U.K. Politics: Nadine Dorries resigns her post as MP - or does she?

[Brad]

I looked up 'queer' and it's an umbrella term for anyone who falls out of gender and sexuality "norms" rather than the derogatory term.

[Blondini]

I looked up 'queer' and it's an umbrella term for anyone who falls out of gender and sexuality "norms" rather than the derogatory term.

Yeah, i saw that, too. But it's confusing, surely? Why make something simple more complicated? LGBT is enough letters!

[Graham76man]

I am suggesting it's BAD
It's going to the place with people that the same age that's the REAL problem. It's fine up to the age of about 12 or when a person starts going into puberty. But after that that's the problem. You see us humans alive now have the bodies of hunter-gathers of around 10,000 years ago. They were geared up to look after children up to about 12 years of age. At which point if you were well fed, the body would start changing. The effect of this was to reject the parents influence and the young adult would seek "outside" influences. These before the school leaving age was increased past 12, would be from a wide varity of ages and persons. Thus ensuring proper development of the social skills needed in life. These include selecting perspective partners of the future. In fact we select the kind of people we are going to have as partners from the characteristics of the people around us shortly after puberty. Speaking personally I can say all the female types I have been interested in my life our based on several girls I hung around with while I was 14 only. For others it will vary depending on who they met around that sort of age and when they started puberty. Nevertheless with the introduction of compulsory education past 12 and the fact that humans are well fed now, whereas in the past certainly before the 1950's many kids were late developing puberty, and in England could leave School at 14, many would change mixing with a wide range of people. So anyone past 80 could well have devolved normally as designed. Those under that age will have been influenced in their development by kids mostly. You have to also bear in mind that process only works in the daylight hours, so if you are stuck in a classroom with 20 to 30 14- year-olds, you will grow up being influenced by them only.
You can't teach life skills. If your not confident stuck in a room being thrown black-board rubbers at by the only adult then your not going to pick up confidence. If you are a girl stuck around lads aged 14, since testosterone is pouring out of them, you will end attracted to males who have high levels of that, such as sporting types - or the ones that will beat the crap out of you!
Then there's the girl in the class who's leaking pheromones that bad she stinks. But she's also if you are a male causing a body reaction to make you attracted to certain females in the future who produce only small amounts of that chemical. Not always with positive results.
In hunter/gathers days groups of males would bond together and form a group. This behaviour is still found now. Especially in schools, but these were groups were not all of the same age, so each would contribute to the group. But the gangs of the school are the same age and have no experience of life greater than the other members, so there is infighting. False information is easily spread. Then add sex to the mix and hormones that can make the kids angry, mad, sexy, sad, depressed, frustrated.
After the process is finished they leave school and have kids themselves. But they don't know how to bring up the kids like there parents did them, so they adopt new ways and when these fail, they blame it on the kids - TV or something else. Then they say it's the fault of the teachers and spend money on education and turn the school into what some teachers call day jails for kids - complete with fences and security cameras. They even rank the schools and get governments to adjust it so they can send the kids to decent schools and the rest are seen on TV on channel four of five.
Of course their kids still go into puberty in the decent school and become bankers. While others crash aeroplanes into building because they believe in things which would horrify their parents.

Meanwhile a bunch of academics at Oxbridge debate how we should correctly name someone, while watching the boat race, before joining the Green Party.

And Graham writes about how Education causes these problems, but is ignored. Well you can't go to a member of Parliament and say that spending money on education is like giving grants to Jimmy Saville types to promote children's charities. Can you
Or go to a book publisher who's been educated at Oxbridge and say that we need to radically change the education system.

[4warduntodawn]

I got 60% conservative and 40% UKIP

[4warduntodawn]

Boris just did a brilliant post on facebook
https://www.facebook.com/borisjohnson/p ... 3821751317

[Thombus]

My god Graham, it's no surprise why you're so caught up with this ideal of going back to the hunter gatherer days when your tainted view of this world is completely prehistoric!

If you look at the money spent on education, you'll see that it has certainly gone some way to help young kids gain the skills needed for a more successful life. The cash injection into Apprenceships is a great example when you consider that students are not only being educated in the classroom but also out there in the 'real world' gaining transferable skills that can easily be applied to any given situation. Whilst as adults it's incredibly easy for us to look back at our own education and say 'if only they taught me how to buy a house, life would be easier' but the whole point of education is not to spoon feed children by literally taking a situation and saying 'do this', it's to allow them the opportunity to develop their minds to think critically for themselves.

