Zayn Malik :: The "Icarus Falls" Era

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Postby jjavier1978 » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:59 pm

jjavier1978 wrote:Canada

24 (New) Icarus Falls

USA Billboard 200

61 (New) Icarus Falls
Digital

08 (New) 01 Icarus Falls
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Postby jpguy » Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:54 pm

How is this even happening? I bet the album will reach top 20/40 in most Martkets but it's still a massive failure
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Postby BehindBreakaway » Tue Dec 25, 2018 9:37 pm

There's a worry that he will be dropped and I can't see a big label wanting to take on an artist who does no promo. It's a shame.
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Postby nympho » Tue Dec 25, 2018 9:57 pm

jpguy wrote:How is this even happening? I bet the album will reach top 20/40 in most Martkets but it's still a massive failure
When? UK midweeks this week show it's about to leave the Top 100 on 2nd week despite the physical release.
Or do you think it can rebound after Xmas?
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Postby jpguy » Tue Dec 25, 2018 10:08 pm

After physical is released ? ^
Oh wait? Was physical released already ?
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Postby Uniquesensation » Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:03 pm

Merry Christmas everybody! :oops:

I think we are being too harsh on Zayn.

He did well, the album debuted at #8 on the digital charts in the USA.

I think he could have debuted in the top 40 in January and with the physical sales, but right now the Christmas albums are getting great streaming and are in the top 40.
To me, January could have been a better timing for a more decent debut, but it seems like they wanted to flop.

I also heard that the physical released was limited too, people couldn’t find in every music store.
It’s such a shame, but like I told you, he debuted at #8 on the digital chart album.
The streaming helped him to sell 20,000k but they did zero promo and no hits..

He could have done worse to be honest.
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Postby Ewokguy15 » Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:16 pm

Uniquesensation wrote:
He could have done worse to be honest.
Please advise how he could have done worse?
Last edited by Ewokguy15 on Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby jpguy » Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:16 pm

^ how can this user be less delusional?
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Postby Ewokguy15 » Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:18 pm

jpguy wrote:^ how can this user be less delusional?
I don’t know, he’s more positive about Zayn than Barney the dinosaur was about friendship.
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Postby JeyBeMust » Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:45 pm

Let’s keep it real, this debut is not a good result, in fact, it’s quite awful. Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify and we’ll have to wait a couple of months to see what happen with it. He has “There You Are” inside Today’s Top Hits List and he’ll get some exposure for sure, this song could become a real hit worldwide after Christmas.

In the streaming era longevity is key, and even If radios don’t support him, Spotify and Apple Music can change the game with major playlists supporting him, so who knows :wink:
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Postby Uniquesensation » Wed Dec 26, 2018 4:44 am

JeyBeMust wrote:Let’s keep it real, this debut is not a good result, in fact, it’s quite awful. Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify and we’ll have to wait a couple of months to see what happen with it. He has “There You Are” inside Today’s Top Hits List and he’ll get some exposure for sure, this song could become a real hit worldwide after Christmas.

In the streaming era longevity is key, and even If radios don’t support him, Spotify and Apple Music can change the game with major playlists supporting him, so who knows :wink:
Totally agree!! 8-)
I’m trying to see the positive side, because we know that shady things have happened behind the scene and this is not Zayn’s fault only.

‘There you are ‘was the smash of the album, but they picked the most generic and bland for radio to represent this album.

When dusk till down was a hit,(it has 1 billion views), they delayed the album for 1 year? :-?

They finally released the album, but without Dusk till down, and without the physical cd to make him look like he flopped so badly.

