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Thread: iTunes to close in 2019

  1. #26
    Wayne's Avatar
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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 14:18

    Spotify is vastly superior to iTunes, even if streaming itself really does frustrate me when it comes to charts.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 14:19

    Streaming is the worst thing that ever happened to music.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 15:09

    Quote Originally Posted by Westen
    Streaming is the worst thing that ever happened to music.
    Piracy is the worst thing that ever happened to music, not streaming - piracy getting so big seemed to really speed up the need for digital platforms. And then by the time digital downloads had reached their apex, they were already out of date.

    Streaming is just the natural next step.

    In the same way that tape superseded vinyl, CD superseded tape, digital downloads superseded CD and streaming supersedes digital downloads.

    The cyclical nature of the music industry - consumption just changes.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 15:14

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne
    Quote Originally Posted by Westen
    Streaming is the worst thing that ever happened to music.
    Piracy is the worst thing that ever happened to music, not streaming - piracy getting so big seemed to really speed up the need for digital platforms. And then by the time digital downloads had reached their apex, they were already out of date.

    Streaming is just the natural next step.

    In the same way that tape superseded vinyl, CD superseded tape, digital downloads superseded CD and streaming supersedes digital downloads.

    The cyclical nature of the music industry - consumption just changes.
    I think it's quite opposite, streaming ruined albums, eras, singles.
    There are so many one hit wonders getting hits now, albums can sell nothing and be platinum thanks to 1 single

    It totally ruined perception of success and quality

  5. #30
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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 15:17

    So, streaming ruined charts?

    It certainly didn't ruin music, from a consumer's perspective - for less money than you've ever paid before, you have access to an insane amount of music.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 17:22

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne
    Quote Originally Posted by Westen
    Streaming is the worst thing that ever happened to music.
    Piracy is the worst thing that ever happened to music, not streaming - piracy getting so big seemed to really speed up the need for digital platforms. And then by the time digital downloads had reached their apex, they were already out of date.

    Streaming is just the natural next step.

    In the same way that tape superseded vinyl, CD superseded tape, digital downloads superseded CD and streaming supersedes digital downloads.

    The cyclical nature of the music industry - consumption just changes.
    I disagree, but I think we come to the same conclusion - piracy is the best thing that happened in music imo. It demonstrated that people were not willing to pay the prices expected of them for access to music, and they took matters into their own hands.

    I think it’s incredible the industry didn’t see it coming though, and that it took a technology company (Apple) to reinvigorate the industry. Clearly people didn’t mind paying 79p - £1 for an individual song and having legal ownership of it. Yes, there were still people who thought ‘why pay for something I can still get for free’ but streaming I think has been the best way to convert those folk back to legal consumption of music.

    Streaming only works though because it’s reasonably priced. It is quite possibly the final format of music (where else can they take it?) but needs to retain its low cost pricing structure.

    I am surprised vinyl is making a comeback actually, but I think that’s more of a novelty thing (and an album cover always look much more amazing in a 12” sleeve).

    Streaming has its problems (stupid tags and charts still not getting it quite right) but it’s only become possible because of piracy imo. It’s certainly the best thing to happen to back catalogues - we always hear stories of people moaning (Taylor) about the low returns an act gets, but labels still must be making millions from streams of songs from yesteryear.

    I mean another MJ Greatest Hits album release is overkill at this point, but songs like Billie Jean and Thriller must make more money for labels through streaming than they would by issuing another physical Greatest Hits album.
    SLOW DOWN PAPI... NO MEN IN ME.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 17:27

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne
    So, streaming ruined charts?
    I think so, particularly in the UK where I still don’t feel like they’ve got it right. That whole Ed Sheeran top 10 was a complete fiasco.

    I appreciate the charts - with its flaws - still reflects the most streamed and most purchased music, so technically the chart still identifies the most popular songs.

    But the streaming era changed the chart forever - I always loved the fact the UK’s chart only contained sales and nothing superfluous like radio plays and audiences etc.

    So in many ways, what really ruined the charts is shitty music these teenagers seem to love. I feel so sorry for them, not growing up with quality music like I did (Spice Girls, S Club and Steps, oh my).
    SLOW DOWN PAPI... NO MEN IN ME.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 17:37

    Streaming has done more to destroy the integrity of music than anything else in recent memory.
    Quote Originally Posted by BeeBoy View Post
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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 17:38

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne
    It certainly didn't ruin music, from a consumer's perspective - for less money than you've ever paid before, you have access to an insane amount of music.
    This.

