Chicago :: Charts & Sales History

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Postby MJDangerous » Sat Dec 06, 2008 5:07 pm

I open this thread because this band is maybe the most undercertified band ever. Expect sales of all their studio albums released from 69 to 75 to be at least 2 times bigger than their certification.

US

Key
year of US release
year of last US certification
title
riaa shipment
peak position
weeks on BB200
soundscan

Studio Albums
1969 1986 Transit Authority - 2,000,000 - 17 171
1970 1991 II - 1,000,000 - 4 134
1971 1986 III - 1,000,000 - 2 63
1972 1986 V - 2,000,000 - 1 x9 51
1973 1986 VI - 2,000,000 - 1 x5 73
1974 1986 VII - 1,000,000 - 1 x1 69
1975 1986 VIII - 1,000,000 - 1 x2 29
1976 1986 X - 2,000,000 - 3 45
1977 1977 XI - 1,000,000 - 6 20
1978 1978 Hot Streets - 1,000,000 - 12 29
1979 1979 13 - 500,000 - 21 10
1980 none XIV - - 71 9
1982 1982 16 - 1,000,000 - 9 38
1984 1997 17 - 6,000,000 - 4 72 - 490,000
1986 1986 18 - 500,000 - 35 45
1988 1989 19 - 1,000,000 - 37 42
1991 none Twenty 1 - - 66 11
1995 none Night And Day - - 90 7
2006 none XXX - - 41 2
2008 none XXXII, Stone Of Sisyphus - - 133 1

Note: Stone Of Sisyphus was recorded in 1994.

Live Albums
1971 1986 At Carnegie Hall - 1,000,000 - 3 46 - 50,000

Compilation Albums
1975 1991 Greatest Hits - 5,000,000 - 1 x5 73 - 1,616,000
1981 none Greatest Hits Vol 2 - - 171 5
1983 1991 If You Leave Me Now - 1,000,000 -
1989 1997 Greatest Hits 82-89 - 5,000,000 - 37 25 - 2,573,000
1997 1997 The Heart Of Chicago 67-97 - 500,000 - 55 27
1998 none The Heart Of Chicago 67-98 Vol 2 - - 154 2
2002 2005 The Very Best Of - 1,000,000 - 38 25
2005 none Love Songs - - 57 4
2007 none The Best Of - - 102 4

Christmas Albums
1998 1999 Christmas Album - 500,000 - 47 7
2003 none Christmas - - 117 3
25 June 2009, the day the Music died
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Postby Dane » Sat Dec 06, 2008 6:57 pm

Thanks! Very succesful band, and strong catalog sales - at least their compilations.

Besides one new compilation they have no new certs since 1997. Many not since 1986. A RIAA update should be interesting.

Personally I was never a fan though...
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Postby MJDangerous » Sat Dec 06, 2008 10:26 pm

Dane wrote:Thanks! Very succesful band, and strong catalog sales - at least their compilations.

Besides one new compilation they have no new certs since 1997. Many not since 1986. A RIAA update should be interesting.

Personally I was never a fan though...
Honestly I never listenned to them :oops:

That's incredible to see how many albums were last certified in 86, before the eligibility of Club/Military sales.

Their RIAA total is outstanding considering how many undercertified albums they have - 37 million.

I think that each of their 8 first albums are over 2.5 million, or at least very close to the mark. "Greatest Hits Vol 2", even if it performed poorly, can't be under the Gold status. '16' and Live At Carnegie Hall are both likely double Platinum. "Greatest Hits" was certified 5xP in 91 - It scanned over 1.6 million copies.
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Postby Dane » Sat Dec 06, 2008 11:00 pm

MJDangerous wrote:
Dane wrote:Thanks! Very succesful band, and strong catalog sales - at least their compilations.

Besides one new compilation they have no new certs since 1997. Many not since 1986. A RIAA update should be interesting.

Personally I was never a fan though...
Honestly I never listenned to them :oops:

That's incredible to see how many albums were last certified in 86, before the eligibility of Club/Military sales.

Their RIAA total is outstanding considering how many undercertified albums they have - 37 million.