As for education fostering racism et al, that's absolute bull.

if it wasn't for widening participation, particularly at a higher education level, then many underprivileged children would never have the opportunity to further themselves and achieve the kind of roles that were once held for the more elite among us. People tend to kick back at society if they feel underprivileged, and that's what breeds gangs and anticsocial behaviour, not education itself.

[Graham76man]

I'm not arguing going back to any time in the past. It's just that the human body hasn't changed from all those years ago.

It's not the skills that people learn or anything that education does that is the cause of our problems, it simply being mixed with people of the same age during daylight hours for five days a week, between the age of 12 and 21.

Yes you do get highly skilled workforce, though many teachers would argue that's not the purpose of education. However that isn't working out in practice. This is best summed up in the lyrics to a song:
My father is a doctor, he's a family man
My mother works for charity whenever she can
They're both good clean Americans who abide by the law
And they both stick up for liberty and they both support the war
My happiness was paid for when they laid their money down
For summers in a summer camp and winters in the tow

My future in the system was talked about and planned
But I gave it up for music and the free electric band

I went to school in hand-washed shirts with neatly ordered hair
And the school was big and newly built and filled with light and air
And the teacher taught us values that we had to learn to keep
And he clipped the ear of many idle kid who went to sleep
Then my father organized for me a college in the east
But I went to California, the sunshine and the beach

My parents and my lecturers could never understand
Why I gave it up for music and the free electric band

Well, they used to sit and speculate upon their son's career
A lawyer or a doctor or a civil engineer

Just give me bread and water, put a guitar in my hand
'Cause all I need is music and the free electric band


The cause of this was the direct effect of this guy's hormones during puberty and the fact he was mixing with kids who no nothing of the "real world".
I've highlighted the main thing in that song. The fact that those who think like you Thombus, don't understand when what should have been is thrown in their face.
The chap above in the lyrics is not uncommon either, Mick Jagger was supposed to be an accountant for example.
Gangs are created, because the education system isolates young people and because they are in class together the gangs form up then and outside, because they do not mix with a wide range of people. In fact it's not encouraged at all for young people to hang around with adults, since the fear of sex, still a taboo subject in Western countries, would come into the lives of the young people.
The result of not mixing with the adults is anti-social behaviour. The problem gets worse with each new generation. I can give you an example from an old neighbour of mine.
The first thing you need to know was this couple were not married, another effect of not mixing with adults, I'm afraid. The education they had made them wise enough to find a way to work the system to allow them to move house when the going gets tough for them. He "worked" at a scrap yard, she didn't. They had 3 kids. The couple I would say were about average intelligence. They would have got mostly C in exams for example I would say. As I said they had 3 kids one about 13 - a boy, a girl aged 12, and another boy aged 10. To bring these kids up correctly they needed to understand life. They didn't. In fact they didn't understand the kids at all. The 13 year old lad, was simple to understand. He was on par with his parents. C grade material. The girl was way above them. She was A grade, though I doubt that the teachers in the school had any inkling of that. Her home offered nothing to keep her mind occupied and so she larked around, getting into trouble at the drop of a hat. The third child was aged 10 but going on five mentally. Really behind and should have gone to a special school. A real handful and troublesome in the local area.
When these kids have grown up do you think the education system will have sorted there issues out, or just make it worse.
I could mention the middle class woman I knew, who rejected her family yet was highly educated, use to give her wages to the poor unskilled nursery workers in the underprivileged areas, as she felt it absolutely necessary to work in. While at the same time supporting left-wing polices, women etc and later on working inside the Blair government on educational issues on the keywords that these people go on about. Nowadays - for what the Sun would call a "loony lefty" - she lives in a several million pound house Not bad eh!

[Thombus]

It's not the skills that people learn or anything that education does that is the cause of our problems, it simply being mixed with people of the same age during daylight hours for five days a week, between the age of 12 and 21.

So in effect your entire argument isn't based around 'education', you're basing it on social conditioning alone, and with that, your utter disdain for it. What would you prefer instead of children being among other children during their adolescence - something akin to the story of Genie? The fact is children do have the opportunity to mix with adults all the time, be it through enrichment activities outside of school, in the family home, at school with their tutors - I genuinely don't think that taking kids out of school at 12 years old to play with the big boys on a more frequent basis is going to save the country or the next generation

The cause of this was the direct effect of this guy's hormones during puberty and the fact he was mixing with kids who no nothing of the "real world".

Seriously, put down the weed.

The first thing you need to know was this couple were not married, another effect of not mixing with adults, I'm afraid.