    Streaming is the best thing that has happened to music.

    But

    Albums charts and Certifications are a joke now, because they're mixing things that shouldn't be mixed in the first place, bought music and streamed music.

    They only mixed the two because they didn't want to reform the BB200 and HOT 100 system, no wonder they're a freaking mess now.

    And don't even get me started on certifications, they have never been so useless.

    How I'd solve things

    HOT100 Streams + Airplay
    HOT100 Sales

    BB200 Combined Streams
    BB200 Sales

    And put them on an equal footing for as long as you're able to buy music.
    "King isn't overrated, your fave is just undertalented."

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 17:48

    At the end of the day, the regular listener doesn't care AT ALL about charts, it's all about the perceived impact of the music and the art.
    "King isn't overrated, your fave is just undertalented."

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 17:58

    It would be stupid to close it
    I am not trying to seduce you... Would you like me to seduce you? Is that what you're trying to tell me?

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 18:03

    I don't understand why they would close something that makes them money? Even if the profits are much smaller than they used to be they are still making a profit. What are the overheads for Apple in keeping the iTunes store online? :-?

    Either way, Amazon and Google will sweep up the current customers that still desire downloads if this does happen.

  13. #38
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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 18:47

    It would be a shame if it would close. Streaming still doesn't cover a lot of b-sides, remixes, other material etc. that in some cases iTunes offers, and if not, I just add them from rips of my own CD/vinyl collection.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 18:53

    Quote Originally Posted by JakeP
    Quote Originally Posted by Ink
    I don’t know how it works I’m still old fashion person
    I'm also old fashioned in this respect. I've still not switched to streaming and i much prefer to buy the songs i want to listen to. Maybe Apple should consider a free tier streaming service rather than just expecting everyone to pay £10 a month, especially those of us who aren't able to listen to music all day long.

    So do I, I like to own my music rather than have to connect to wifi etc to 'stream'.
    "What goes around comes back around my baby"

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 18:55

    Quote Originally Posted by Westen
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne
    Quote Originally Posted by Westen
    Streaming is the worst thing that ever happened to music.
    Piracy is the worst thing that ever happened to music, not streaming - piracy getting so big seemed to really speed up the need for digital platforms. And then by the time digital downloads had reached their apex, they were already out of date.

    Streaming is just the natural next step.

    In the same way that tape superseded vinyl, CD superseded tape, digital downloads superseded CD and streaming supersedes digital downloads.

    The cyclical nature of the music industry - consumption just changes.
    I think it's quite opposite, streaming ruined albums, eras, singles.
    There are so many one hit wonders getting hits now, albums can sell nothing and be platinum thanks to 1 single

    It totally ruined perception of success and quality
    I totally agree with you.
    "What goes around comes back around my baby"

  16. #41
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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 19:44

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne
    So, streaming ruined charts?

    It certainly didn't ruin music, from a consumer's perspective - for less money than you've ever paid before, you have access to an insane amount of music.
    Well it did ruin the charts in certain aspects. The following image is for the US.
    When you buy a song, you mainly buy it once, especially online, so mainly when people download 10 songs from an album, they buy the album as a whole or the majority of the said album. While there is no limit when it comes to streaming, and it is not limited which song you streamed how many times. This means that certain acts could only sell like 7000 albums, but because of the Sales plus Streaming system, some acts could add a lot of album sales just on the back of one track.

    You could say that in the past one hit wonders also sold albums on the back of one track. But streaming is a little trickier.

    For example Shawn Mendes. He released his album Illuminate with the hits mercy and Threat You Better, nothing wrong with that. But then did something smart, he added a new song to the album ' There's Nothing Holding Me Back', new music mainly attracts more buyers. The song is not available on a physical edition so far. So people either buy the song separately or stream it. So that adds also to his SPS.

    Fifth Harmony did the same recently by adding their current Pitbull collabo as bonustrack to their album on streaming.

    It gives a very flawed picture, since technically artists could just add a new song every few months to their albums, because of hype get a lot of streams, and get extra certifications, while their album normally wouldn't sell much.

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    by » Sun December 10th, 2017, 20:34

    Streaming ruined pop girls
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    by » Mon December 11th, 2017, 02:03

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugo
    At the end of the day, the regular listener doesn't care AT ALL about charts, it's all about the perceived impact of the music and the art.