The critics are quick to point out he is a flop, lazy and has a bad attitude, but Zayn promoted’ I don’t want to live forever’ (with republic records). Proof that he is willing to cooperate and work along.
So, the main problem is that something happened between Sony and him to not promote this album the proper way.
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Postby jpguy » Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:01 am

Willing to "cooperate"? He's a singer, that's his job, he shouldn't have to cooperate but rather do his art some justice otherwise he can switch careers or start selling men make up. And it's not about positivity, I couldn't care less he's making it bit or bad, it's a known fact this era has been an utter mess but doesn't explain the massive underperformance, this reminds me of Spirit Indestructible and Heartbreak On Hold. And we all know what happened after these failures
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Postby spiritboy » Wed Dec 26, 2018 7:04 am

I think we'll hear about label "dropping" him in the next few months. He should sign with an independent record company, that way he won't have the pressure of promoting and performing.
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Postby nympho » Wed Dec 26, 2018 7:27 am

JeyBeMust wrote:Let’s keep it real, this debut is not a good result, in fact, it’s quite awful. Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify and we’ll have to wait a couple of months to see what happen with it. He has “There You Are” inside Today’s Top Hits List and he’ll get some exposure for sure, this song could become a real hit worldwide after Christmas.

In the streaming era longevity is key, and even If radios don’t support him, Spotify and Apple Music can change the game with major playlists supporting him, so who knows :wink:
Let’s keep it real, you know that’s a tricky way of measuring the album’s performance...
Had the album included IDWLF and DTD and we’d be talking of an album close to 2 billion streams... yet no one cared at all about the album itself when it was released.

Talking about a good performance of an album because of the total streams number when 80-90% of that total comes from one song alone -released long before the album- is legit, but it doesn’t mean the album was successful streaming-wise. Certain song was.
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Postby JeyBeMust » Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:02 am

Sis, I just said the album had a bad debut but we should wait a couple of months before call it a flop because at least he has the new single on the Today’s Top Hits List, this it it, don’t over think it. :)

And I agree with @spiritboy, Zayn should have not sign with a major label If he didn’t want to play it big. You cannot participate in a biding war between Columbia, Sony, Universal and Warner and don’t expect you’ll have to promote, tour and do all kind of stuff to make them huge $$$$. He should have keep it small and release music on an indie label.
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Postby nympho » Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:31 am

^

That’s fine, but you said “Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify”. Right now. Not about what it might achieve in the future.
And I’ve seen you’ve used that same argument in other topics as well when other albums have flopped or underperformed but had a song that was a hit... and my point is that those total streams are not a reflection on the album performance but mainly on a single song.
I know. That’s how streaming works and in some countries albums can be Gold, Platinum and Multiplatinum even when they sell nothing just because of that one song streams.

However, the labels spend money on a full album that no one cared to buy/listen. So usually they either drop those artists or keep them as singles artists and they won’t release more full albums.
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Postby beredy » Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:35 am

nympho wrote:^

That’s fine, but you said “Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify”. Right now. Not about what it might achieve in the future.
And I’ve seen you’ve used that same argument in other topics as well when other albums have flopped or underperformed but had a song that was a hit... and my point is that those total streams are not a reflection on the album performance but mainly on a single song.
I know. That’s how streaming works and in some countries albums can be Gold, Platinum and Multiplatinum even when they sell nothing just because of that one song streams.

However, the labels spend money on a full album that no one cared to buy/listen. So usually they either drop those artists or keep them as singles artists and they won’t release more full albums.
This is a bit two-faced coming from you seeing as Million Reasons basically saved Joanne era in streaming numbers. So what if a single song pays off for a whole album worth of songs? It's not like it's the first time that happened, in fact most of 90's and 00's pop album formula was having at most 3 songs that could be huge singles and the rest was pure trash filler.

To me it seems like he delivered a good album based on professional reviews/people reactions (I haven't listened to it so personally I have no opinion on that). As an artist that's the most important thing to do - put out good stuff out there. Maybe it ends up being a slow burner, maybe it doesn't. Also why blame him if he was at the center of bidding war? Why not go for the best offer possible? Just because people have a perception of what a big pop star should act and do it doesn't mean that's how it's supposed to be. We have seen the formula of "pop star acts like that" being reinvented so many times. Just let him do whatever feels most comfortable to him.
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Postby jjavier1978 » Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:46 am

Denmark

26 (NEW) 01 Icarus Falls

by streaming effect :wink:
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Postby nympho » Wed Dec 26, 2018 12:06 pm

beredy wrote:
nympho wrote:^

That’s fine, but you said “Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify”. Right now. Not about what it might achieve in the future.
And I’ve seen you’ve used that same argument in other topics as well when other albums have flopped or underperformed but had a song that was a hit... and my point is that those total streams are not a reflection on the album performance but mainly on a single song.
I know. That’s how streaming works and in some countries albums can be Gold, Platinum and Multiplatinum even when they sell nothing just because of that one song streams.