Yes, I'm all to aware that every child who attends school ends up un-married due to their severe lack of mixing with adults. Funny, I got married last year yet I didn't leave school at 12...I must be an anomaly.

I'm going to bypass your reference to your neighbours, because it makes no sense, and I can't be bothered to dissect it and point out everything that's incredibly wrong with it. Also, I think we're very quickly descending into something that will be of absolutely no interest to any other users wishing to peruse a thread on the General Election.

[Graham76man]

Nice to know then you will be voting for the Liberal Democrats who the other day announced they will be spending millions of pounds on education.

As for the Genie case it relates to a pre-puberty individual. Sticking children in schools before puberty development starts has no effect on the social-skills development. It's exactly the protected environment that the hunter/gather did 10,000 years ago. Genie's father probably developed the idea of doing that from his own education experiences.

Incidentally the increase in drug use and the weed you mention is in direct response to the questioning of the adult world during the puberty processes. Especially during the 60's. In other words anything you superiors - that can be teachers, parents, politicians and the like think is wrong, must be good. Since everyone in the class at school is 14 they have the same attitude as you and it quickly becomes a norm. If a 14 year old was mixing with people who were 21, 34, 44 and 55, years of age (even in a classroom environment) that notion would quickly get knock on the head, providing of course such people were not all weed takers, caused by them having it drilled into their heads when 14.

[Graham76man]

Thombus
The first thing you need to know was this couple were not married, another effect of not mixing with adults, I'm afraid.

Yes, I'm all to aware that every child who attends school ends up un-married due to their severe lack of mixing with adults. Funny, I got married last year yet I didn't leave school at 12...I must be an anomaly.

Not at all, how long you can stay married is the question? Your choice of partner is simply based on the people (more likely kids) you meet probably around when you are 14. I call it person patterning. You model your own personality on the people you have regular contact with, during daylight hours only! You are also selecting the types of traits you like in potential partners. Sometimes these are that powerful that the person marries the person they went to school with who embodies these traits. Many of us though select traits from several people. You might not even work this out till many years after you leave school. I certainly didn't. For example if you encounter say a girl who's a bit bubbly - personality wise, you might find yourself falling for someone with that trait many years later.
I don't know anything about your relationship or your age, but your educational experience could have simply caused you to get married far too early in life instead. The crunch comes around 27 to 29 when most likely Saturn comes around to the point of your birth and shuts down the hormones, if they are still working, that caused puberty. Many rock stars have felt the effect of the Saturn return with dire consequences.

Count yourself lucky, I uncounted a girl at 14 who was in love with me, but couldn't do or did anything about it! Try getting married when you are looking for a woman who's like that!

[SholasBoy]

Count yourself lucky, I uncounted a girl at 14 who was in love with me, but couldn't do or did anything about it! Try getting married when you are looking for a woman who's like that!

Why would you be looking for a woman who's like that? :-?

[Graham76man]

Count yourself lucky, I uncounted a girl at 14 who was in love with me, but couldn't do or did anything about it! Try getting married when you are looking for a woman who's like that!

Why would you be looking for a woman who's like that? :-?

That's simple "body chemistry".
The hormones and the other mysterious smells etc that we all produce effect how we perceive each other. Of course you don't actually go deliberately looking for someone who has that quality, but when you encounter one, the attraction will be there. If you like I can smell a commitment phobia woman a mile off

Cliff Richard summed up a similar type of attraction in the song Heart User. In fact these type of heart break songs are full of people falling for the wrong types. Stand By Your Man comes to mind too.
All these types are simply encoded that way when we are about 14, just like I was.

I was watching Doctors today and an older teacher fell for a 15 year old boy and got pregnant by him, she was of course arrested for sex abuse. But it does show you how society has changed to make this a crime. The famous diarist John Evelyn (17th century) not only had a 14 year old girl, he married her. In fact it was very common to marry at an earlier age too. Though many actually delayed getting married till way after 21.

Just wanted to also say the education is an election issue, so anyone thinking that voting for who party who think it is a cure for the country's problems is barking up the wrong tree. Which is what I'm pointing out in this thread.

I have also got my postal vote and filled it in and it will be posted tomorrow.

[UKMusicLova]

Education also fosters racism, extreme radical views

Yeah, all UKIP / BNP / EDL supporters, are known to hold PhDs and MBAs...

Graham.... I never say this...but...I can't...

[SholasBoy]

This has all turned quite disturbing. Not sure Cliff Richard lyrics are the best justification here.

[Thombus]

I'm curious to know what political party you could possibly be voting for who will outright state they won't be funding the education system in this country?

