of these 13yo buying the new Britney Spears / NSYNC CD.
                                Ugh at these 13 yo buying Fergalicious on iTunes, physical >>>

                                We should stop counting CD / Digital sales since Vinyl is far superior, we can still count cassettes for singles though.
                                Katy Perry - P!nk - Coldplay.

                                Comment


                                • #46
                                  Originally posted by KatyVenezuela
                                  I'm so tired of these 13yo buying the new Britney Spears / NSYNC CD.
                                  Ugh at these 13 yo buying Fergalicious on iTunes, physical >>>
                                  Do people still buy stuff like mentioned above ?
                                  Whitney Houston

                                  Comment


                                  • #47
                                    Originally posted by KatyVenezuela
                                    I'm so tired of these 13yo buying the new Britney Spears / NSYNC CD.
                                    Ugh at these 13 yo buying Fergalicious on iTunes, physical >>>

                                    We should stop counting CD / Digital sales since Vinyl is far superior, we can still count cassettes for singles though.
                                    !! These 13 year olds are giving these new artists all these 5 million selling digital songs, because they're too cheap to go out and buy a physical single or album like back then.

                                    I can't name any older artist that ISN'T Pop who's also selling 5M singles on iTunes so clearly iTunes isn't fair, and 13 year olds are being given too much power. Digital singles should no longer count, either physical singles or nothing.

                                    Comment


                                    • #48
                                      Originally posted by KatyVenezuela
                                      I'm so tired of these 13yo buying the new Britney Spears / NSYNC CD.
                                      Ugh at these 13 yo buying Fergalicious on iTunes, physical >>>

                                      We should stop counting CD / Digital sales since Vinyl is far superior, we can still count cassettes for singles though.
                                      The difference is that in the TRL tween hell days, people actually bought the CD's. Britney, BSB, N'Sync... were shattering sales records and their albums were going diamond. They were actually making money and people were parting with theirs to support it. Can't compare it to a bunch of kids glued to their iphone listening to a Spotify "top 40 hit mix" in the background, all the while balking at the idea of paying for music. If acts like Adele and Taylor are still making millions and selling solid numbers, I don't buy that the industry is dead and needs to be handed over to streamers as much as that we're ripe for a new musical revolution and finds something that actually clicks more with a general audience as opposed to how Ariana can barely sell 500k copies despite having the money put behind her that would be expected to sell 5 million.
                                      My top 100 artists (2018 edition)

                                      Comment


                                      • #49
                                        Originally posted by iHypeMusic
                                        Originally posted by KatyVenezuela
                                        I'm so tired of these 13yo buying the new Britney Spears / NSYNC CD.
                                        Ugh at these 13 yo buying Fergalicious on iTunes, physical >>>

                                        We should stop counting CD / Digital sales since Vinyl is far superior, we can still count cassettes for singles though.
                                        !! These 13 year olds are giving these new artists all these 5 million selling digital songs, because they're too cheap to go out and buy a physical single or album like back then.
                                        I can't name any older artist that ISN'T Pop who's also selling 5M singles on iTunes so clearly iTunes isn't fair, and 13 year olds are being given too much power. Digital singles should no longer count, either physical singles or nothing.
                                        But that's it... the SINGLES CHART is for SINGLES. Older artists/non-pop artists/indie, etc... have always shifted more albums than singles. Single success and the album being a smash have never gone hand in hand. There were many big hit singles in decades past that didn't do anything to the album, people liked the song, didn't want the album... no different than your Lukas Graham or Walk The Moon today.

                                        Can't wait until you're no longer the target musical demo and a younger generation comes along and your stars are having to settle for a #100 peak even though their album sold enough to be #12 simply because the tweens no longer support Drake or somebody. It will happen, and we'll see just how much you think SPS is the way charts should be because album charts are supposed to measure popularity over sales. You're going to age out of the demographic and you'll realize what people like me and stevyy have been saying once you're on the other side and see how ridiculous the chart rules are slanted and favors one demographic over another.