I think that each of their 8 first albums are over 2.5 million, or at least very close to the mark. "Greatest Hits Vol 2", even if it performed poorly, can't be under the Gold status. '16' and Live At Carnegie Hall are both likely double Platinum. "Greatest Hits" was certified 5xP in 91 - It scanned over 1.6 million copies.
About GH. How is the 1,616,000 split between the two versions? I never saw a number for the original. I have 1,307,000 from jan06, shortly after the remaster was released in October 2005. But I was never able to update that figure, because I don't know how much came from the original. :-?
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Postby Dane » Sat Dec 06, 2008 11:33 pm

MJDangerous wrote: "Greatest Hits Vol 2", even if it performed poorly, can't be under the Gold status.
Yes how weird that their first GH (69-75) and GH 82-89 both sold over 5,000,000 and GH2 covering the years in between isn't even gold? :o
Granted it covered their least succesful period, but it did cover If You Leave Me Now, one of their biggest hits, a #1 smash from X (1976).

I suppose the compilation titled If You Leave Me Now released the following year stole all the sales. That one included IYLMN as well as some of their earlier hits.
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Postby Basil » Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:26 pm

Carnegie Hall has riaa shipments of only 500,000 under the criteria for 1986
The 50k soundscan covers all versions - 3CD, extended 4CD, plus cassettes and vinyl.


Chicago's old studio albums have not done well in the soundscan era - most of their soundscan sales have been compilations.

Their sales dipped for a few years in the late 70's/early 80's.

1978 - Hot Street - peaked #12 - 1m riaa

1979 - 13 - peaked #21 - 0.5m riaa

1980 - 14 - peaked #71 - 0 riaa

1981 - 15 - peaked #172 - 0 riaa

So no surprise that 15 (GH vol 2) isn't Gold

They had a huge riaa catalogue update in 1986. Sales of their 70's albums would have run their course by then.

After Jan 1991 they still had riaa updates happening on II, IX and XVII for instance.

There is no evidence from soundscan that loads of their studio albums need an update. They would have needed to scan at least 750k since 1991 to update from mainly platinum sales and they haven't.

There is also no evidence about military base or record club sales of studio albums. The big sellers here would be the compilations once again - and these have often been updated since 1991.

As far as the music goes, the first few albums had some decent songs and a great horn section that was different then - but some of it has dated, particularly all the jamming and stuff.

After that they went more and more MOR until they were smack on the white line. Still they sold more records than in the 70's. I'd need to be paid cash to listen to all that MOR stuff.

Fortunately I don't think there are many fans on this forum....

Fair play to them on all those Gold and Platinum albums though.
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Postby MJDangerous » Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:38 pm

Basil wrote:There is no evidence from soundscan that loads of their studio albums need an update. They would have needed to scan at least 750k since 1991 to update from mainly platinum sales and they haven't.
Why 750k? You are missing the fact that they were all certified together in 1986. Most of them look highly likely to have been already pretty close to the next award.

The Plat cert of "II" in 1991 is definitely not comprehensive. It is their best selling studio album after 17.

At Carnegie Hall was certified for a million. It was Gold back in 1971 when multi-discs were certified just like single discs, the same is true in 86.
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Postby Basil » Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:59 pm

MJDangerous wrote:
Basil wrote:There is no evidence from soundscan that loads of their studio albums need an update. They would have needed to scan at least 750k since 1991 to update from mainly platinum sales and they haven't.
Why 750k? You are missing the fact that they were all certified together in 1986. Most of them look highly likely to have been already pretty close to the next award.

Because sales from 1987-1990 aren't soundscan covered, so you need 1m from 1987 to now. Their old studio stuff hasn't sold in those quantities.

Why are they "highly likely" to be close to the next award?
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Postby Basil » Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:05 pm

MJDangerous wrote:
The Plat cert of "II" in 1991 is definitely not comprehensive. It is their best selling studio album after 17.

Ten studio albums were Platinum or higher in 1986. II was only Gold. It was updated in 1991 (with military sales) to only Platinum.

It hasn't sold much since then.
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Postby Basil » Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:13 pm

MJDangerous wrote:
At Carnegie Hall was certified for a million. It was Gold back in 1971 when multi-discs were certified just like single discs, the same is true in 86.
1986 Rules

A Gold certification requires that 250,000 copies be shipped. Also the wholesales value must exceed $2 million.

A Platinum certification requires that 500,000 copies be shipped. Also the wholesale value must exceed $4 million.

So Carnegie Hall is audited for 500,000 sales.

In 1971 when it went "Gold" this was for a wholesale value of only $1 million - the number sold was not a factor until 1975. As a quadruple album it had probably sold less than 200,000 units by that point.