[UKMusicLova]

I'm curious to know what political party you could possibly be voting for who will outright state they won't be funding the education system in this country?

Monster Raving Loony Party

[steophonic]

This has all turned quite disturbing. Not sure Cliff Richard lyrics are the best justification here.

[Graham76man]

I'm curious to know what political party you could possibly be voting for who will outright state they won't be funding the education system in this country?

I've already stated which party I have voted for.
As for the rest of the comment I have already answered that in a previous reply when I stated that nobody in any political party believes that education is to blame for the problems the world faces. On the contrary politicians believe it will cure these problems. But do anyone one of you think there's a cure for anything without side effects? Would you continue to use a cure that actually is making the problems worse with each generation?

We are simply flesh and blood. Ruled by electrical and chemical impulses.
For example - To make athletes - you need to have high level of steroids - if you don't there's no way you will win Gold at the Olympics.

The Pituitary gland is called the master gland. It is found at the base of the brain, near another important gland, the hypothalamus.
It plays a central role in regulating the secretions from many other hormone-secreting glands of the body. It is very small (pea-size) in relation to some structures of equal importance, i.e. the heart. It influences so many areas of the body! Directly and indirectly it controls your growth, urine production, blood chemistry and reproductive activities. It also stimulates the growth of bone and other body tissues. It plays a role in the body's handling of nutrients and mineral in electrolyte balance. It stimulates the thyroid gland to produce thyroid hormones and it stimulates the adrenal glands to produce other hormones. It triggers the contractions of the uterus that occur during labor and activates milk production at birth.

I've included this quote to show how everything we do is controlled by our body. There's nothing any different from me being attracted to a certain type of woman, than why many of the men on this site fancy men. Do they think they have free will or something to do that?
What's even more interesting is why so many gay men want to talk about pop music on this site. Something which normally is the preserve of teenagers.
But the link is obvious to me, some facts for you:
1) Gay culture developed at the same time as the education school leaving age went pass the age of 14.
2) Pop music came about at precisely the same time as the school leaving age went above 14.
3) Teenagers became "teenagers" when the school leaving age went pass 14. The word had not even been invented before that year.
4) The school leaving age went pass 14 in 1948.
Which political party was responsible for this act of 1948? Labour of course. But Mrs T was also responsible for the more destructive phase, when it went to 16 in 1973/4. She was at the time attacked only for removing the milk from schools. But to be fair most schools were no longer giving it out anyway. By the way she extended the school leaving age, to honour a Labour commitment. Which they had broken.

[Brad]

The school leaving age went pass 14 in 1948.

1947 actually.

Gay culture developed at the same time as the education school leaving age went pass the age of 14.

There isn't a link between education in the UK and what you'd probably consider "gay culture", which wasn't publicly acknowledged until 1969 after the Stonewall riots in the US.

Which political party was responsible for this act of 1948? Labour of course.

The Education Act 1944 was actually introduced by a Conservative, Rab Butler, but it wasn't implemented until 1947 because of WW2.

[Graham76man]

The school leaving age went pass 14 in 1948.

1947 actually.

Gay culture developed at the same time as the education school leaving age went pass the age of 14.

There isn't a link between education in the UK and what you'd probably consider "gay culture", which wasn't publicly acknowledged until 1969 after the Stonewall riots in the US.

Which political party was responsible for this act of 1948? Labour of course.

The Education Act 1944 was actually introduced by a Conservative, Rab Butler, but it wasn't implemented until 1947 because of WW2.

Yeah on the dates thing, I didn't consult my notes, trying to remember everything from memory. Though Grammar Schools kept kids to 16 anyway. That's why many middle class and rich kids messed up their lives early then working class kids did.

You are wrong on the link with Gay culture. There are plenty. You just need to look. As I said before puberty causes people to question the status quo and the Stonewall riots are just a form of this questioning not cancelled out. "Gay" itself was from the University types debating the rights of people again attacking the status quo on things. It's actually one of the more positive outcomes of what I call "education culture". But the bad side effects outweigh the good. Anti racism is another one of the positive ones. There's quite a bit of linkage between the two and you can chuck feminists in with those two movements.

For more details see my blog:

http://therealchart.blogspot.co.uk/p/reflected-people.html

This part covers a great deal of the side effects of the education culture.

Butler is covered under this part:

http://therealchart.blogspot.co.uk/2012/09/reflected-people-chapter-1.html

I haven't yet added more of the information that covers other aspects of the work I did on this. To be honest I haven't had the time to complete the theory.