However, the labels spend money on a full album that no one cared to buy/listen. So usually they either drop those artists or keep them as singles artists and they won’t release more full albums.
This is a bit two-faced coming from you seeing as Million Reasons basically saved Joanne era in streaming numbers. So what if a single song pays off for a whole album worth of songs? It's not like it's the first time that happened, in fact most of 90's and 00's pop album formula was having at most 3 songs that could be huge singles and the rest was pure trash filler.
.
The desperate attempt to attack me with something Gaga related...

Million Reasons has 282 million on Spotify... just a 37% of the album’s total streams, 755 million.

Yep, you’re right, a really good example of those I mentioned when one song has 80-90% of an album’s total streams. :lol:
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Postby beredy » Wed Dec 26, 2018 12:30 pm

nympho wrote:
beredy wrote:
nympho wrote:^

That’s fine, but you said “Nontheless, the album already has 300M streams on Spotify”. Right now. Not about what it might achieve in the future.
And I’ve seen you’ve used that same argument in other topics as well when other albums have flopped or underperformed but had a song that was a hit... and my point is that those total streams are not a reflection on the album performance but mainly on a single song.
I know. That’s how streaming works and in some countries albums can be Gold, Platinum and Multiplatinum even when they sell nothing just because of that one song streams.

However, the labels spend money on a full album that no one cared to buy/listen. So usually they either drop those artists or keep them as singles artists and they won’t release more full albums.
This is a bit two-faced coming from you seeing as Million Reasons basically saved Joanne era in streaming numbers. So what if a single song pays off for a whole album worth of songs? It's not like it's the first time that happened, in fact most of 90's and 00's pop album formula was having at most 3 songs that could be huge singles and the rest was pure trash filler.
.
The desperate attempt to attack me with something Gaga related...

Million Reasons has 282 million on Spotify... just a 37% of the album’s total streams, 755 million.

Yep, you’re right, a really good example of those I mentioned when one song has 80-90% of an album’s total streams. :lol:
It's not a desperate attempt it's just putting things into perspective. It's OK when your faves have 1-2 huge song(s) that make most of album streams, but it's a fail/bad thing/not really a true show of album's worth when someone you don't like (or don't like as much) has the same thing? Also it has been like a week since the album release. Let Zayn's album have a couple of years then compare percentages. Some songs have been out for a week and you expect them to suddenly have streams of a song that was released months ago? LOL. Go back a week after Joanne's release and PI probably had 80-90% of albums streams, no? There are 27 tracks on this album, for all we know there could be a huge hit there that's gonna be released in the upcoming months. Look at Dua Lipa's New Rules.

Sure the start is bad considering he is popular and has a name to himself, but things can still be turned around. The whole release has been messy as hell and that also impacted things.
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Postby JeyBeMust » Wed Dec 26, 2018 12:45 pm

Exactly, I bought a lot of CD’s because I likes just 1 or 2 songs in particular and the rest were filler tracks. Also, it’s not how it stars but how it ends, and it’s too soon to call this era a flop.

And @nynpho, you says that he is attacking you with a GaGa related preference, but I lately feel like you have bad blood with me or something because you always reply my posts trying to undermine my opinion or my collaborations. Maybe it’s my imagination but I feel like everything that I say it’s not good enough because you always have the last word, it’s how I feel (Sorry If that’s not the case) :cry:
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Postby spiritboy » Wed Dec 26, 2018 1:06 pm

I don't think the label will invest more in this project though. They will not bother with sending a song to radio or book some performances so i don't think the album has a chance to recover with streaming only.
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Postby nympho » Wed Dec 26, 2018 1:07 pm

beredy wrote:
nympho wrote:
The desperate attempt to attack me with something Gaga related...