Essentially the update from 1971 to 1986 was from a wholesale value of $1m to $4m.
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Postby MJDangerous » Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:35 pm

Basil wrote:
MJDangerous wrote:
Basil wrote:There is no evidence from soundscan that loads of their studio albums need an update. They would have needed to scan at least 750k since 1991 to update from mainly platinum sales and they haven't.
Why 750k? You are missing the fact that they were all certified together in 1986. Most of them look highly likely to have been already pretty close to the next award.

Because sales from 1987-1990 aren't soundscan covered, so you need 1m from 1987 to now. Their old studio stuff hasn't sold in those quantities.

Why are they "highly likely" to be close to the next award?
Because they all reached Gold very easily and most Plat albums performed just as well as 2xPlat albums, 2xPlat albums that were themself not 'just' at 2 million.

Basil wrote:
MJDangerous wrote:
The Plat cert of "II" in 1991 is definitely not comprehensive. It is their best selling studio album after 17.

Ten studio albums were Platinum or higher in 1986. II was only Gold. It was updated in 1991 (with military sales) to only Platinum.

It hasn't sold much since then.
And why wasn't it updated with others in 86? As I said, it is their second best selling studio album. It was Gold within' 2 months, stayed over 1 year top 20 and 2 years charted.
His initial run is much better than Chicago I, their catalog sales were pretty much equal. Do you honestly believe it hasn't shipped 500k from Apr 1970 to 1986? That's just impossible.

In 1979, when all their albums were updated in Canada (they all performed the same as in the US), their biggest seller was exactly II, tied with Greatest Hits, both at 3xPlatinum.

All sales from Apr 1970 to 1975 are likely missing in the 1991 award. They haven't certified it in 1986 exactly due to it.

At Carnegie Hall wasn't priced as a 4 disc box, just like the 3 first albums (all double albums) were sold at the price of a single disc. At Carnegie Hall was more successful than III and was said to be a million seller in the US years before its Plat cert.
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Postby borderwolf » Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:46 pm

Venezuela
unofficial dvd chart
www.recordland.com

#12 Chicago
Live By Request

#36 Chicago
In Concert
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Postby borderwolf » Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:43 pm

Top Catalog Albums
Week Ending 4/12/09

Wks Rank Scans
On Label 2W LW TW * Artist Title TW LW % RTD

1 RHI 179 CHICAGO BEST OF CHICAGO: 40TH ANNIVERS 1,527 1,307 17 193,013
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Postby borderwolf » Sat May 16, 2009 11:46 am

From ask billboard, 15 may

In terms of overall hit songs on the Billboard Hot 100, Chicago has collected 46, Fleetwood Mac 25. Their top 40 totals stand at 34 for Chicago and 18 for the Mac. Chicago has notched 20 top 10s, Fleetwood Mac nine. Chicago also has more No. 1s, three to one. So, as for hit singles, Chicago wins.

Now let's check each group's album sales since Nielsen SoundScan began tracking data in 1991 (realizing, of course, that the acts released much of their highest-charting product in the '70s and '80s). Since the dawn of the SoundScan era, Chicago has totaled 11.9 million in album sales. Fleetwood Mac has sold 16.6 million. So, going by album sales according to Nielsen SoundScan, Fleetwood Mac wins.

A possible tie-breaker? Fleetwood Mac was enshrined in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in 1998. Despite its immense success, Chicago, surprisingly, has yet to be elected.

When it comes to your bet, I'll diplomatically stand back and let you and your brother interpret the information as you see fit. Fleetwood Mac's most recent Hot 100 entry was, after all, entitled "Peacekeeper."
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Postby borderwolf » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:12 am

U.S.A.

DVD Live In Concert (release date 10/5/2004)
certified Gold 5/15/2009
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Postby NothingFails » Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:42 pm

I don't think Chicago's 70's albums are ever going to have proper recertifications. Columbia distributed those albums during the 70's to 90's, but now Warner has the rights to those albums, so proper audits are probably never gonna happen. Though I do think we could see a 2m cert for Chicago 16, which has always been on Warner.
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Postby borderwolf » Sat Sep 26, 2009 12:51 pm

9/19 chart Top Catalog
(thanks M2M)

22 RHI 133 126 104 CHICAGO BEST OF CHICAGO: 40TH ANNIVERS 1,791 19 1,503 227,524
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Postby borderwolf » Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:25 am

U.S.A.