                                        Unlike you, those of us who were kids in the 90s realized we had to share the chart with our parents and other demographics. Kids weren't supporting Michael Bolton, Kenny G, Amy Grant, Garth Brooks, Reba McEntire, Rod Stewart, Eric Clapton, Hootie And The Blowfish and yet all of them were huge on the chart, sometimes even bigger than the acts our age group were lapping up. Difference is we weren't getting participation trophies and had to deal with it unlike now where tweens think they're the only demographic that exists and radio has coddled them all their lives unlike those of us in the 80s/90s who were taught to deal with old people making music.
                                        My top 100 artists (2018 edition)

                                        Comment


                                        • #50
                                          if the tweens need a chart so badly that represents their way of music consumption they should get one. But the main charts should have been left alone. Never in the history of music charts have singles and albums charts been combined like it is today. The only reason behind that is to make current pop singers bigger than they are.

                                          But I have to say, that during my teenage years, we didn't even have acts predominantly manufactured for kids like today. Because radio would still play a 40 y.o. Lennon and McCartney, I grew up listening to them. The boyband craze etc happened much later.. and from then on, it all went downhilll.
                                          My Chart

                                          Comment


                                          • #51
                                            Originally posted by stevyy
                                            if the tweens need a chart so badly that represents their way of music consumption they should get one.
                                            They actually had one, The Social Media Top 50.... but alas, it doesn't carry the weight of the album chart and hot 100.

                                            I know album sales are down and consumption has changed, but a popular song/unpopular album isn;'t any different today than it was decades ago. I mean, 20 years ago Macarena was the #1 song for months, the album only went to #41... nobody wanted the album, the single sufficed. The album didn't get inflated bonus points for having a #1 blockbuster when the reality was that nobody cared about Los Del Rio, nobody cared about the album, they liked the song/craze.

                                            I mean, we remember our Mariah's and our Celine's and our Bodyguard soundtracks amongst others and remember big blockbuster albums that had big blockbuster singles, but that wasn't the case with every song that was a smash hit, not was it the case with every album that sold millions. Today is no different than 20 years ago where Los Del Rio and Donna Lewis held fort the top 2 singles for like three months, while Los Del Rio's album peaked at #41 and Donna Lewis' at #31. Big hit smashing single doesn't always mean big hit smashing album and huge artist.
                                            My top 100 artists (2018 edition)

                                            Comment


                                            • #52
                                              Counting single sales or "sales" as equal to album sales is absolutely ridiculous, but it's the only one to make things like PSY, or albums which have just Uptown Funk, Blurred Lines and nothing more that people know look bigger than they are, same about these artist, or rather in majority of cases "artists".
                                              Whitney Houston

                                              Comment


                                              • #53
                                                Originally posted by NothingFails
                                                Originally posted by iHypeMusic
                                                Originally posted by KatyVenezuela
                                                I'm so tired of these 13yo buying the new Britney Spears / NSYNC CD.
                                                Ugh at these 13 yo buying Fergalicious on iTunes, physical >>>

                                                We should stop counting CD / Digital sales since Vinyl is far superior, we can still count cassettes for singles though.
                                                !! These 13 year olds are giving these new artists all these 5 million selling digital songs, because they're too cheap to go out and buy a physical single or album like back then.
                                                I can't name any older artist that ISN'T Pop who's also selling 5M singles on iTunes so clearly iTunes isn't fair, and 13 year olds are being given too much power. Digital singles should no longer count, either physical singles or nothing.
                                                But that's it... the SINGLES CHART is for SINGLES. Older artists/non-pop artists/indie, etc... have always shifted more albums than singles. Single success and the album being a smash have never gone hand in hand. There were many big hit singles in decades past that didn't do anything to the album, people liked the song, didn't want the album... no different than your Lukas Graham or Walk The Moon today.