Million Reasons has 282 million on Spotify... just a 37% of the album’s total streams, 755 million.

Yep, you’re right, a really good example of those I mentioned when one song has 80-90% of an album’s total streams. :lol:
It's not a desperate attempt it's just putting things into perspective. It's OK when your faves have 1-2 huge song(s) that make most of album streams, but it's a fail/bad thing/not really a true show of album's worth when someone you don't like (or don't like as much) has the same thing? Also it has been like a week since the album release. Let Zayn's album have a couple of years then compare percentages. Some songs have been out for a week and you expect them to suddenly have streams of a song that was released months ago? LOL. Go back a week after Joanne's release and PI probably had 80-90% of albums streams, no? There are 27 tracks on this album, for all we know there could be a huge hit there that's gonna be released in the upcoming months. Look at Dua Lipa's New Rules.

Sure the start is bad considering he is popular and has a name to himself, but things can still be turned around. The whole release has been messy as hell and that also impacted things.
You tried to bring Gaga no matter what into the topic just to pick on me... and it backfired.

In fact Joanne is a good example of an album where all the album tracks have good and balanced streaming and the biggest song on the album is only a 37% of the total... which means people listened to the album as a whole. Not just one or two songs.

Try harder next time and actually bring an example that fits the conversation. That was, albums were a single song has the vast majority of the total streams.

I think you didn’t get it and you’re talking about a different thing.
It’s not about the album just being released so the single(s) has, obviously, more streams.
Zayn, like many others, released an album months after one song was a hit, then it’s included in the album and, on 1st week, you can say “the album already has 400-500-700 million streams”. And even the album is certified Gold or Platimum on 1st week with sales of 40k copies because of the past streams of that song (that was already certified as a song because of those streams!).

I’m talking about how “tricky” that system is. For Zayn and everyone else. For God’s sake, I have nothing at all against him. :lol:

Compared to the 90s, as you said, it would be similar to include CD singles’ sales into albums certifications on the pre-digital era... Those singles sales (now streams) would be counted twice. As they’re now. Both for the singles certs and the albums certs.
But it wasn’t like that...

Thankfully, some countries like UK, Germany or Spain have rules against those one hit wonder albums so the streaming numbers reflects the average of the album streams and not an inflated number driven only by one song.

JeyBeMust wrote:
And @nynpho, you says that he is attacking you with a GaGa related preference, but I lately feel like you have bad blood with me or something because you always reply my posts trying to undermine my opinion or my collaborations. Maybe it’s my imagination but I feel like everything that I say it’s not good enough because you always have the last word, it’s how I feel (Sorry If that’s not the case) :cry:
??? :-?
I never had a bad word at you or fight with you at all.
In fact I like your posts and I like to discuss things with you.
The fact that I don’t agree with you regarding your visions on streaming sometimes doesn’t mean I want to undermine what you’re saying...
If you ever feel that way, you can of course talk to me via PM or in here. :wink:
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Postby jjavier1978 » Wed Dec 26, 2018 1:25 pm

WW Spotify:

ICARUS FALLS: 325,345,239 Plays (+217k equivalent album units)
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Postby beredy » Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:42 pm

nympho wrote:
beredy wrote:
nympho wrote:
The desperate attempt to attack me with something Gaga related...

Million Reasons has 282 million on Spotify... just a 37% of the album’s total streams, 755 million.

Yep, you’re right, a really good example of those I mentioned when one song has 80-90% of an album’s total streams. :lol:
It's not a desperate attempt it's just putting things into perspective. It's OK when your faves have 1-2 huge song(s) that make most of album streams, but it's a fail/bad thing/not really a true show of album's worth when someone you don't like (or don't like as much) has the same thing? Also it has been like a week since the album release. Let Zayn's album have a couple of years then compare percentages. Some songs have been out for a week and you expect them to suddenly have streams of a song that was released months ago? LOL. Go back a week after Joanne's release and PI probably had 80-90% of albums streams, no? There are 27 tracks on this album, for all we know there could be a huge hit there that's gonna be released in the upcoming months. Look at Dua Lipa's New Rules.