Chicago, Best of, 40th Anniv.
certified Gold
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Postby journey2010 » Sat Feb 18, 2012 2:54 am

Canada Sales (CRIA)
Very Best of Chicago: 50,000
Chicago: 50,000
Chicago 13: 50,000
Chicago 16: 50,000
Chicago at Carnegie Hall: 50,000
Chicago II: 300,000
Chicago III: 50,000
Chicago IX Greatest Hits: 300,000
Chicago V: 100,000
Chicago VI: 100,000
Chicago VII: 50,000
Chicago VIII: 50,000
Chicago X: 100,000
Chicago XI: 100,000
Greatest Hits 1982-89: 50,000
Hot Streets: 100,000
Transit Authority: 100,000
Total Sales--> 1,500,000

Pretty impressive sales in Canada for Chicago.

UK (BPI) Sales
Complete Greatest Hits 60,000
The Heart of Chicago 300,000
Chicago 17 100,000
Chicago X 60,000
Total Sales: 520,000
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Postby journey2010 » Mon Feb 20, 2012 6:26 pm

2 177 146 CHICAGO CHICAGO IX-CHICAGO'S GREATEST 1683 15 1461 522156
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Postby journey2010 » Thu Mar 22, 2012 2:47 pm

New Release: 1 174 * CHICAGO IF YOU LEAVE ME NOW (AND OTHER 1509 999 3 1512
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Postby journey2010 » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:40 pm

Week of June 23,2012
2 139 61 CHICAGO VERY BEST OF: ONLY THE BEGINNI 2373 42 1673 1115872
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Postby thebigham » Sun Aug 26, 2012 3:52 am

9/1 Catalog charts:

163 CHICAGO BEST OF CHICAGO: 40TH ANNIVERS 1430 +13% 1265 364,293
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Postby journey2010 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:08 pm

Week of December 22, 2012

10 RHI 110 92 91 CHICAGO CHRISTMAS: WHAT'S IT GONNA BE 4,248 13 3,773 273,024

7 RHP 160 152 163 CHICAGO CHICAGO XXXIII: O CHRISTMAS TR 2,261 6 2,125 10,280
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Postby journey2010 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 6:59 pm

US Sales

Key
year of US release
year of most recent RIAA Certification
RIAA Shipment Sales
Soundscan Sales
Due for Certification

Studio Albums
1969 1986 Transit Authority 2,000,000
1970 1991 II 1,000,000
1971 1986 III 1,000,000
1972 1986 V 2,000,000
1973 1986 VI 2,000,000
1974 1986 VII 1,000,000
1975 1986 VIII 1,000,000
1976 1986 X 2,000,000
1977 1977 XI 1,000,000
1978 1978 Hot Streets 1,000,000
1979 1979 13 500,000
1980 none XIV
1982 1982 16 1,000,000
1984 1997 17 6,000,000 490,000
1986 1986 18 500,000
1988 1989 19 1,000,000
1991 none Twenty 1
1995 none Night And Day
1998 1999 Chicago XXV: The Christmas Album 500,000
2003 none Chicago Christmas: Whats it Gonna Be Santa 275,000 (12/2012)
2006 none XXX 32,000 (04/2006)
2008 none XXXII, Stone Of Sisyphus 27,000
2011 O Christmas Tree: Chicago XXXIII 50,000

Live Albums
1971 1986 Chicago at Carnegie Hall 1,000,000 50,000
1999 Chicago XXVI: Live in Concert
2011 Chicago XXXVI: Live in Concert '75

Compilation Albums
1975 1991 Chicago's Greatest Hits 5,000,000 1,310,000 (01/2006), 560,104 (03/2013) Total: 6,870,104
1981 none Greatest Hits Volume 2
1983 1991 If You Leave Me Now 1,000,000
1989 1997 Greatest Hits 82-89 5,000,000 2,573,000
1997 1997 The Heart Of Chicago 67-97 500,000
1998 none The Heart Of Chicago 67-98 Vol 2
2002 2005 The Very Best Of: Only the Beginning 2,000,000 1,307,300 (03/2013)
2005 none Love Songs 53,362
2007 2010 The Best Of 40th Anv. 500,000 375,000 Sep. 2012
2012 If You Leave Me Now (And Other Hits) 102,100 (04/2013)

*Chicago, like many bands in the 60s-70s have a backcatalogue that has not been updated in many years. The majority of their studio albums have not been recertified since 1986. Actual album sales in the United States are most likely around: 45.5 million

RIAA Sales: 38.5 million
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