                                                Can't wait until you're no longer the target musical demo and a younger generation comes along and your stars are having to settle for a #100 peak even though their album sold enough to be #12 simply because the tweens no longer support Drake or somebody. It will happen, and we'll see just how much you think SPS is the way charts should be because album charts are supposed to measure popularity over sales. You're going to age out of the demographic and you'll realize what people like me and stevyy have been saying once you're on the other side and see how ridiculous the chart rules are slanted and favors one demographic over another.

                                                Unlike you, those of us who were kids in the 90s realized we had to share the chart with our parents and other demographics. Kids weren't supporting Michael Bolton, Kenny G, Amy Grant, Garth Brooks, Reba McEntire, Rod Stewart, Eric Clapton, Hootie And The Blowfish and yet all of them were huge on the chart, sometimes even bigger than the acts our age group were lapping up. Difference is we weren't getting participation trophies and had to deal with it unlike now where tweens think they're the only demographic that exists and radio has coddled them all their lives unlike those of us in the 80s/90s who were taught to deal with old people making music.
                                                By the time I'm 40s+, I assume the #12 selling album won't even be selling 3K (it already struggles to sell 10K, when you'd need 50K+ to be #12 in 2000) so trust me, I won't be angry over 3K sales not being significantly counted in the chart. As I said, in 2016 major labels are making more from Streaming than physical & digital sales.



                                                Streaming in future decades will end up making almost all of labels money, be the main way of consuming music by the entire country, and you guys will still be complaining how it shouldn't count to determine popularity lol. It's ridiculous.

                                                Shifts and evolution come in the music industry, and this is one and the industry has already adjusted. Denying the evolution of the music industry just because 'an age group that isn't yours is being more represented' isn't even a legitimate reason, especially since Streaming is new... thus meaning, in the future the older generations will eventually start using it heavily too therefore it isn't 'one age group being represented unfairly'. How much of the older generation do you think was using iTunes in 2005/2006 when it was relatively new? Now in 2016, everybody at one point period has had iTunes and it's used throughout all age groups.

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                                                • #54
                                                  I will be adding Travis Scott and A Day To Remember to the list some time in the evening (1:00 or 2:00 GMT)

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                                                  • #55
                                                    Fact - The Billboard 200 used to be a purely sales based chart
                                                    Fact - The Hot 100 has always been a hybrid sales/airplay chart (reflecting a single/track's overall popularity)

                                                    Fact - The Billboard 200 is now a popularity chart (i.e. after 60 odd years, Billboard decided to change the rules completely)
                                                    Fact - with a small number of notable exceptions (e.g. Number Ones), the #1 album on the BB 200 was the highest selling album in the US (i.e. more people chose to buy that particular body of work than any other product available that week).

                                                    My opinion - individual track sales really have no business contributing to the album chart. It's akin to allowing sales from the album chart contribute to the Hot 100 (which was proposed by some around 2000 - Holidayguy, I'm sure you remember those discussions!). Individual track sales (and streaming) should contribute solely to singles/tracks charts. For streaming, only streams of the entire album should count (not streams of individual tracks). The streaming platforms would easily be able to keep track of streams and report when someone had streamed an entire album (rather than just the same track or handful of tracks over and over again).

                                                    When Madonna's "Rebel Heart" debuted at #2 on the BB 200, there was a fair bit of media attention given to the fact that it was actually the highest selling album in the US that week, yet still missed the top spot.

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                                                    • #56
                                                      I always asked why "It's All Coming Back To Me Now" never took the top spot even just once. I just find it very unbelievable. :(
                                                      Celine Marie Claudette Tanguay Dion-Angelil, #BestSellingArtistofthe90s #TheGreatestCanadian #SaviorofLasVegas #QueenofThemeSongs

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                                                      • #57
                                                        Carta- very much in agreement, as you know.