Sure the start is bad considering he is popular and has a name to himself, but things can still be turned around. The whole release has been messy as hell and that also impacted things.
You tried to bring Gaga no matter what into the topic just to pick on me... and it backfired.

In fact Joanne is a good example of an album where all the album tracks have good and balanced streaming and the biggest song on the album is only a 37% of the total... which means people listened to the album as a whole. Not just one or two songs.

Try harder next time and actually bring an example that fits the conversation. That was, albums were a single song has the vast majority of the total streams.

I think you didn’t get it and you’re talking about a different thing.
It’s not about the album just being released so the single(s) has, obviously, more streams.
Zayn, like many others, released an album months after one song was a hit, then it’s included in the album and, on 1st week, you can say “the album already has 400-500-700 million streams”. And even the album is certified Gold or Platimum on 1st week with sales of 40k copies because of the past streams of that song (that was already certified as a song because of those streams!).

I’m talking about how “tricky” that system is. For Zayn and everyone else. For God’s sake, I have nothing at all against him. :lol:

Compared to the 90s, as you said, it would be similar to include CD singles’ sales into albums certifications on the pre-digital era... Those singles sales (now streams) would be counted twice. As they’re now. Both for the singles certs and the albums certs.
But it wasn’t like that...

Thankfully, some countries like UK, Germany or Spain have rules against those one hit wonder albums so the streaming numbers reflects the average of the album streams and not an inflated number driven only by one song.

JeyBeMust wrote:
And @nynpho, you says that he is attacking you with a GaGa related preference, but I lately feel like you have bad blood with me or something because you always reply my posts trying to undermine my opinion or my collaborations. Maybe it’s my imagination but I feel like everything that I say it’s not good enough because you always have the last word, it’s how I feel (Sorry If that’s not the case) :cry:
??? :-?
I never had a bad word at you or fight with you at all.
In fact I like your posts and I like to discuss things with you.
The fact that I don’t agree with you regarding your visions on streaming sometimes doesn’t mean I want to undermine what you’re saying...
If you ever feel that way, you can of course talk to me via PM or in here. :wink:
I brought up Gaga because I thought it was the best way to make you think about it. Obviously you refuse to get it and that's OK. And I checked Spotify stats and you're clearly wrong and purposefully using wrong numbers.

Icarus Falls currently has about 325.3m streams total, of which Let Me contributes 141.4m (~43,5%) and Entertainer 68.3m (~21%). That means two top tracks make up for about 64.5% of streams. I don't see a single song out of these 27 contributing to 80-90% of streams. In Joanne's case top 2 songs (PI and MR) make up for about 56.1% of albums total streams. It's really not a big difference, especially considering the fact that Joanne has been out for a long time which allowed people to get to know the album and play tracks they liked more which allowed to even the distribution a bit. IF does not have that luxury of time having past yet to allow you to say if it is lopsided on one song or not.

Also you are so intent on making it seem like these songs were tackled on the album just for streams, when from their release they have been touted as singles from his upcoming album:

https://www.officialcharts.com/chart-ne ... me__22508/
https://variety.com/2018/music/news/zay ... 202819770/
(and many more, just Google it)

It's definitely not a QUEEN type of situation where FEFE found its way to album tracklist days after albums release just so they could grab #1. These songs were part of the tracklist since day 1 and have been released as singles from it FFS. Also the streaming system is what it is. Either accept it or don't. If tables were flipped and this was Gaga's new album you wouldn't be saying remove this song to see what the album actually does etc. Again I repeat: be it known I'm not in it for Gaga (frankly my dear, I don't give a damn), I just used her as a sort of comparison because I thought that was the best way for nympho to try and get that he's quite possibly wrong about this. Especially early on like this in the life cycle of an album. But I do now get what JeyBeMust is saying and I have no doubt nympho will try to spin this again into what he seems intent to believe just so he could have the last word on it.
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