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U.K. Politics: Nadhim Zahawi sacked by Rishi Sunak

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  • Originally posted by jordi_89 View Post

    As a "selling point" for their candidate to try to gain votes. I.

    But I don't really think the Tories appeal to voters who care about diversity and inclusion... It's quite the opposite, actually.

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    • Originally posted by Artoo View Post
      I think he was too close to Boris, complicit in some of Boris’ mistakes, and was also guilty of breaking lockdown laws he helped create (investigated and fined by the police). People just wanted a fresh break from the Boris era.
      I never got why the Britons made such a big deal out of it when quite a few politicians did it in my country, and while there was a medial outrage, there were no real consequences for the politicians involved.

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      • Originally posted by greek_boy View Post


        But I don't really think the Tories appeal to voters who care about diversity and inclusion... It's quite the opposite, actually.
        In fact, that's even more inclusive because if a Tory reaches a high political function because he/she is the right person for the job and not because of some demographic factors. When the last German Family Minister dropped off, her party had as criteria that her successor had to come from their party (It's a three-party-coalition, so there would've been other options.), be a woman and come from a certain political tendency within their party. Actual experience in that political field didn't seem as important.

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        • Originally posted by greek_boy View Post


          Truss was also part of BoJo's gov, plus I don't really think the Tory members didn't vote for Sunak because he was 'complicit'.
          The chancellor position is the second highest in government and the UK has a history of punishing complicit politicians at the ballot box - I still believe Gordon Brown lost his one election because he had been a Blairite rather than his own policies.

          Ultimately Liz Truss ran her leadership campaign appealing to core Conservative values. She championed lower taxes, uncapped bonuses, energy support packages, a roadmap towards energy independence and a whole other wave of things that was the oppose of what both Boris had, and Rishi was, pedalling.

          We now know it was a shortcut down a one way street towards national bankruptcy, but that doesn’t mean Liz didn’t have the right policies for her party members. Apparently around 80% of the party membership is in the ‘highest-paid and most-educated’ demographic, so lower taxes and uncapped bonuses were a huge draw to Liz.

          I don’t deny that racism exists but I just don’t believe it was a deciding factor in Rishi losing the leadership bid - I think it’s really easy to blame that without digging into the actual problems, and Rishi is far from problem free. To underestimate the whole partygate affair would be a massive oversight and I think it’s going to be a really big issue when the next election is held.
          I have a bad feeling about this.

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          • Originally posted by Artoo View Post
            To underestimate the whole partygate affair would be a massive oversight and I think it’s going to be a really big issue when the next election is held.
            Well, was Sunak even asking for heavier and heavier restrictions? If that was the case and he didn't stick them himself, now that would be a problem. On the other hand, someone like Johnson seemed like someone who preferred as few restrictions as possible and the other ones were announced to please others but not really because he was convinced by them himself.

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            • Originally posted by Artoo View Post
              Whilst there are definitely racist Tories, I genuinely don’t believe that was a deciding factor in Rishi’s defeat in the initial leadership bid. He only lost the membership vote by 8%, and had become a divisive and somewhat controversial figure in the build up to Boris leaving.

              I think he was too close to Boris, complicit in some of Boris’ mistakes, and was also guilty of breaking lockdown laws he helped create (investigated and fined by the police). People just wanted a fresh break from the Boris era.
              Racism definitely plays a big part. The UK is so xenophobic at the moment and immigration (into which race is entangled) is a big factor. The Tories are a privileged white mans faction
              You say that I must eat so many lemons, cos I am so Bitt-er

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              • Originally posted by westhammer View Post
                Racism definitely plays a big part.
                Based on what though? Because the statistics don’t back this up. He lost the initial leadership contest by less than 8% so clearly it wasn’t a huge issue for (almost) half of the voters, and when it gets down to the wire like it did, surely logic dictates policy becomes the deciding factor?

                You also have to look at party membership demographics as oppose to larger Tory voter demographics - because in the scheme of things, very few people pay to become a voting member of a party. According to the Financial Times ‘About 80 per cent are thought to be “ABC1s”, the name of the highest-paid and most-educated demographic groups’, which suggests to me that Liz’s promise of lower taxes and uncapped bonuses swung the vote for her rather than outright racism towards Rishi.
                I have a bad feeling about this.