                                                        It's fine to have a multi-metric chart, but trying to pass it off as a continuation of what once was a purely sales-based chart- like, talking about feats happening now vs. decades prior- is ridiculous. Everything incorporated in the Hot 100 makes sense, as it's a tracks-based chart. When you have one or a couple of tracks comprising the bulk of TEA and SEA numbers to an album's total- not so much. Billboard included them mainly to plump up figures for its "flagship" chart.- I don't look at it as such- Top Album Sales takes precedence in my research, at least for rankings in the top 100, since Dec. 2014.

                                                        Aside from Aaron Lewis scoring his first No. 1-selling album this week, Led Zeppelin scored its 14th top 10-selling title with The Complete BBC Sessions.

                                                        I have that running list of No. 1/top 10 feats that I could post in this thread. I haven't looked at number of top 40 albums, for those scoring top 40-selling albums since Dec. 2014, that didn't rank in the top 40 of the multi-metric chart.
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                                                        • #58
                                                          This wiki article for list of best-selling music artists: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_b ... ic_artists

                                                          is the problem.

                                                          The site is not the problem.

                                                          I just want people who do the counting to separate the counting of total physical albums sold, total physical singles sold, total digital albums sold and total digital singles sold.

                                                          On that link, it would show Rihanna has more total units sold that Celine and Mariah and it doesn't sound right especially that we know the fact that Rihanna's numbers are mostly single sales, not album sales.
                                                          Celine Marie Claudette Tanguay Dion-Angelil, #BestSellingArtistofthe90s #TheGreatestCanadian #SaviorofLasVegas #QueenofThemeSongs

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                                                          • #59
                                                            yes, people can claim all they want how albums are obsolete these days and everything is about streaming. They did the same in the 2000's claiming that singles sales are obsolete and only download sales would matter.

                                                            The media agrees. Nobody is celebrating a huge seller, all they want is streamed singles. BB is claiming sales for Rihanna are approaching 300 million, TEA, SPS and what not. The matter of fact is, that everybody has access to something that is free, but before the internet only paying customers had access to something which was available for a price.

                                                            The market today is the globe, the market before 1998 was retail.

                                                            The best selling acts should indeed be measured by sales. Then we need to differentiate between digital and physical and then between consumption and purchased.

                                                            Combining all aspects gives a wrong picture. Rihanna has not sold 260m records, maybe in consumption value... However, consumption for older acts cannot be measured due to the fact that nobody cared to measure it in the past.

                                                            The fact that sales are dead has nothing to do with the people, but with the industry itself outlawing sales, making them become indifferent to measure popularity while they are the #1 source for popularity. Because in my book, sales reflect the willingness of people to giving time and person resouces to music, streaming only requires time.

                                                            Only because we are living in a digital world, doesnt mean that we should forget about the times b4 that.
                                                            My Chart

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                                                            • #60
                                                              Here are the running lists for No. 1 and top 10 chart feats- albums that exclusively hit No. 1 or top 10 on Top Album Sales, which is a continuation of what the all-genre album-sales chart used to be. Any additions, corrections, etc., do inform.

                                                              Billboard debuted the multi-metric chart in December 2014, but for those few weeks, there weren't any albums that hit No. 1 or top 10 on Album Sales that didn't on the former chart. Thus, we begin with 2015:

                                                              2015

                                                              1/3/15
                                                              5 Seconds Of Summer lands its second top 10-selling album with LIVESOS (No. 10)

                                                              1/10/15
                                                              Fabolous scores his sixth top 10-selling album with The Young OG Project (No. 8)

                                                              1/31/15
                                                              Jazmine Sullivan lands her second top 10-selling album with Reality Show (No. 7)

                                                              2/7/15
                                                              Lupe Fiasco scores his fourth top 10-selling album with Tetsuo & Youth (No. 9)

                                                              2/14/15
                                                              Bethel Music lands its second top 10-selling album with We Will Not Be Shaken (No. 9)
                                                              Charlie Wilson scores his fourth top 10-selling album with Forever Charlie (No. 10)

                                                              2/21/15
                                                              The Now That's What I Call Music series lands its 19th No. 1 with NOW 53
                                                              Kid Ink scores his second top 10-selling album with Full Speed (No. 10)

