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Thread: Brunei: gay sex now punishable by death by stoning

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    by » Sat April 6th, 2019, 19:22

    The west (and particularly Europe) is bringing this on itself with this stupid ideology of "oppressors vs. oppressed" that brainwashes people to believe everything that is related to western christian civilization is intrinsically evil. The safest places in the world for anyone who is gay, woman or in any sexual minority are western christian or post-christian countries. Yet we keep blaming on ourselves how our culture is evil and we should get rid of it asap. A conservative christian who holds tradition moral views about sexuality will be harshly criticised, even if he´s not interested in enforcing these views on other people. At the same time, a muslim can have the same views, and even support them to be enforced as law of the land, and get along with it. Because what the west hates at the moment is not homophobia or misoginy itself - is traditional western institutions. But it is these institutions that developed the world where we live in, where it´s relatively safe to be LGBT. That is, until we end up destroyng them.

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    by » Sat April 6th, 2019, 19:58

    Quote Originally Posted by urbanmusik View Post
    Signed, I'm sick of people using religion as an excuse to infringe on people's human rights.



    Dua Lipa's post about this subject is getting so much hate from religious/right-wing people in the comments. I'd say it surprises me, but growing up in an extremely religious community these hate fuelled comments don't phase me at all.
    omg the comments are tragically disgusting. Why are these trash people even following queen of gheys Dual Legend?
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    by » Sat April 6th, 2019, 20:08

    Are you saying that Christianity itself is what led to bigger acceptance of LGBTQ+ are more rights for women? As in Christian culture?
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    by » Sat April 6th, 2019, 20:47

    Quote Originally Posted by Serby View Post
    Are you saying that Christianity itself is what led to bigger acceptance of LGBTQ+ are more rights for women? As in Christian culture?
    As for LGBTQ I don´t think Christianity contributed for its acceptance, but it is certainly not to blame for death penalties. As for women´s right, that´s a modern concept, but I don´t have any doubt that in most places where christianity arrived, the situation of women improved, such as in the Roman Empire. It might not have led to complete equality, but certainly improved their status compared to what it was before. Ideologies and religions don´t exist in a vacuum. They develop from pre-existing ideas and cultures. So it´s not fair to judge a belief system from the past based on today´s ideals of justice. So the question is: did the situation of sexual minorities improved or got worst when a pagan people converted to christianity? And when vast christian areas in North Africa or the Byzantine Empire converted from christianity to Islam, did their situation got better or worst? Similarly, would the situation in countries like Brunei improve or get worst if they receive more influence from western cultures?

    One can argue that some african or asian countires like Brunei only have anti-gay laws because of western colonialism. Surely, these laws are recent, but that doesn´t mean that in the past homossexuality has been accepted in society. The whole concept of "homossexuality" is very recent. Surely, same sex atraction has always existed, but most cultures, western or not, didn´t attach that to a person´s identity. Having sex with someone of the same sex could have been seen as something immoral in some cultures, but would be mostly overlooked as it was considered a one-off excenticity or depravate act. To live in a committed and public relationship with someone of the same gender simply wasn´t an option during most of history. Only when same sex relationships started to gain public recognition recently in western countries, it became a public issue. Prior to that, you didn´t have an identity group of "gays" or "LGBTQ" people, so there was no point on having laws banning that. If there were people having sex with someone of the same gender, it was only a hidden and private act. The whole concept of a person "being gay" (as a public identity) is a recent western invention. What society expected was you married someone of the opposite sex and had a lot of kids. Sexual "preference" was irrelevant, an unknown concept. Even the idea of "gay marriage" is nothing more then extending a traditional western concept (monogamic committed relationship) to same-sex couples. So it makes no sense to talk about gay rights as opposed to "western christian civilization" when in fact, the whole idea of a committed monogamic relationship is itself a product of that culture that LGBTQ people are currently fighting to adapt for themselves. Laws banning LGBTQ "propaganda", like in Russia and some african countries, are mostly a reaction against a perceived influence of western culture. It´s not like prior to those laws homossexuality had a better status in society.

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    by » Sun April 7th, 2019, 12:34

    There should be a push worldwide to ban this discrimination. LGBTQ relationships should be decriminalised through out the globe and there should be a global ban on capital punishment.
    I am glad to see that Global travel agency STA Travel has joined the growing global protest against Brunei’s introduction of the death penalty for gay people, slapping a ban on selling flights on the country’s national airline.

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    by » Sun April 7th, 2019, 12:44

    Quote Originally Posted by aRat View Post
    omg the comments are tragically disgusting. Why are these trash people even following queen of gheys Dual Legend?
    I'm loving her post and it's very brave of her to post this. Albanians don't look at homosexuality in a positive manner at all.

    And joao is mixing up things heavily.

    Quote Originally Posted by joao View Post
    The whole concept of a person "being gay" (as a public identity) is a recent western invention.
    No dude. Being gay isn't a recent western invention. Nobody invented gays. Being comfortable with ones identity and being able to publicly announce it might be the easiest to do currently in western culture, but gay people didn't become invented recently. Such a retarded thing to say. And your whole post is full of similar delusions and wrong connections between what's being discussed.
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    by » Sun April 7th, 2019, 15:13

    Quote Originally Posted by beredy View Post
    I'm loving her post and it's very brave of her to post this. Albanians don't look at homosexuality in a positive manner at all.
    How do you know they are only albanians? The comments and usernames seem all over the place. Also I am pretty sure homosexuality is legeal in both Kosovo and Albania and IIRC they even have civil unions in one of those two.
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    by » Sun April 7th, 2019, 15:28

    Quote Originally Posted by aRat View Post
    How do you know they are only albanians? The comments and usernames seem all over the place. Also I am pretty sure homosexuality is legeal in both Kosovo and Albania and IIRC they even have civil unions in one of those two.
    I'm not saying they're all Albanians (bcs they're obviously not), but it wouldn't be the first time she attracts Albanian trolls (and she is mostly hated by the Serbs who don't need much to attack her, just remember the eagle thing). Also law is one thing, but the practice there is... Lacking. Let's just say that.