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                • Originally posted by Artoo View Post

                  Based on what though? Because the statistics don’t back this up. He lost the initial leadership contest by less than 8% so clearly it wasn’t a huge issue for (almost) half of the voters, and when it gets down to the wire like it did, surely logic dictates policy becomes the deciding factor?

                  You also have to look at party membership demographics as oppose to larger Tory voter demographics - because in the scheme of things, very few people pay to become a voting member of a party. According to the Financial Times ‘About 80 per cent are thought to be “ABC1s”, the name of the highest-paid and most-educated demographic groups’, which suggests to me that Liz’s promise of lower taxes and uncapped bonuses swung the vote for her rather than outright racism towards Rishi.
                  He was up against a woman though - if it was against a white ‘British’ man he wouldn’t have stood a shot. I think people wanting Boris back despite everything he did also speaks to white male ideals - it’s an unconscious racial bias
                  You say that I must eat so many lemons, cos I am so Bitt-er

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by westhammer View Post

                    He was up against a woman though - if it was against a white ‘British’ man he wouldn’t have stood a shot. I think people wanting Boris back despite everything he did also speaks to white male ideals - it’s an unconscious racial bias
                    Possibly, but we have absolutely nothing to back up that claim. Whilst I readily admit that there are racist Tory supporters (both outright and unconsciously), there’s nothing to back up the claim racism is why Rishi lost and that racism is why Truss won.

                    The leadership race was actually the first time Tory members have ever actually had the opportunity to vote for a woman (both Thatcher and May were voted in by MPs) or for a man that wasn’t white. So it was nee ground all around.

                    Rishi was actually doing incredibly well in opinion polls across most of covid, but ultimately overplayed his hand. He isn’t a particularly nice guy and his politics are massively flawed.

                    I mean look at this rubbish:



                    I just think that to blame racism for Rishi’s initial defeat is shortsighted and ties into a narrative people chose to believe. I don’t deny that it played a part, but the guy is not a saint and I just think his politics and conduct got in the way more than the colour of his skin.
                    I have a bad feeling about this.

                    Comment


                    • Coronation bank holiday confirmed for Monday 8th May 2023.
                      I have a bad feeling about this.

                      Comment


                      • Williamson resigns after bullying claims

                        Sir Gavin Williamson resigns as government minister after bullying allegations and says he aims to “clear my name of any wrongdoing”.

                        He said he "refuted" how his "past conduct" had been characterised but said the allegations were becoming a distraction for "the good work the government is doing".

                        He added he would comply with a complaints process concerning messages he sent a colleague and that he had apologised to the recipient.

                        https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-63563263
                        Bye.

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                        • Sounds like a lunatic… and the fact he’s a Sir is shambolic.

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                          • UK Supreme Court confirms Scotland does not have the legal authority to hold a second independence referendum.

                            I have a bad feeling about this.

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                            • I have a bad feeling about this.

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                              • Watching Sturgeon’s press conference - an impassioned speech and as much as I do not want Scotland to leave the union (and never will want that), she has played her hand incredibly well. They asked the Supreme Court the right questions, probably knowing they would probably be denied, and thus now have a legal judgement that gives them the ammunition to now make this a question of democracy and quite honestly, freedom.

                                So the SNP will campaign during the next general election for independence and view it as a de facto referendum. It is rare we see someone winning when playing the system, so credit where credit is due. I don’t support independent but I do support democracy. It comes down to whether you view Scotland as a separate country or whether you view the United Kingdom as the one and only. I’ve never been ‘English’, I’ve always been “British’.
                                I have a bad feeling about this.

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                                • I’ve always seen myself as British too but you can’t blame the Scots who want independence as Britain is so England-centric.

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                                  • On the matter of Scotland's independence, I'm obviously delighted with the Supreme Court's ruling (though not surprised, it was fairly clean cut) - I really want the UK to remain a united kingdom. If all else fails, and Sturgeon does get her way, I don't think it's clear cut - just look @ the opinion polls:



                                    It's very split, with "no" more favourable than "yes" - however, c5-8% seem to be undecided and it is that group that will tip any future vote. If Sturgeon does secure a vote on independence, I hope it's preceded by a re-vote on Brexit for the UK.