                                                              3/7/15
                                                              Aaron Watson lands his first top 10-selling album with The Underdog (No. 8)

                                                              3/28/15
                                                              Madonna scores her ninth No. 1-selling album with Rebel Heart

                                                              4/4/15
                                                              Mark Knopfler scores his second top 10-selling album with Tracker (No. 5)
                                                              Sleeping With Sirens lands its second top 10-selling album with Madness (No. 6)
                                                              AWOLNATION scores its first top 10-selling album with Run (No. 9)

                                                              4/11/15
                                                              Earl Sweatshirt lands his third top 10-selling album with I Don't Like s**t, I Don't Go Outside: An Album By Earl Sweatshirt (No. 7)
                                                              Courtney Barnett lands her first top 10-selling album with Sometimes I Sit And Think, And Sometimes I Just Sit. (No. 10)

                                                              4/18/15
                                                              Three Days Grace scores its fourth top 10-selling album with Human (No. 10)

                                                              4/25/15
                                                              All Time Low scores its first No. 1-selling album with Future Hearts
                                                              Lord Huron scores his first top 10-selling album with Strange Trails (No. 10)

                                                              5/2/15
                                                              Dwight Yoakam lands his first top 10-selling album with Second Hand Heart (No. 7)

                                                              5/9/15
                                                              Mana scores his third top 10-selling album with Cama Incendiada (No. 6)
                                                              KB 9 lands its first top 10-selling album with Tomorrow We Live (No. 9)

                                                              5/16/15
                                                              Insane Clown Posse scores its fourth top 10-selling album with Marvelous Missing Link (Lost) (No. 7)

                                                              5/23/15
                                                              My Morning Jacket scores its third top 10-selling album with The Waterfall (No. 6)

                                                              5/30/15
                                                              Snoop Dogg lands his 10th top 10-selling album with BUSH (No. 8)

                                                              6/6/15
                                                              Faith No More lands its second top 10-selling album with Sol Invictus (No. 6)
                                                              Brandon Flowers scores his second top 10-selling album with The Desired Effect (No. 7)

                                                              6/20/15
                                                              Lil Durk scores his first top 10-selling album with Remember My Name (No. 5)
                                                              Billy Currington lands his third top 10-selling album with Summer Forever (No. 9)
                                                              Dom Kennedy scores his first top 10-selling album with By Dom Kennedy (No. 10)

                                                              6/27/15
                                                              Royal Blood scores its first top 10-selling album with Royal Blood (No. 6)
                                                              A Thousand Horses scores its first top 10-selling album with Southernality (No. 9)

                                                              7/4/15
                                                              Third Eye Blind scores its second top 10-selling album with Dopamine (No. 7)

                                                              7/18/15
                                                              Easton Corbin scores his second top 10-selling album with About To Get Real (No. 9)

                                                              8/1/15
                                                              Between The Buried And Me scores its first top 10-selling album with Coma Ecliptic (No. 6)
                                                              Owl City scores its fourth top 10-selling album with Mobile Orchestra (No. 7)

                                                              8/8/15
                                                              Anthony Brown & group therAPy scores its first top 10-selling album with Everyday Jesus (No. 9)
                                                              Karen Clark-Sheard scores her first top 10-selling album with Destined To Win (No. 10)

                                                              8/15/15
                                                              We Came As Romans scores its second top 10-selling album with We Came As Romans (No. 8)
                                                              Jack & Jack scores its first top 10-selling album with Calibraska (EP), Jack & Jack (No. 9)

                                                              9/5/15
                                                              Elvis Presley scores his 28th top 10-selling album with Elvis Forever (No. 7)
                                                              Neck Deep scores its first top 10-selling album with Life's Not Out To Get You (No. 10)

                                                              9/12/15
                                                              Bon Jovi scores its 13th top 10-selling album with Burning Bridges (No. 8)
                                                              Nathaniel Rateliff & The Night Sweats scores its first top 10-selling album with Nathaniel Rateliff & The Night Sweat (No. 10)