    I disagree, it’s part of culture - particularly for teens - to know who is #1 each week. Being #1 is to be perceived as having a good song because it’s clearly connected with the public. I would argue everyone releasing new music would like to see it be #1 still, no matter how much of a realist they are.

    In the US I don’t see the problem with streaming being included in the main chart - the US include airplay audiences which is a stupid idea anyway: being listened to doesn’t mean people like a certain song.

    But in the UK we have always maintained a chart based on pure sales alone, and the result of including streaming means it has completely lost any sort of integrity as far as I’m concerned. The Official Chart Company are making it up as they go along, which is just ridiculous.
    SLOW DOWN PAPI... NO MEN IN ME.

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    by » Mon December 11th, 2017, 02:04

    Quote Originally Posted by spiritboy
    Streaming ruined pop girls

    But a lack of good pop girls ruined pop :evil:
    SLOW DOWN PAPI... NO MEN IN ME.

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    by » Mon December 11th, 2017, 03:48

    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBreakaway
    I can't see it shutting down fully tbh
    Me either, seems way too soon even though music sales are declining so fast...but not that fast I think
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    by » Mon December 11th, 2017, 17:16

    Quote Originally Posted by menime123
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugo
    At the end of the day, the regular listener doesn't care AT ALL about charts, it's all about the perceived impact of the music and the art.

    I disagree, it’s part of culture - particularly for teens - to know who is #1 each week.
    Do you think it's still as big a deal as it was? I don't know whether teens really care anymore/the chart is on their radar. With so many charts floating around it's all a bit confusing anyway.

    I don't see why Apple would kill off a 2bn dollar business model... I still feel like there's a market for downloads despite the decline, there are still a lot of people who want to purchase music to keep.

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    by » Mon December 11th, 2017, 20:08

    I'd say Spotify made the charts slower. It felt like a chore checking out the UK charts in 2016, it was just so slow. People who stream seem to latch onto their favourite songs and refuse to let go for months on end. The end result is songs like Shape of you sticking around and preventing newer music from getting its breakthrough.

    Two things to consider:

    1. The OCC who compile the charts resorting to introducing an acr rule in an attempt to quicken up the charts and make them appear fresher.

    2. The OCC upweight Thursday's streaming data because Spotify can't (???) report the data on time for when the new weekly charts are compiled. I find it hard to believe personally, but alas the OCC in effect make up 1 day of streaming data which is appalling. How can a chart be "accurate" when the OCC are pretty much guestimating the figures?

    I truly believe the UK charts are the most artificial they've ever been.

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    by » Mon December 11th, 2017, 20:14

    Quote Originally Posted by Thriller
    Do you think it's still as big a deal as it was? I don't know whether teens really care anymore/the chart is on their radar.
    You're quite right Thriller, teens have no interest in the charts in the same way i was in the late 90s/early 00s. I loved shows like CD:UK that made the charts seem more like an event. There hasn't been any type of chart show to engage young teenagers. If anything, the closest i can think of was The x factor at its peak when tracks by Bruno Mars and Rihanna were performed by the likes of Matt Cardle and One Direction, and then the songs got a significant boost on iTunes.

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    by » Tue December 12th, 2017, 10:31

    Quote Originally Posted by menime123
    Quote Originally Posted by spiritboy
    Streaming ruined pop girls

    But a lack of good pop girls ruined pop :evil:
    Top 22 of Billboard 200 Albums of the Year are albums by male artists. That's how bad the situation for pop girls.
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    by » Tue December 12th, 2017, 10:51

    Quote Originally Posted by Thriller
    Quote Originally Posted by menime123
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugo
    At the end of the day, the regular listener doesn't care AT ALL about charts, it's all about the perceived impact of the music and the art.

    I disagree, it’s part of culture - particularly for teens - to know who is #1 each week.
    Do you think it's still as big a deal as it was? I don't know whether teens really care anymore/the chart is on their radar. With so many charts floating around it's all a bit confusing anyway.

    I don't see why Apple would kill off a 2bn dollar business model... I still feel like there's a market for downloads despite the decline, there are still a lot of people who want to purchase music to keep.
    For some who doesn't listen radio, they will make use of Spotify's top 50 tracks chart to checkout new music.

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