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                                    • I hope the Scottish succeed.
                                      Find me here:

                                      https://www.last.fm/user/jordi_89

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                                      • Originally posted by Wayne View Post
                                        If all else fails, and Sturgeon does get her way, I don't think it's clear cut - just look @ the opinion polls:
                                        I agree, but now she’s got two years to play the whole ‘they’ll never take our freedom’ card - it isn’t just about independence now, but a matter of principle and democracy.

                                        Even if a person want to vote no in a referendum, they don’t even have the right to do that because they’re not entitled to a vote. It’s going to win the SNP support and change the polls. It was a smart move and I rarely say that about British politics

                                        I’m just wondering what happens when we have an election, the SNP wins big in Scotland again and Westminster continues to deny them a vote - what’s the next step?

                                        I’m sure there’ll be an article published with the answer shortly
                                        I have a bad feeling about this.

                                        Comment


                                        • So is there anyone not striking this Christmas?

                                          I have a bad feeling about this.

                                          Comment


                                          • Originally posted by Artoo View Post
                                            So is there anyone not striking this Christmas?
                                            Couriers
                                            1 Majestic |2 Sub Focus |3 Cristoph |4 Subwoolfer |5 Rudimental

                                            Comment


                                            • And in today's most infuriating news story...

                                              Kwasi Kwarteng says he got carried away as chancellor

                                              Former chancellor Kwasi Kwarteng says he "got carried away" when he announced a huge package of ill-fated tax cuts alongside former PM Liz Truss.

                                              Mr Kwarteng told the Financial Times his biggest regret was being "too impatient" with the mini-budget.

                                              The plans sparked turmoil in the markets, eventually leading to Mr Kwarteng and Ms Truss's resignation.

                                              "There was a brief moment and the people in charge, myself included, blew it," he said.

                                              Reflecting on his time in office, the MP for Spelthorne said there had been "no tactical subtlety whatsoever".

                                              "People got carried away, myself included," he said.

                                              As chancellor, Mr Kwarteng set out a package to abolish the top rate of income tax for the highest earners, axe the cap on bankers' bonuses, and provide an expensive and long-running energy support package.

                                              The plans would have required more than 70bn of increased borrowing, but most of the measures were torn up by his successor, Jeremy Hunt.

                                              The pound fell to a record low against the dollar after the announcement, requiring intervention from the Bank of England and increasing mortgage rates for homeowners.

                                              Two days later, Mr Kwarteng signalled more tax cuts were coming, causing more market uncertainty.

                                              He was sacked from the position after just 38 days, becoming Britain's second shortest-serving chancellor, with Ms Truss's time as prime minister coming to a chaotic end shortly afterwards.

                                              Mr Kwarteng, who is a long-time ally of Ms Truss, previously said he told her it was "mad" to sack him, saying he urged her to "slow down".

                                              His comments come after Ms Truss's former chief speech writer, Asa Bennett, said she took a "Spinal Tap approach" to government and demanded the volume "was turned up to 11".

                                              Spinal Tap are a spoof heavy metal group created by a team of comedians and musicians, who famously had amplifiers that were "one louder" than 10.

                                              Mr Bennett said the former prime minister was determined to put "rocket boosters" under the economy when she arrived in Downing Street.

                                              https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63927502
                                              I think he does at least have some degree of courage to admit his errors (though it seems to be more about timings than content, which is delusional), I haven't seen anything from LT since she buggered off.

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                                              • Originally posted by SholasBoy View Post

                                                Couriers
                                                Although I have been waiting for a parcel from DPD for a week!

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                                                • Originally posted by Thriller View Post

                                                  Although I have been waiting for a parcel from DPD for a week!
                                                  Not guilty. Also, all week while delivering I’ve seen sooo many Royal Mail parcels left on doorsteps which is not like them, so you can tell the agency staff are in.
                                                  1 Majestic |2 Sub Focus |3 Cristoph |4 Subwoolfer |5 Rudimental

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