                                                              9/26/15
                                                              Five Finger Death Punch scores its first No. 1-selling album with Got Your Six
                                                              Scarface scores his seventh top 10-selling album with Deeply Rooted (No. 8)
                                                              The Wonder Years scores its first top 10-selling album with No Closer To Heaven (No. 9)

                                                              10/3/15
                                                              Bring Me The Horizon scores its first No. 1-selling album with That's The Spirit

                                                              10/10/15
                                                              Keith Richards scores his first top 10-selling album with Crosseyed Heart (No. 8)

                                                              10/17/15
                                                              Don Henley scores his first No. 1-selling album (solo) with Cass County

                                                              10/24/15
                                                              Clutch scored its first top 10-selling album with Psychic Warfare (No. 7)

                                                              10/31/15
                                                              Toby Keith scored his 15th top 10-selling album with 35 mph Town (No. 7)

                                                              11/14/15
                                                              DJ Khaled scored his sixth top 10-selling album with I Changed A Lot (No. 8)
                                                              Rod Stewart scored his 18th top 10-selling album with Another Country (No. 10)

                                                              11/21/15
                                                              The Neighbourhood scores its first top 10-selling album with Wiped Out! (No. 8)
                                                              Elvis Presley, With The Royal Philharmonic Orchestra, scores his 29th top 10-selling album with If I Can Dream(No. 9)
                                                              Chris Janson scores his first top 10-selling album with Buy Me A Boat (No. 10)

                                                              12/19/15
                                                              Erykah Badu scores her sixth top 10-selling album with But You Caint Use My Phone (No. 10)

                                                              -----------------------------------------------------------------
                                                              2016

                                                              1/2/16
                                                              Cam scores her first top 10-selling album with Untamed (No. 10)

                                                              1/23/16
                                                              Passion lands its fourth top 10-selling album with Salvation's Tide Is Rising (No. 6)

                                                              1/30/16
                                                              David Bowie scores his 10th 10-selling album with The Rise And Fall Of Ziggy Stardust And The Spiders From Mars (No. 8)

                                                              2/6/16
                                                              Lecrae scores his third top 10-selling album with Church Clothes 3 (No. 7)
                                                              Hank Williams Jr. scores its first top 10-selling album with It's About Time (No. 8)
                                                              Brothers Osborne scores its first top 10-selling album with Pawn Shop (No. 10)

                                                              2/13/16
                                                              Tank scores his fifth top 10-selling album with Sex Love & Pain II (No. 9)

                                                              2/20/16
                                                              Dream Theater scores its fourth top 10-selling album with The Astonishing (No. 6)
                                                              Tedeschi Trucks Band scores its first top 10-selling album with Let Me Get By (No. 9)

                                                              2/27/16
                                                              Elevation Worship scores its first top 10-selling album with Here As In Heaven (No. 10)

                                                              3/19/16
                                                              Bonnie Raitt scores her fifth top 10-selling album with Dig In Deep (No. 7)

                                                              3/26/16
                                                              newsboys scores its second top 10-selling album with Love Riot (No. 6)
                                                              Ray LaMontagne scores his fourth top 10-selling album with Ouroboros (No. 7)
                                                              Granger Smith scores his first top 10-selling album with Remington (No. 8)
                                                              Ninja Sex Party scores its first top 10-selling album with Under The Covers (No. 9)
                                                              Loretta Lynn scores her first top 10-selling album with Full Circle (No. 10)

                                                              4/2/16
                                                              Joey + Rory score its first No. 1-selling album with Hymns That Are Important to Us
                                                              Bethel Music scores its third top 10-selling album with Have It All: Live At Bethel Church (No. 6)
                                                              3 Doors Down scores its sixth top 10-selling album with Us And The Night (No. 7)
                                                              Randy Houser scores his first top 10-selling album with Fired Up (No. 9)

                                                              4/9/16
                                                              Iggy Pop scores his first top 10-selling album with Post Pop Depression (No. 8)