    Back in Yugoslavia, homosexuality was decriminalized in 1977 but only in Croatia, Slovenia, Monte Negro and Vojvodina (autonomous part of Serbia). It took until mid 90's for Serbia and B&H to follow the suit (and a lot of it was political trade, not real interest in human rights. Albania (and Kosovo) is much closer to Serbia and B&H when it comes to LGBT. Nominally it's OK, but the practice is much much much worse than in Croatia/Slovenia/Monte Negro (where things are slowly getting better and there's more tolerance and LGBT related activities, but still far from perfect).
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    by » Sun April 7th, 2019, 21:08

    The call to boycott these boujee hotels is ridiculous and seems like celebrities being out of touch with society. Like the GP were gonna go to any of these luxury hotels anyway (I certainly won’t be with the Ł9 in my current account lmao)
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    by » Sun April 7th, 2019, 21:10

    But also I’m glad there seems to be outcry over this. Would be nice if the attention could be echoed for what’s happening in Chechnya or the genocide that’s happening in China that everyone seems to be ignoring
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    by » Mon April 8th, 2019, 15:05

    Actually, to my best knoweldge, sex between two women was always legal in Yugoslavia, only the sex between men was illegal.
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    by » Mon April 8th, 2019, 15:07

    @aRat loads of comments in Albanian are there tho. And sis, laws mean shit in Balkan. Public in general is still very homophobic.
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    by » Mon April 8th, 2019, 15:18

    Quote Originally Posted by Serby View Post
    Actually, to my best knoweldge, sex between two women was always legal in Yugoslavia, only the sex between men was illegal.
    The sex between two women was legally looked at as a misdemeanor, while sex between two men was processed under criminal law.

    You can see here that even some lesbians were charged, even though the majority were men indeed.
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    by » Thu April 11th, 2019, 11:18

    Is there some way I could donate money to help these people? Actually any gay person in one of these deplorable places? I feel like signing this won’t help in any way. I agree with urbanmusik, I’m sick of religion being used in this way and with people getting away with such barbaric behaviour.

    Can you imagine how terrified these people must feel? Can’t even comprehend...it makes me so mad and the mind boggles that this goes on today.

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    by » Fri April 12th, 2019, 00:39

    Imo the best way to donate money is to give it to some reputable LGBTQ+ organisation led by the locals or from the region, this way the you know money will be spent responsibly and efficiently. Will look up if you want!
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    by » Sat April 13th, 2019, 00:35

    Quote Originally Posted by thankfulforkelly View Post
    The call to boycott these boujee hotels is ridiculous and seems like celebrities being out of touch with society. Like the GP were gonna go to any of these luxury hotels anyway (I certainly won’t be with the Ł9 in my current account lmao)
    Some of those hotels aren’t as expensive as you think though, I mean from the list I’ve stayed at Principe Di Savoia in Milan, it’s def not for people on a budget but not a celebrity only hotel either..

    Anyway I have mixed feelings. Yes, it’s good that something is being done...but in the end boycotting these hotels in the US and European countries will only affect the workers there, some of which might really need the $ they make there.

    Also, it’s a bit silly in the way that people seem out of touch with the fact that many other countries already have this law were homosexuality can be punished by death. The UAE for example, but I don’t see people boycotting Dubai...and many people will soon be booking their hotels in Qatar for the World Cup, another country with such law...and doesn’t Qatar own like over half of London now? Even The Shard is theirs. No one is boycotting hotels owned/mostly owned by them...
    So although it’s good something is being done, it’s silly when you look at the big scale and the reality of where this exists..
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    by » Sat April 13th, 2019, 11:55

    Yes there’s contradictory messages going around, but I think it’s the fact that this is happening now and is such a backward step to take. It’s one thing to have always had the law, but something entirely different to create it in 2019. Boycotting the hotels directly impacts those in a position to influence or change the laws. Yes, the hotels have staff and if they lose their jobs it’s sad for them, but look at the alternative - actively supporting people that endorse the murder of people for simply being gay.
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    by » Sat April 13th, 2019, 12:02

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne View Post
    For UK based residents, please see this:



    Please click the above and sign the petition - once it reaches 100,000 signatures, the UK House of Commons will consider it for House debate.
    Up to 85,000 - keep signing!

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    by » Sun May 5th, 2019, 19:37

    The Sultan has relented to international pressure and said that gay people will no longer face the death penalty in Brunei - they will however continue to face imprisonment and torture.

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    by » Sun May 5th, 2019, 20:23

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne View Post
    The Sultan has relented to international pressure and said that gay people will no longer face the death penalty in Brunei - they will however continue to face imprisonment and torture.
    Not even sure this is much better.
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    by » Mon May 6th, 2019, 17:54

    Yeah, this is barely any progress and as someone said, rich Hollywood people can now go unboycott the hotels etc
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