                                                              4/16/16
                                                              Joe Bonamassa scores his second top 10-selling album with Blues Of Desperation (No. 5)
                                                              Anthony Hamilton scores his first top 10-selling album with What I'm Feelin' (No. 7)

                                                              4/23/16
                                                              Explosions In The Sky scores its first top 10-selling album with The Wilderness (No. 9)

                                                              4/30/16
                                                              Zakk Wylde scored his first top 10-selling album with Book Of Shadows II (No. 6)
                                                              Ben Harper, with The Innocent Criminals, scores his fourth top 10 with Call It What It Is (No. 7)

                                                              5/7/16
                                                              Ace Frehley scores his second top 10-selling album with Origins, Vol. 1 (No. 9)

                                                              5/14/16
                                                              NF 8 scores its first top 10-selling album with Therapy Session (No. 8)
                                                              Blue October scores its second top 10-selling album with Home (No. 10)

                                                              5/21/16
                                                              Sixx:A.M. scores its second top 10-selling album with Prayers For The Damned, Vol. 1 (No. 10)

                                                              6/11/16
                                                              Blake Shelton scores his third No. 1-selling album with If I'm Honest

                                                              6/18/16
                                                              Dierks Bentley scores his first No. 1-selling album with Black
                                                              The Monkees scores its sixth top 10-selling album with Good Times! (No. 6)
                                                              Thrice scores its first top 10-selling album with To Be Everywhere Is To Be Nowhere (No. 8)
                                                              Kevin Gates scores his first top 10-selling album with Murder For Hire II (No. 9)

                                                              6/25/16
                                                              Paul Simon lands his second solo No. 1-selling album with Stranger To Stranger
                                                              Tegan And Sara score its second top 10-selling album with Love You To Death (No. 8)

                                                              7/2/16
                                                              Nick Jonas scores first No. 1-selling album with Last Year Was Complicated
                                                              Garbage lands its second top 10-selling album with Strange Little Birds (No. 7)
                                                              Band Of Horses scores its second top 10-selling album with Why Are You OK (No. 9)
                                                              Kaleo lands its first 10-selling album with A/B (No. 10)

                                                              7/9/16
                                                              Red Hot Chili Peppers scores its second No. 1 selling album with The Getaway
                                                              Jon Pardi scores his first top 10-selling album with California Sunrise (No. 8)

                                                              7/16/16
                                                              The Avett Brothers scores its first No. 1-selling album with True Sadness

                                                              7/30/16
                                                              Schoolboy Q lands his first No. 1-selling album with Blank Face LP

                                                              8/6/16
                                                              NeedToBreathe scores its first No. 1-selling album with [/i]HardLove[/i]
                                                              Steven Tyler scores his first top 10-selling album with We're All Somebody From Somewhere (No. 7)
                                                              Logic scores his third top 10-selling title with [/i]Bobby Tarantino[/i] (No. 8)

                                                              8/13/16
                                                              Gucci Mane scores his first No. 1-selling album with Everybody Looking
                                                              Crown the Empire scores his second top 10-selling album with Retrograde (No. 3)
                                                              Periphery scores its first top 10-selling album with Periphery III: Select Difficulty (No. 6)
                                                              Grateful Dead scores its second top 10-selling album with Dave's Picks, Volume 19: Honolulu Civic Auditorium, Honolulu, HI - 1/23/70 (No. 7)

                                                              8/20/16
                                                              Descendents scores its first top 10-selling album with Hypercaffium Spazzinate (No. 10)

                                                              8/27/16
                                                              Cody Johnson scores his first top 10-selling album with Gotta Be Me (No. 6)

                                                              9/3/16
                                                              Young The Giant scores its second top 10-selling album with Home Of The Strange (No. 6)
                                                              Atmosphere scores its third top 10-selling album with Fishing Blues (No. 9)

                                                              9/10/16
                                                              Dolly Parton scores her third top 10-selling album with Pure & Simple (No. 6)

                                                              9/17/16
                                                              De La Soul scores its second top 10-selling album with and the ANONYMOUS NOBODY... (No. 7)

                                                              9/24/16
                                                              A Day to Remember scores its first No. 1-selling album with Bad Vibrations

                                                              10/1/16
                                                              Wilco scores its fifth top 10-selling album with Schmilco
                                                              Of Mice & Men scores its second top 10-selling album with Cold World (No. 9)

                                                              10/8/16
                                                              Aaron Lewis scores his first No. 1-selling album with Sinner
                                                              Ghost scores its second top 10-selling album with Popestar (EP) (No. 6)
                                                              Led Zepellin scores its 14th top 10-selling album with The Complete BBC Sessions (No. 10)

                                                              10/15/16
                                                              Crowder scores his second top 10-selling album with American Prodigal (No. 5)
                                                              Every Time I Die scores its first top 10-selling album with Low Teens (No. 8)
                                                              Idina Menzel scores her second top 10-selling album with Idina (No. 9)

                                                              10/22/16
                                                              Bon Iver scores its first No. 1-selling album with 22, A Million
                                                              Bob Weir scores his first top 10-selling (solo) album with Blue Mountain (No. 6)
                                                              Opeth scores its first top 10-selling album with Sorceress (No. 8)
                                                              Drive-By-Truckers scores its first top 10-selling album with American Band (No. 9)

                                                              10/29/16
                                                              Dance Gavin Dance scores its first top 10-selling album with Mothership (No. 6)
                                                              Meshuggah scores its first top 10-selling album with The Violent Sleep of Reason (No. 7)
                                                              Phish scores its fourth top 10-selling album with Big Boat (No. 8)
                                                              Sum 41 scores its third top 10-selling album with 13 Voices (No. 9)

                                                              11/5/16
                                                              Blackberry Smoke scores its first top 10-selling album with Like an Arrow (No. 6)
                                                              Hillsong scores its first top 10-selling album with Let There Be Light (No. 7)
                                                              The Dillinger Escape Plan scores its first top 10-selling album with Dissociation (No. 8)

                                                              11/12/16
                                                              The Pretty Reckless scores its second top 10-selling album with Who You Selling For (No. 8)
                                                              I Prevail scores its first top 10-selling album with Lifelines (No. 9)
                                                              Jimmy Eat World scores its third top 10-selling album with Integrity Blues (No. 10)

                                                              11/19/16
                                                              Kenny Chesney scores his eighth No. 1-selling album with Cosmic Hallelujah
                                                              The Piano Guys scores its first top 10-selling album with Uncharted (No. 8)
                                                              Testament scores its first top 10-selling album with Brotherhood of the Snake (No. 9)
                                                              Tove Lo scores her first top 10-selling album with Lady Wood (No. 10)

                                                              12/3/16
                                                              Joe scores his seventh top 10-selling album with #MYNAMEISJOETHOMAS (No. 9)
                                                              *Garth Brooks' 10-disc The Ultimate Collection sold some 134,000, making it the week's top-selling album; however, the $29.99 price made it ineligible for the albums charts (to chart, new releases must be sold for no lower than $3.49 in their first four weeks; to chart, the album needed a price of at least $34.90- 10 discs x $3.49. This isn't the first time Brooks may have had the week's top-selling album that didn't chart- his 2005 The Limited Series reportedly sold enough to rank No. 1 on the albums chart in its week of release. However, as a Wal-Mart exclusive, it was ineligible to chart at the time. Thus, Brooks may have 11 No. 1-selling titles, but two were deemed ineligible to chart at he time of such sales.

                                                              12/24/16
                                                              Grace VanderWaal scores her first top 10-selling title with Perfectly Imperfect (EP) (No. 6)

                                                              12/31/16
                                                              Tech N9ne scores his fifth top 10-selling album with The Storm (No. 10)
                                                              Last edited by HolidayGuy; Fri September 6, 2019, 21:22.
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